Discussion
If the conviction is upheld I think he should have his PFA status rescinded if he hasn't already and shouldn't be allowed to play professional football.
If I was a convicted rapist I would lose my professional status and I woul dbe looking for a papper round or i'd be cleaning windows. His profession should have no effect on sentence or consequence imho.
However, if the sentence is quashed then it should be treated like other miscarriages of justice and there should be a further enquiry into the victims' statements and supporting evidence.
If I was a convicted rapist I would lose my professional status and I woul dbe looking for a papper round or i'd be cleaning windows. His profession should have no effect on sentence or consequence imho.
However, if the sentence is quashed then it should be treated like other miscarriages of justice and there should be a further enquiry into the victims' statements and supporting evidence.
over_the_hill said:
However, this is not necessarily true. Do your time and return to life - yes. But not necessarily the 'same' life.
If he was a Doctor or working in the medical profession would he be allowed to return to his former job - probably not.
If he was a teacher or working in education would he be allowed to return to his former job - probably not.
If he was a Social Worker or similar profession would he be allowed to return to his former job - probably not.
So there should be no expectation that life continues exactly as it did before.
My bold ... the whole point is he is none of those things, he is a sportsman paid to kick a pig's bladder around for a few hours a week. He's not in charge of anybody young and/or vulnerable. I read some hogwash in the Guardian on Saturday that he should be ostracised "because footballers do work in the community with young children". Simple answer - if people don't like him doing that, don't involve him in it, it's not mandatory. If he was a Doctor or working in the medical profession would he be allowed to return to his former job - probably not.
If he was a teacher or working in education would he be allowed to return to his former job - probably not.
If he was a Social Worker or similar profession would he be allowed to return to his former job - probably not.
So there should be no expectation that life continues exactly as it did before.
People continually roll out the "footballers are role models" line. Really? Seriously, if people are bringing up a kid today and their role model is a League One footballer with a predilection for going twos up with his mate on a girl they've met in a takeaway then they should go away and have a long hard look at their approach to parenting.
I am genuinely interested in what his personal video statement this week will say. At the moment I think Evans is pretty dislikable pondlife who treats women badly but, as Gordon Taylor of the PFA said, if you have a justice system that punishes, then you must have one that allows rehabilitation after serving that punishment, including a return to one's previous life. He's done his time and although we, the good citizens of the interweb might not like him very much, he has paid a heavy price. Do we have to keep on punishing him? How long for?
Quite how he will achieve his desired return to playing successfully is beyond me though. 90 minutes of 'RAPIST! RAPIST!' barracking evey game will be tough for him to ride out. Honestly don't think he's appreciates how difficult that will be even if his conviction is overturned, noting the obvious wealth that he will recover if he does return to playing.
Edited by PurpleTurtle on Monday 20th October 13:47
PurpleTurtle said:
People continually roll out the "footballers are role models" line.
Footballers can become role models, but they do not do so by simply kicking a ball.
Football fans understand that their "heroes" have feet of clay and will happily concede that point if asked. Exhibit 1 - Luis Suarez - fantastic player, but with a screw loose, as most 'pool fans would be happy to accept. John Terry - great player, but too many "incidents" to be a role model.
Kids also have a greater sense of morality than adults often realise. They know right from wrong and no kid will go around believing that what Evans is alleged to have done is in anyway "right". There is no chance of Evans being seen as a role model with opposing fans pointing out his misdemeanours so mercilessly.
Bluebarge said:
Nom de ploom said:
His profession should have no effect on sentence or consequence imho.
That contradicts your first paragraph.Nom de ploom said:
Bluebarge said:
Nom de ploom said:
His profession should have no effect on sentence or consequence imho.
That contradicts your first paragraph.He's already lost 2 1/2 years of his life and earnings for 30 mins of stupidity (although I still fear there's more to this than we're seeing)
Again, the girl never said he raped her, really odd.
I think much of the vitriol about this rather sad individual is because he has had some limited success as a footballer and has the ability to earn a very nice living, he was apparently earning £20k a week, just over a million a year basic, before he was jailed. If he had been playing in the lower leagues for Smalltown Utd and earning £50k a year this wouldn't even be in the papers.
Plenty of other very high profile sportsmen have committed morally offensive acts and crimes in the past and been able to resume there careers. Yes he's a low life slime ball and rightly or wrongly he was found guilty and has served his time, but surely that's now the end of it. As others have said he will get a very hard time from the crowds and opposition players trying to wind him up if he does play again.
Plenty of other very high profile sportsmen have committed morally offensive acts and crimes in the past and been able to resume there careers. Yes he's a low life slime ball and rightly or wrongly he was found guilty and has served his time, but surely that's now the end of it. As others have said he will get a very hard time from the crowds and opposition players trying to wind him up if he does play again.
I don't disagree that if you have served your time then society says you have paid your debt as punishment but his criminal record should stick with him.
If you were a doctor convicted of rape or an accountant you would be struck off and lose your professional status - I think the same should happen here and he should lose his PFA pro licence.
If I had been convicted of rape I wouldn't pass a CRB check and wouldn;t be able to work in my current industry. I wouldn't be able to work with vulnerable people or children and it would affect my career beyond being in jail for 2 and a half years.
its an interesting case given the circumstances.
I recall being at headingley years ago when Booby Goulding had just been accused of DV. We abused him from teh south stand for 80 minutes (he was a saints player at the time) and he missed the match winning kick at the end of the game. I'm not sure Evans would want to return to the game unless the conviction was totally quashed.
its not like the odd dodgy bet and you get rapped on the knuckles...
If you were a doctor convicted of rape or an accountant you would be struck off and lose your professional status - I think the same should happen here and he should lose his PFA pro licence.
If I had been convicted of rape I wouldn't pass a CRB check and wouldn;t be able to work in my current industry. I wouldn't be able to work with vulnerable people or children and it would affect my career beyond being in jail for 2 and a half years.
its an interesting case given the circumstances.
I recall being at headingley years ago when Booby Goulding had just been accused of DV. We abused him from teh south stand for 80 minutes (he was a saints player at the time) and he missed the match winning kick at the end of the game. I'm not sure Evans would want to return to the game unless the conviction was totally quashed.
its not like the odd dodgy bet and you get rapped on the knuckles...
Nom de ploom said:
I don't disagree that if you have served your time then society says you have paid your debt as punishment but his criminal record should stick with him.
If you were a doctor convicted of rape or an accountant you would be struck off and lose your professional status - I think the same should happen here and he should lose his PFA pro licence.
If I had been convicted of rape I wouldn't pass a CRB check and wouldn;t be able to work in my current industry. I wouldn't be able to work with vulnerable people or children and it would affect my career beyond being in jail for 2 and a half years.
its an interesting case given the circumstances.
I recall being at headingley years ago when Booby Goulding had just been accused of DV. We abused him from teh south stand for 80 minutes (he was a saints player at the time) and he missed the match winning kick at the end of the game. I'm not sure Evans would want to return to the game unless the conviction was totally quashed.
its not like the odd dodgy bet and you get rapped on the knuckles...
I think that's more to do with the venerability of the people you work with though. If you're doctor you shouldn't be in a position of trust if you've proven yourself to be untrustworthy.If you were a doctor convicted of rape or an accountant you would be struck off and lose your professional status - I think the same should happen here and he should lose his PFA pro licence.
If I had been convicted of rape I wouldn't pass a CRB check and wouldn;t be able to work in my current industry. I wouldn't be able to work with vulnerable people or children and it would affect my career beyond being in jail for 2 and a half years.
its an interesting case given the circumstances.
I recall being at headingley years ago when Booby Goulding had just been accused of DV. We abused him from teh south stand for 80 minutes (he was a saints player at the time) and he missed the match winning kick at the end of the game. I'm not sure Evans would want to return to the game unless the conviction was totally quashed.
its not like the odd dodgy bet and you get rapped on the knuckles...
This guy is not a role model to millions, he's a footballer, for an average team.
ascayman said:
The other thing here is that this guy has shown absolutely no remorse whatsoever.
I find myself inexplicably defending this guy somehow, but the fact the girl never called him a rapist, who does he show remorse to? The police? The girl? Even though she's not complained?What if
He was innocent, or he truly believes he's innocent. I'm pretty sure if i'd been stitched up for something I never did, I certainly wouldn't show remorse.
That's my sticking point in this.
I know a jury found him guilty, but I just don't see it in this case. He was found guilty on the basis of no evidence other than the statement of a girl who said she can't remember anything.
The fact they were so blasé about the whole arrest etc doesn't strike me as the actions of two guilty men trying to hide their innocence.
Of course he may well be as guilty as hell.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Anyone who claims footballers are role models needs to be a better parent.
My kids admire certain footballers for their ability to play football. But are fully aware that a few of the ones they admire are f
king horrid human beings.
This 1000%My kids admire certain footballers for their ability to play football. But are fully aware that a few of the ones they admire are f
king horrid human beings.dirty boy said:
Nom de ploom said:
If you were a doctor convicted of rape or an accountant you would be struck off and lose your professional status - I think the same should happen here and he should lose his PFA pro licence.
I think that's more to do with the vulnerability of the people you work with though. If you're doctor you shouldn't be in a position of trust if you've proven yourself to be untrustworthy.This guy is not a role model to millions, he's a footballer, for an average team.
He's not in a position of trust with women anymore than (say) a builder is really. Yes, his fame as a player will attract women but then any other 'handsome' rapist will attract young women.
He's also on the sex-offenders register now.
dirty boy said:
I find myself inexplicably defending this guy somehow, but the fact the girl never called him a rapist, who does he show remorse to? The police? The girl? Even though she's not complained?
What if
He was innocent, or he truly believes he's innocent. I'm pretty sure if i'd been stitched up for something I never did, I certainly wouldn't show remorse.
That's my sticking point in this.
I know a jury found him guilty, but I just don't see it in this case. He was found guilty on the basis of no evidence other than the statement of a girl who said she can't remember anything.
The fact they were so blasé about the whole arrest etc doesn't strike me as the actions of two guilty men trying to hide their innocence.
Of course he may well be as guilty as hell.
This aligns with my view.What if
He was innocent, or he truly believes he's innocent. I'm pretty sure if i'd been stitched up for something I never did, I certainly wouldn't show remorse.
That's my sticking point in this.
I know a jury found him guilty, but I just don't see it in this case. He was found guilty on the basis of no evidence other than the statement of a girl who said she can't remember anything.
The fact they were so blasé about the whole arrest etc doesn't strike me as the actions of two guilty men trying to hide their innocence.
Of course he may well be as guilty as hell.
hornetrider said:
I know a jury found him guilty, but I just don't see it in this case. He was found guilty on the basis of no evidence other than the statement of a girl who said she can't remember anything.
This isn't true. There is corroboration, his account, to co-accused's account (regardless of admissibility) etc. It doesn't matter about other occupations, his is one in which in which he is able to return.
ascayman said:
dirty boy said:
He was found guilty on the basis of no evidence other than the statement of a girl who said she can't remember anything.
There has to be more to it than that. https://www.crimeline.info/case/r-v-ched-evans-che...
What's frightening and should make every man wake to on a night out..if you are to have sex with a girl, you need to be sure a jury won't decide you took every precaution to ensure the girl was "not too drunk" to give consent.
Dangerous ground for a verdict to be based upon....
judge said: ".... [the complainant] was in no position to form a capacity to consent to sexual intercourse, and you, when you arrived, must have realised that."
That's one huge mother f
king assumption for a judge to make, given so many variables in the state of mind a drunk person can go through.As I say, it's a strange case. Reading that timeline makes me feel he's innocent. Something must have happened in court, perhaps his personality was unsettling towards the jury (shady looking f
ker).I don't know.
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