Financial Fair Play
Discussion
jcremonini said:
sleep envy said:
jcremonini said:
The guy has so much money that I suspect if he did sell it, it would be for £1.
I'll have it.Really?
Here's the Forbes valuation of football clubs...
http://www.lfconline.com/feat/ed11/reds_rise_in_fo...
So Chelsea are around £500 mil. So Roman is looking at a half a billion bath 'if' he wanted out.
http://www.lfconline.com/feat/ed11/reds_rise_in_fo...
So Chelsea are around £500 mil. So Roman is looking at a half a billion bath 'if' he wanted out.
London424 said:
Here's the Forbes valuation of football clubs...
http://www.lfconline.com/feat/ed11/reds_rise_in_fo...
So Chelsea are around £500 mil. So Roman is looking at a half a billion bath 'if' he wanted out.
What do you get for your £500m?http://www.lfconline.com/feat/ed11/reds_rise_in_fo...
So Chelsea are around £500 mil. So Roman is looking at a half a billion bath 'if' he wanted out.
Cobham training ground
Stamford Bridge? I thought that was owned by the fans and can't be sold? Or is that just the pitch?
The players contracts - how is this calculated? If they are amortised then they are worth considerably less every year. I suppose you may make some profit on selling a few players?
The club runs at a loss (or a very small profit), so any revenue is swallowed up by player's wages etc?
Doesn't seem like a great business deal to me - how would you ever make any money? Just sit on it and hope that someone else sees some value in it a few years down the road? It's not like United, where you just sit back and count all the money coming in, like the Glazers.
It's like going onto Dragon's Den and valuing your company at £500m.......there are £200m of fast depreciating assets and the company runs at a loss every year.....I've had to put a billion pounds of my own money into it just to keep it afloat.....sounds like a great investment opportunity....
So 4 less players in their European squad and 17m to cough up as a fine.
Mmmmm, to me that seems like a good deal for City.
Mmmmm, to me that seems like a good deal for City.
BBC said:
"Manchester City have been fined £49m, £32m of which is suspended, and can only name a 21-man Champions League squad next season after failing Uefa financial fair play rules.
Paris St-Germain, one of eight other teams to breach the rules, have been handed a similar punishment to the Premier League champions.
City have agreed to "significantly limit" transfer spending for the next two years in a settlement with Europe's governing body.
Clubs who breached the rules had to reach a deal with Uefa, which City have done, or else take it to an adjudicatory panel in June.
The other clubs guilty of breaking the rules were Russian sides Zenit St Petersburg, Rubin Kazan and Anzhi Makhachkala, Turkish clubs Galatasaray, Bursaspor and Trabzonspor and Bulgarian club Levski Sofia.
More to follow.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27445475Paris St-Germain, one of eight other teams to breach the rules, have been handed a similar punishment to the Premier League champions.
City have agreed to "significantly limit" transfer spending for the next two years in a settlement with Europe's governing body.
Clubs who breached the rules had to reach a deal with Uefa, which City have done, or else take it to an adjudicatory panel in June.
The other clubs guilty of breaking the rules were Russian sides Zenit St Petersburg, Rubin Kazan and Anzhi Makhachkala, Turkish clubs Galatasaray, Bursaspor and Trabzonspor and Bulgarian club Levski Sofia.
More to follow.
Edited by BlackLabel on Friday 16th May 20:23
Edited by BlackLabel on Friday 16th May 20:23
BlackLabel said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27445475
It does...a net spending cap of £49mil on transfers this when you have a sEdited by BlackLabel on Friday 16th May 20:23
Edited by BlackLabel on Friday 16th May 20:23
t load of surplus players you can shift is hardly going to trouble them. The 21 player cap if it still includes 8 homegrown players is meaningful I think....probably has implication for the likes of Lescott and Barry and who they try and buy.
RedTrident said:
Would have liked to see them get a zero transfer budget plus sales instead of 49 million plus sales. Most teams won't be spending 49 million net on incoming players this summer. Weak decision all said and done, more an inconvenience than a punishment.
I wouldn't even say it was an inconvenience. They sell some players, buy a few in. They should've been given a full transfer ban for 2 years So basically a team can cheat, breaking the rules, win the premiership, and only get a bit of a financial slap.....?
Yet when a team tiny team in desperate trouble seeks to go into administration to protect the club from it creditors, and stopping it going out of business, it gets points deducted that mean the financial penalty is very harsh (demotion, usually).
Doesn't seem 'just' to me....
Yet when a team tiny team in desperate trouble seeks to go into administration to protect the club from it creditors, and stopping it going out of business, it gets points deducted that mean the financial penalty is very harsh (demotion, usually).
Doesn't seem 'just' to me....
TTmonkey said:
So basically a team can cheat, breaking the rules, win the premiership, and only get a bit of a financial slap.....?
Yet when a team tiny team in desperate trouble seeks to go into administration to protect the club from it creditors, and stopping it going out of business, it gets points deducted that mean the financial penalty is very harsh (demotion, usually).
Doesn't seem 'just' to me....
Yep. It's not even a financial slap to the Petro-Dollar clubs. On top of the £500m you need to spend on players, you also need to pay a 10% Yet when a team tiny team in desperate trouble seeks to go into administration to protect the club from it creditors, and stopping it going out of business, it gets points deducted that mean the financial penalty is very harsh (demotion, usually).
Doesn't seem 'just' to me....
The ONLY punishment that will have any effect (if they truly believe in the FFP cause) is to ban them from European Club competition the following season. If you over-spend and breach FFP, the you will not play in Europe (CL) the following season - therefore there is no point in breaking FFP as there is nothing to be gained by it. By "the following year" it should be suspended until you qualify - so that you can't spend a fortune and avoid punishment simply by not being very good.
However, I believe that UEFA will NEVER ban any of the clubs from the major leagues (Eng, Spa, Ger, Fra etc) because they have already sold future TV deals to these countries. For example, TF1 paying millions for TV coverage, only to be told that their biggest club, PSG, won't be appearing....
Also consider all the sponsorship deals too. IMHO, UEFA had the opportunity with these first transgressions to show that they had teeth and that FFP was to be taken seriously. They blinked.
TEKNOPUG said:
IMHO, UEFA had the opportunity with these first transgressions to show that they had teeth and that FFP was to be taken seriously. They blinked.
To blink means you have your eyes open.....UEFA seem to have had their eyes shut firmly in this whole episode. Not that that surprises me.
Right, stall set out. I'm a City fan.
Show me another industry where someone invests heavily in an ailing venture which has several well established competitors in the market who are considered the elite in that industry, and they get punished? Like it or not misty eyes past dwellers, football is a business primarily these days. Man City sure as he'll didn't start this trend though.
The established elite clubs have been pushing transfer fees and wages up for decades. Where were UEFA when clubs were doing this, and even 'mega' clubs were taking on risky finance situations in order to do so?
I could understand it if the loudest complainants of City's rise would bother looking in to where the money has actually gone. Yes, plenty in playing staff, but the regeneration of a whole compass point in a big city is remarkable. The foundations are being put in place to develop one of the elite sporting facilities on the planet. Young players being signed are being enrolled in some of the best education establishments in the area. Measures are being put in place to try and avoid the next Meppen-Walter situation, although that is never completely avoidable.
The teams below the 1st team are awash with very talented young footballers, and we're just starting to see them come through. I can see a squad in 5-7 years containing at least 50% academy products with the odd talent parachuted in to fill a gap.
Some will stick their fingers in their ears and do the whole 'la la la' thing, and they do seem to be from certain clubs. Not particularly manyoo funnily enough. The ironic thing being that some of those same clubs have created unfair advantages for themselves in the past, which have conveniently been forgotten. Where it was money driven, the sums were much lower but still relatively big for the time. As I said earlier, City didn't create the runaway inflation in football, but merely joined the bandwagon.
Show me another industry where someone invests heavily in an ailing venture which has several well established competitors in the market who are considered the elite in that industry, and they get punished? Like it or not misty eyes past dwellers, football is a business primarily these days. Man City sure as he'll didn't start this trend though.
The established elite clubs have been pushing transfer fees and wages up for decades. Where were UEFA when clubs were doing this, and even 'mega' clubs were taking on risky finance situations in order to do so?
I could understand it if the loudest complainants of City's rise would bother looking in to where the money has actually gone. Yes, plenty in playing staff, but the regeneration of a whole compass point in a big city is remarkable. The foundations are being put in place to develop one of the elite sporting facilities on the planet. Young players being signed are being enrolled in some of the best education establishments in the area. Measures are being put in place to try and avoid the next Meppen-Walter situation, although that is never completely avoidable.
The teams below the 1st team are awash with very talented young footballers, and we're just starting to see them come through. I can see a squad in 5-7 years containing at least 50% academy products with the odd talent parachuted in to fill a gap.
Some will stick their fingers in their ears and do the whole 'la la la' thing, and they do seem to be from certain clubs. Not particularly manyoo funnily enough. The ironic thing being that some of those same clubs have created unfair advantages for themselves in the past, which have conveniently been forgotten. Where it was money driven, the sums were much lower but still relatively big for the time. As I said earlier, City didn't create the runaway inflation in football, but merely joined the bandwagon.
tamore said:
Right, stall set out. I'm a City fan.
Show me another industry where someone invests heavily in an ailing venture which has several well established competitors in the market who are considered the elite in that industry, and they get punished? Like it or not misty eyes past dwellers, football is a business primarily these days. Man City sure as he'll didn't start this trend though.
The established elite clubs have been pushing transfer fees and wages up for decades. Where were UEFA when clubs were doing this, and even 'mega' clubs were taking on risky finance situations in order to do so?
I could understand it if the loudest complainants of City's rise would bother looking in to where the money has actually gone. Yes, plenty in playing staff, but the regeneration of a whole compass point in a big city is remarkable. The foundations are being put in place to develop one of the elite sporting facilities on the planet. Young players being signed are being enrolled in some of the best education establishments in the area. Measures are being put in place to try and avoid the next Meppen-Walter situation, although that is never completely avoidable.
The teams below the 1st team are awash with very talented young footballers, and we're just starting to see them come through. I can see a squad in 5-7 years containing at least 50% academy products with the odd talent parachuted in to fill a gap.
Some will stick their fingers in their ears and do the whole 'la la la' thing, and they do seem to be from certain clubs. Not particularly manyoo funnily enough. The ironic thing being that some of those same clubs have created unfair advantages for themselves in the past, which have conveniently been forgotten. Where it was money driven, the sums were much lower but still relatively big for the time. As I said earlier, City didn't create the runaway inflation in football, but merely joined the bandwagon.
It doesn't matter what you say about regeneration none of that expenditure counted against you. Show me another industry where someone invests heavily in an ailing venture which has several well established competitors in the market who are considered the elite in that industry, and they get punished? Like it or not misty eyes past dwellers, football is a business primarily these days. Man City sure as he'll didn't start this trend though.
The established elite clubs have been pushing transfer fees and wages up for decades. Where were UEFA when clubs were doing this, and even 'mega' clubs were taking on risky finance situations in order to do so?
I could understand it if the loudest complainants of City's rise would bother looking in to where the money has actually gone. Yes, plenty in playing staff, but the regeneration of a whole compass point in a big city is remarkable. The foundations are being put in place to develop one of the elite sporting facilities on the planet. Young players being signed are being enrolled in some of the best education establishments in the area. Measures are being put in place to try and avoid the next Meppen-Walter situation, although that is never completely avoidable.
The teams below the 1st team are awash with very talented young footballers, and we're just starting to see them come through. I can see a squad in 5-7 years containing at least 50% academy products with the odd talent parachuted in to fill a gap.
Some will stick their fingers in their ears and do the whole 'la la la' thing, and they do seem to be from certain clubs. Not particularly manyoo funnily enough. The ironic thing being that some of those same clubs have created unfair advantages for themselves in the past, which have conveniently been forgotten. Where it was money driven, the sums were much lower but still relatively big for the time. As I said earlier, City didn't create the runaway inflation in football, but merely joined the bandwagon.
You have spent extravagantly over the last few seasons - nearly £400m net spend in 5 years. It is an arm's race and you have taken it to new heights.
Edited by markh1973 on Saturday 17th May 17:54
markh1973 said:
It doesn't matter what you say about regeneration none of that expenditure counted against you.
You have spent extravagantly over the last few seasons - nearly £400m net spend in 5 years. It is an arm's race and you have taken it to new heights.
I didn't say the regen did count against us, but nor has it counted for us, which I think is wrong.You have spent extravagantly over the last few seasons - nearly £400m net spend in 5 years. It is an arm's race and you have taken it to new heights.
Edited by markh1973 on Saturday 17th May 17:54
As for the spend, yes it's a lot of money, but we just joined in the madness. New heights? Check our record signing.
"In normal circumstances, the club would wish to pursue its case and present its position through every avenue of recourse. However, our decision to do so must be balanced against the practical realities for our fans, for our partners and in the interests of the commercial operations of the club."
Never has "We have not got a leg to stand on" been expressed in so many words.
"practical realities for our fans"
What are these practical realities they are so concerned about pray tell ?
Never has "We have not got a leg to stand on" been expressed in so many words.
"practical realities for our fans"
What are these practical realities they are so concerned about pray tell ?
Edited by Gandahar on Saturday 17th May 21:54
Gandahar said:
"In normal circumstances, the club would wish to pursue its case and present its position through every avenue of recourse. However, our decision to do so must be balanced against the practical realities for our fans, for our partners and in the interests of the commercial operations of the club."
Never has "We have not got a leg to stand on" been expressed in so many words.
I heard that as City can afford the very best lawyers, the case ( if gone to court ) would have dragged on for years. Ultimately there was a fair chance that City would have won.Never has "We have not got a leg to stand on" been expressed in so many words.
Imagine how this would have gone down so it seems to me that City have shown the right attitude again.
This is why the settlement has no real effect, this time.
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