The Official Liverpool FC Thread [Vol 9]
Discussion
So how does a novice like Sherwood make such a huge difference at Villa in such a short time, when a highly rated by everyone (except some of us) manager like BR can't seem to do anything in any time span less than 6 months? And even then it hasn't lasted. How can he be highly rated when he clearly can't motivate a decent bunch of professionals (allegedly!) to play together and put in a performance with fight and pride.
Hopeless. I said our season was over after the Utd match and it is. Over.
Hopeless. I said our season was over after the Utd match and it is. Over.
I manage an under-14's side which are doing quite well. I'm obviously not in the same league as BR but I think he's getting the basics badly wrong. Two things today...
1. At least three changes in formation today. It's too often; almost seems like he's listened to someone who's told him he hasn't got a Plan B or a Plan C and he's made his mind up and said "I'll show them I can change!". It's too much for players and his subs today were very puzzling.
2. Even at under-14's, if you bring on a player to do a job, at least give him the time to do the job. I brought on a left midfielder today with 15 minutes to go specifically to raid down the left wing and attack the right back who was tiring. He didn't do much of that to be honest but he did score me the winner.
But what is the point of bringing Lambert on for one minute plus stoppage time? The poor bloke hasn't got the opportunity to do that, no wonder he is so ineffective for you. With five minutes maximum to shine, there's the chance he might not even touch the ball.
And with all due respect to BR who is far more qualified than I am, those judgements are not ones I would even think of at our level. It's almost too much tinkering, a criticism that Rafa was crucified for at times yet BR today showed he can be far worse and not even tinker positively.
1. At least three changes in formation today. It's too often; almost seems like he's listened to someone who's told him he hasn't got a Plan B or a Plan C and he's made his mind up and said "I'll show them I can change!". It's too much for players and his subs today were very puzzling.
2. Even at under-14's, if you bring on a player to do a job, at least give him the time to do the job. I brought on a left midfielder today with 15 minutes to go specifically to raid down the left wing and attack the right back who was tiring. He didn't do much of that to be honest but he did score me the winner.
But what is the point of bringing Lambert on for one minute plus stoppage time? The poor bloke hasn't got the opportunity to do that, no wonder he is so ineffective for you. With five minutes maximum to shine, there's the chance he might not even touch the ball.
And with all due respect to BR who is far more qualified than I am, those judgements are not ones I would even think of at our level. It's almost too much tinkering, a criticism that Rafa was crucified for at times yet BR today showed he can be far worse and not even tinker positively.
Flip Martian said:
So how does a novice like Sherwood make such a huge difference at Villa in such a short time, when a highly rated by everyone (except some of us) manager like BR can't seem to do anything in any time span less than 6 months? And even then it hasn't lasted. How can he be highly rated when he clearly can't motivate a decent bunch of professionals (allegedly!) to play together and put in a performance with fight and pride.
Hopeless. I said our season was over after the Utd match and it is. Over.
With us under Moyes a lot of it was HIS mindset. The job was too big for him and he set us up not to lose, he was petrified of it. That filtered down to the team and they were scared of doing something wrong and so played safe, sideways and nervously and got picked off.Hopeless. I said our season was over after the Utd match and it is. Over.
Could the same be said of Bodge?
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I can understand that - we had that with Hodgson. Well they had a winning mindset last season. They went for the jugular often and passed the ball with conviction. Why its all gone this time I don't know. Can't JUST be down to the Bitey One leaving.... A good manager and team should adjust.
GloverMart said:
I manage an under-14's side which are doing quite well. I'm obviously not in the same league as BR but I think he's getting the basics badly wrong. Two things today...
1. At least three changes in formation today. It's too often; almost seems like he's listened to someone who's told him he hasn't got a Plan B or a Plan C and he's made his mind up and said "I'll show them I can change!". It's too much for players and his subs today were very puzzling.
2. Even at under-14's, if you bring on a player to do a job, at least give him the time to do the job. I brought on a left midfielder today with 15 minutes to go specifically to raid down the left wing and attack the right back who was tiring. He didn't do much of that to be honest but he did score me the winner.
But what is the point of bringing Lambert on for one minute plus stoppage time? The poor bloke hasn't got the opportunity to do that, no wonder he is so ineffective for you. With five minutes maximum to shine, there's the chance he might not even touch the ball.
And with all due respect to BR who is far more qualified than I am, those judgements are not ones I would even think of at our level. It's almost too much tinkering, a criticism that Rafa was crucified for at times yet BR today showed he can be far worse and not even tinker positively.
Can't really disagree. WTF was Lambert meant to do. Desperate. Nothing more.1. At least three changes in formation today. It's too often; almost seems like he's listened to someone who's told him he hasn't got a Plan B or a Plan C and he's made his mind up and said "I'll show them I can change!". It's too much for players and his subs today were very puzzling.
2. Even at under-14's, if you bring on a player to do a job, at least give him the time to do the job. I brought on a left midfielder today with 15 minutes to go specifically to raid down the left wing and attack the right back who was tiring. He didn't do much of that to be honest but he did score me the winner.
But what is the point of bringing Lambert on for one minute plus stoppage time? The poor bloke hasn't got the opportunity to do that, no wonder he is so ineffective for you. With five minutes maximum to shine, there's the chance he might not even touch the ball.
And with all due respect to BR who is far more qualified than I am, those judgements are not ones I would even think of at our level. It's almost too much tinkering, a criticism that Rafa was crucified for at times yet BR today showed he can be far worse and not even tinker positively.
Flip Martian said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I can understand that - we had that with Hodgson. Well they had a winning mindset last season. They went for the jugular often and passed the ball with conviction. Why its all gone this time I don't know. Can't JUST be down to the Bitey One leaving.... A good manager and team should adjust.
This'll cheer you all up.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Tribal Chestnut said:
Funkstar De Luxe said:
Is this 1985?! People still steal wheels? Looks like it would be a difficult job too, not a lot of space in the lock up. b
ds.
I'm blaming my sisters boyfriend. He's a scouser.ds.RedTrident said:
Bodge will never manage at this level again. He's had 3 seasons, did he not have a 3 season plan? He'll be leaving a team that is worse than the one he inherited.
He'll be on a flight to Boston before a single penny is spent in the transfer window.
Who was in the envelopes?He'll be on a flight to Boston before a single penny is spent in the transfer window.
Hysteria to one side, it is all depressing.
And what is depressing is not the loss today, it is the fact that we are about par for what we are spending.
Money is king in English football. We spend the 5th largest amount of money - and we are getting what we pay for.
Contrary to what RT says on here I am no great defender of Rodgers - he is cringeworthy at times. But we can't call this season a "disaster" - its a disappointment, a disaster would be 12th and no cup runs.
Our season was mapped out in the transfer window. How much of that is down to Rodgers? I would suspect a lot less than he would like to admit publicly. I can't see FSG changing the their core ethos so this is how it's going to be. There'll be the odd spike up and down but money will win out.
Players will leave but it won't be because of Rodgers it will be because they will get more money elsewhere.
And what is depressing is not the loss today, it is the fact that we are about par for what we are spending.
Money is king in English football. We spend the 5th largest amount of money - and we are getting what we pay for.
Contrary to what RT says on here I am no great defender of Rodgers - he is cringeworthy at times. But we can't call this season a "disaster" - its a disappointment, a disaster would be 12th and no cup runs.
Our season was mapped out in the transfer window. How much of that is down to Rodgers? I would suspect a lot less than he would like to admit publicly. I can't see FSG changing the their core ethos so this is how it's going to be. There'll be the odd spike up and down but money will win out.
Players will leave but it won't be because of Rodgers it will be because they will get more money elsewhere.
5th highest spenders maybe - but that should still mean we have a team capable of winning cup ties against "weak" teams (although in practice we were the weak team). It should ACTUALLY mean we're capable of top 4 - upsets happen a lot especially in the early season - and where were we? Hopeless until after xmas. I expected us to lose today. I really did. I have no faith in that team at the moment - someone needs to lick them into shape or ship some out and get better in.
desolate said:
Hysteria to one side, it is all depressing.
And what is depressing is not the loss today, it is the fact that we are about par for what we are spending.
Money is king in English football. We spend the 5th largest amount of money - and we are getting what we pay for.
Contrary to what RT says on here I am no great defender of Rodgers - he is cringeworthy at times. But we can't call this season a "disaster" - its a disappointment, a disaster would be 12th and no cup runs.
Our season was mapped out in the transfer window. How much of that is down to Rodgers? I would suspect a lot less than he would like to admit publicly. I can't see FSG changing the their core ethos so this is how it's going to be. There'll be the odd spike up and down but money will win out.
Players will leave but it won't be because of Rodgers it will be because they will get more money elsewhere.
But Rodgers is part of the problem off the pitch as well no?And what is depressing is not the loss today, it is the fact that we are about par for what we are spending.
Money is king in English football. We spend the 5th largest amount of money - and we are getting what we pay for.
Contrary to what RT says on here I am no great defender of Rodgers - he is cringeworthy at times. But we can't call this season a "disaster" - its a disappointment, a disaster would be 12th and no cup runs.
Our season was mapped out in the transfer window. How much of that is down to Rodgers? I would suspect a lot less than he would like to admit publicly. I can't see FSG changing the their core ethos so this is how it's going to be. There'll be the odd spike up and down but money will win out.
Players will leave but it won't be because of Rodgers it will be because they will get more money elsewhere.
It would seem that Balotelli was foisted upon Rodgers by FSG. What other manager could you see having that happen to them? If FSG don't respect him enough to not do things like that then he is essentially a head coach and not a manager.
desolate said:
Players will leave but it won't be because of Rodgers it will be because they will get more money elsewhere.
The only bit of your post I'd take issue with is this. Goes without saying you'd get more money to pay in wages if you qualified every single year for the CL. Surely that's down to Rodgers? Flip Martian said:
5th highest spenders maybe - but that should still mean we have a team capable of winning cup ties against "weak" teams (although in practice we were the weak team). It should ACTUALLY mean we're capable of top 4 - upsets happen a lot especially in the early season - and where were we? Hopeless until after xmas. I expected us to lose today. I really did. I have no faith in that team at the moment - someone needs to lick them into shape or ship some out and get better in.
I can agree with that.i won't shed any tears if Rodgers goes.
I would be surprised if it makes any difference to the outcome unless we spend big. We may get lucky and buck the trend but countless clubs have shown that the managerial merry go round makes no difference to the eventual outcome.
A "proven winner" of a manager won't come unless we back it with the finances. If FSG will do that then fair enough - if not its just another roll of the dice.
desolate said:
I can agree with that.
i won't shed any tears if Rodgers goes.
I would be surprised if it makes any difference to the outcome unless we spend big. We may get lucky and buck the trend but countless clubs have shown that the managerial merry go round makes no difference to the eventual outcome.
A "proven winner" of a manager won't come unless we back it with the finances. If FSG will do that then fair enough - if not its just another roll of the dice.
Didn't you just spend 120 million? Id say that's backing the manager.i won't shed any tears if Rodgers goes.
I would be surprised if it makes any difference to the outcome unless we spend big. We may get lucky and buck the trend but countless clubs have shown that the managerial merry go round makes no difference to the eventual outcome.
A "proven winner" of a manager won't come unless we back it with the finances. If FSG will do that then fair enough - if not its just another roll of the dice.
I don't think our spending is that bad. And I agree with FSG's idea to incentivise, rather than pay big bucks in wages. 5th highest spending should NOT translate to "5th in the Prem and no higher". Might not get us a title or a top 2, but we should still be capable of CL. Too many signings last Summer have fallen short. I'm not an expert - I can't say if that's all down to BR or not.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I think lots of managers would have that problem.There is a small group of managers who say "my way or no way". My argument is to get one of the "proven winners" FSG will have to change their ethos and splash the cash. I doubt they would do that, and I doubt they would change there management structure.
We spent big this summer, but it's big money compared to what has gone before, not compared to the new reality.
So in 3 seasons Rodgers has done below par, better than par and par. So he is far from a disaster.
Who'll get us in the top 4 consistently whilst spending significantly less than 4 other clubs?
London424 said:
Didn't you just spend 120 million? Id say that's backing the manager.
We did. We also sold our best player.UTD replaced us in the top 4 this year - they spent loads more and have a massively larger wage bill.
I don't want to get into the net spend/gross spend argument. But over time the top 6 clubs are more or less where they should be. UTD had a shocker last season and Liverpool were inspired (for 36 games)! Normal service resumed this year and UTD ensured that by howitzer spending on salaries and transfers. They have been shocking for half the season but have quality experienced players who have seen them through and are now off and running despite yesterday.
And as for Rafa - he is a fine man but let's not forget he thought Gareth Barry was better then Xavi Alonso
desolate said:
And as for Rafa - he is a fine man but let's not forget he thought Gareth Barry was better then Xavi Alonso
What is often forgotten is that in the season Rafa was coming to that conclusion, Xabi was having a stinker. He had a great season the season before - and in his LAST season, he played well again. But at that point, he was having a slump. At least, that's my memory. Mind you, there are other things you can fault Rafa for...Gassing Station | Football | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff