The Official Chelsea Thread [Vol 2]

[Challo]

bodhi said:

DeltonaS said:

Good article ?? from the NOT SO independent Chelsea community weaintgotnohistory.sbnation.com.....


"Chelsea's loan army, by the way, is now thirty-three players strong, the largest its ever been (to keep track of them all, the always-excellent @chelseayouth created this unique Google Map).

There has been a bit of grumbling about Chelsea's innovation with regards to the loan system, but there is no question that it benefits all parties involved.

When a young player signs for Chelsea and is then sent on loan, he receives a massive wage increase and is provided with the opportunity to earn first-team football that just isn't possible at Stamford Bridge, where each of the eleven starters is an established star, both at the club level and on the international stage.

The loaning club gets the services of a talented young player that it wouldn't have otherwise been able to sign, and Chelsea gets help in developing their talented (and cost-effective) young players."

"There's no question it benefits all parties involved"....Bullst ofcourse.

It only benefits Chelsea. Take Piazon as an example he signes for Chelsea but is on loan for 4 years for 4 different clubs, went form Portugal, to Vitesse, to Frankfurt, and now to Reading; first of all, whats he doing in the Championship at Reading after the Bundesliga and the Dutch Eredivisie, makes no sence; dumped by Chelsea. Secondly he gets a new country, playing style, coach, language, living environment, etc.etc. every year without having a say in it. And without ever playing 1 minute for Chelsea. Yes, he probably gets a decent salary but from a career perspective, as a youngster, he would be better of at 1 club only for a number of years where he can play each week and grow and develop as a player.

Another exaple; the Dutch side Vitesse, a Chelsea branch, gets on average 3 to 4 young talented Chelsea players a year (eg. Traore last season), just 1 year, then their taken away, add a few transfers and Vitesse is forced to start every season at 0. Consequence; first of all it means distortion of the Dutch Leaque. Secondly Vitesse played Southampton in the EL playoffs, 1st match of the season, lots of (Chelsea)talent on the pitch, but a completey new squad, never played with eachother therefore lost without chance. But Chelsea isn't interested in Vitesse's elimination, nor in the Dutch leaque.

Chelsea has 1 aim; is not even interested in the 33 talents they have either; their interest lies in the 1 a year that they can add to their own squad; this year Traore. Therby avoiding a)huge transfer fees for talent and b) Financial Fair Play.

If Chelsea wants to develop young talent; they should do it in their own youth academy.

The UEFA should maximize the number of players on loan per club.

I know, silly me - posting an article from a Chelsea fan site on a Chelsea thread. It's almost I was expecting it to be of interest to Chelsea fans, not bitter trolls from rival clubs.

I'm pretty sure Chelsea's interest lies in affording these young players some playing time and experience of different leagues to see how they develop - those who are first team material join up with the first team squad (Traore, RLC), those that don't get sold, often at a tidy profit (Lukaku, De Bruyne). The clubs taking the loan player on gain a player at a much reduced cost, and the player gets a chance to play and develop better than they would in Chelsea Reserves or rotting on the bench. Sounds like a win win to me.

The thing you have to bear in mind as well, is that in order to have 33 players out on loan, there have to be other clubs out there who see what we are doing and would like to take advantage. As we have 33 out on loan now, there doesn't seem to be a shortage of such clubs.

I suppose the question then must come is why aren't these players breaking into Chelsea's first team? The amount on loan must develop into one or two that can make the step up? I know Zouma is coming through now but anyone else?

Its the same at all the top premier league clubs. Hoover up the talent, loan them out and they hope that one or two make it.

[bodhi]

m3sye said:

I am not sure his reply comes across as a troll at all, comes across without a different view point which makes a discussion ???

That reply not so much, his previous one? Pretty sure posting on a club thread that we support a "terrible club" could be seen as trolling.

[GarryDK]

Challo said:

I know Zouma is coming through now but anyone else?

Courtois is probably the biggest star from the "loan army". Its a form of business from Chelsea, buy players for £2-4 mil loan them for a few years, if they prove themselves then great if they dont sell them at a profit. You'll have 1 or 2 that wont get a profit but all in all it works. I'm not saying I agree with it but you cant argue with the results.

[DeltonaS]

bodhi said:

I know, silly me - posting an article from a Chelsea fan site on a Chelsea thread. It's almost I was expecting it to be of interest to Chelsea fans, not bitter trolls from rival clubs.

You don't get it do you. Does a Chelsea fan site post independent, objective info on Chelsea ?? does it respresent a fair reflection of reality. No ofcourse not, it's Chelsea's reality, or more appropriate: Chelski propaganda.

bodhi said:

I'm pretty sure Chelsea's interest lies in affording these young players some playing time and experience of different leagues to see how they develop - those who are first team material join up with the first team squad (Traore, RLC),

Thats obvious, but is in the interest, mid and long term of the players as well ? all 33 of them, or just Traore (which by the way will spend a lot of time on the bench this season).

bodhi said:

those that don't get sold, often at a tidy profit (Lukaku, De Bruyne). The clubs taking the loan player on gain a player at a much reduced cost, and the player gets a chance to play and develop better than they would in Chelsea Reserves or rotting on the bench. Sounds like a win win to me.

DeBruyne is a good example, but not from your point of view that is. He was a first squad player already at Chelsea but wanted to leave himself because he did not get enough playing time. Did so at Wolfsburg and skyrocketed; now he's Chelsea material, but plays for City.

Their are lot's of examples of former Chelsea and City loaners that would've been better off as part of a club on a wage which gives them time to develop, instead of get dragged through Europe on loan deals in Chelsea's interest first and foremost.

bodhi said:

The thing you have to bear in mind as well, is that in order to have 33 players out on loan, there have to be other clubs out there who see what we are doing and would like to take advantage. As we have 33 out on loan now, there doesn't seem to be a shortage of such clubs.

First of all Vitesse doesn't really have a choice, it's owned by Chelsea. Secondly those other clubs just fill in their own gaps in the squad and ofcourse they get some advantage out if it. But in the end it's just a good way for Chelsea to avoid paying transfer fees to these same clubs and to dodge FFP rules.

Edited by DeltonaS on Friday 4th September 11:03

[bodhi]

DeltonaS said:

First of all Vitesse doesn't really have a choice, it's owned by Chelsea. Secondly those other clubs just fill in their own gaps in the squad and ofcourse they get some advantage out if it. But in the end it's just a good way for Chelsea to avoid paying transfer fees to these same clubs and to dodge FFP rules.

Vitesse aren't owned by Chelsea? Might be owned by one of Abramovich's mates but that's hardly the same thing. Plus, in the case of Arnheim, not long after they started taking people from Chelsea's loan army they made European Competition for the first time in 10 years, I'd hardly say that it's doing them much harm.

De Bruyne was an interesting case - obviously a talented player but showed no appetite whatsoever to fight for his place in the team. That attitude doesn't go down too well at our club (especially with the current manager) so he was sold at a tidy profit to Wolfsburg - a side where he could rightfully expect to walk into the first team. If the loan system hadn't been in place, I doubt he would have even got a chance to show he didn't have the right attitude.

However, having a moan that someone on a Chelsea thread thought an article from a Chelsea fansite might be of interest really is a bit on the silly side. If it was a general football thread then fine, but this isn't.

[DeltonaS]

bodhi said:

DeltonaS said:

First of all Vitesse doesn't really have a choice, it's owned by Chelsea. Secondly those other clubs just fill in their own gaps in the squad and ofcourse they get some advantage out if it. But in the end it's just a good way for Chelsea to avoid paying transfer fees to these same clubs and to dodge FFP rules.

Vitesse aren't owned by Chelsea? Might be owned by one of Abramovich's mates but that's hardly the same thing. Plus, in the case of Arnheim, not long after they started taking people from Chelsea's loan army they made European Competition for the first time in 10 years, I'd hardly say that it's doing them much harm.

Your right Vitesse isn't officially owned by Chelsea. UEFA does not allow any owner to own multiple clubs in Europe for obvious reasons. But the accusation has been made multiple times in the Dutch media. The Dutch FA even conducted an investigation regarding Vitesse ownership; the outcome was they found no evidence of a direct relationship between Vitesse and Chelsea. But it's Russian owned (a friend of Abramovich), have problems meeting FFP rules and get mutiple Chelsea and only Chelsea players on loan every year; you do the math.

bodhi said:

However, having a moan that someone on a Chelsea thread thought an article from a Chelsea fansite might be of interest really is a bit on the silly side. If it was a general football thread then fine, but this isn't.

My moaning was mainly pointed at the list of players Chelsea had on loan throughout Europe (I knew they had a few but not 33!) and subsequently the good talking and reasons the rose tinted article gave, while ignoring the negative side effects for these talents and European Football in general.

Edited by DeltonaS on Friday 4th September 11:05

[DeltonaS]

"PFA chief Gordon Taylor accuses Chelsea of 'warehousing' players"

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/pfa-chief-gordon-taylor-a...

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-ne...

"Taylor said: “It’s a bit of a worry with so many Chelsea players out on loan. It’s almost a warehousing of players. You wonder whether it brings into question the integrity of the various competitions."

It's taking place already; see Vitesse.

Edited by DeltonaS on Saturday 5th September 12:15

[968]

DeltonaS said:

"PFA chief Gordon Taylor accuses Chelsea of 'warehousing' players"

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/pfa-chief-gordon-taylor-a...

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-ne...

"Taylor said: “It’s a bit of a worry with so many Chelsea players out on loan. It’s almost a warehousing of players. You wonder whether it brings into question the integrity of the various competitions."

It's taking place already; see Vitesse.

Edited by DeltonaS on Saturday 5th September 12:15

Good for him. Now where's his comment about other PL teams who do the same

[DeltonaS]

968 said:

Good for him. Now where's his comment about other PL teams who do the same

True, to some extent. But Chelsea (and to my suprise Juventus) have mastered it, but Arsenal have quit a few as well.

Most other PL teams, or European teams for that matter, do not use loan deals as extensively, and as part of their business case as Chelsea does. It's a clever, very cost effective way to outplay Europe, the one who dominates Europe's talent pool, dominates the future. Get them before the rest of Europe gets them. It's a slipperly slope, even more slippery when clubs actively involve themselves in other European teams, as Chelsea certainly does with Vitesse.

Vitesse benefits from it mid-term by getting some of Europe's/worlds finest talents (Traore, Piazon, etc ) but at the same time loses out becuase it only benefits from them 1 season. By the time these talents get productive the season is over, or regarding the Soupthampton EL game (short-term) are out of Europe before they get to "know" each other.

Another "funny" side effect by the way (shamefull is a better word), is that Vitesse currently have more English players in their squad than some PL teams have.....

[sleep envy]

Herzog & de Meuron has created a model and more detailed visuals of its new £500 million stadium for Chelsea FC.

These show for the first time the stadium in its entirety, revealing a perfectly circular oculus above the pitch, emerging from an uneven exoskeleton of brick ribs.

The Swiss architect, which is working with Stamford Bridge masterplanner Lifschutz Davidson Sandilands, said it was inspired by the gothic architecture of Westminster Abbey, which once owned the site, and by the brickwork of Fulham’s Victorian terraced streets.

The premiership club has again not issued official press images but BD went to the public consultation, held in a dark, blue-spotlit room.

After the first consultation, 92% of the 1,250 respondents said they supported the plans which would expand capacity from 42,000 to 60,000.

The scheme would create a single, unified stadium where there are currently several disconnected stands. It would also slightly expand the constrained site by decking over the adjacent railway line.

[Black can man]

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premie...



This cannot be good, i bet theres a few people at the club keeping fingers & toes crossed,


She really is a hottie isn't she.

[hornetrider]

Black can man said:

She really is a hottie isn't she.

I thought you were talking about this:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-32270...


Look at his face!

Conversation before they left the house:

Maureen: You're not going out dressed like that, I'm Jose fking Mourinho and you're my daughter
Daughter: fk off Dad I'll dress how I want! You can't stop me! I want to get in the jungle and shag John Terry!
Maureen:

[Black can man]

Crikey !

[blue al]

http://www.bdonline.co.uk/herzog-and-de-meuron-rev...

Not sure if much thought has be given to growing the grass,
Looks like a very tall roof line to me, all those flying ribs are adding cost and complexity
Which look fantastic on a desk top model, but not visible from the floor outside the stadium so what's the point

So we back to the 3 pitches a season Routine
Just so some architect gets to wave his todger"

Cut the roof down and pogba would be free with the money saved it's a no brainer to me

[TwigtheWonderkid]

Tibo out for at least 4 months, knee surgery required following training ground injury!

FFS!!!!

[jammy_basturd]

Bego really isn't having much luck with his retirement!

[m3sye]

Black can man said:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premie...



This cannot be good, i bet theres a few people at the club keeping fingers & toes crossed,


She really is a hottie isn't she.

Not your usual type BCM - thought that was old birds with massive tits

[Black can man]

TwigtheWonderkid said:

Tibo out for at least 4 months, knee surgery required following training ground injury!

FFS!!!!

Bet this has gone down well with the Roman & Jose get together chat .

[MiniMan64]

Good start for new FF goalkeeper Begovic...

[968]

Christ we are ste. What has happened to Ivan? He's totally lost it. At least Matic has cut the deficit a bit but at the moment I can't see where a win will come from.