The Official Liverpool FC Thread [Vol 9]
Discussion
RedTrident said:
Rafa is proven at punching above his weight. The main excuse here is that if you're the 5th highest spender then don't expect to finish above 5th. Rafa finished higher than his spending record and won cups.
The manager we need must be able to compete in spite of having teams around him be able to spend more than him. Rafa achieved this at both Liverpool and Valencia. This is what is currently going on with Athletico Madrid and Klopp has done this several times also.
Rodgers is just a bad experiment. He's out of his depth and got a footballing lesson from Aston Villa and the master tactician Tim Sherwood.
That ist true RT. When Rafa was manager we had 3 or 4th biggest budget, he basically performed normally. What changed it was Man City replaced us in the top 4The manager we need must be able to compete in spite of having teams around him be able to spend more than him. Rafa achieved this at both Liverpool and Valencia. This is what is currently going on with Athletico Madrid and Klopp has done this several times also.
Rodgers is just a bad experiment. He's out of his depth and got a footballing lesson from Aston Villa and the master tactician Tim Sherwood.
DSLiverpool said:
Good article online in the mirror today analysing the whole scenario. Can't link sorry but gist was so many of yesterday's squad are leaving or past it they were it capable of being motivated and were not really rebuilding until next season as so many poor buys need replacing.
It also covered the "invincible'" effect a confident charismatic manager can bring to a failing squad perfectly - for now Sherwood has it , I dont think Bren ever had it as last season it was Suarez giving the otters a hard on end our good run this season was luck, style and better coaching but that came unstuck and confidence drained.
I think Bren has took us as far as the transfer committee, FSG and his talent will allow - I don't think many / any can take us further but a stronger proven man can rule the place in a better manner and change these things I am sure.
think this is the articleIt also covered the "invincible'" effect a confident charismatic manager can bring to a failing squad perfectly - for now Sherwood has it , I dont think Bren ever had it as last season it was Suarez giving the otters a hard on end our good run this season was luck, style and better coaching but that came unstuck and confidence drained.
I think Bren has took us as far as the transfer committee, FSG and his talent will allow - I don't think many / any can take us further but a stronger proven man can rule the place in a better manner and change these things I am sure.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/tactic...
Just saw on the BBC gossip column the headline "Falcao agent contacts Liverpool".
It made me chuckle but also was a sad reality that Gossip columns concerning Liverpool nowadays seem content to be linking high profile duds, is now the reputation Liverpool has garnered for itself.
There is a lot of talk about changing the manager. One thing for sure, is that Liverpool / FSG has to change is it's transfer ethos. Taking too many punts on potential is certainly not the way forward and certainly not £20m punts.
It made me chuckle but also was a sad reality that Gossip columns concerning Liverpool nowadays seem content to be linking high profile duds, is now the reputation Liverpool has garnered for itself.
There is a lot of talk about changing the manager. One thing for sure, is that Liverpool / FSG has to change is it's transfer ethos. Taking too many punts on potential is certainly not the way forward and certainly not £20m punts.
Lovren and Lallana weren't potential though. Both were established in the Prem and have misfired badly. Why? God knows. Sturridge and Balotelli were both gambles when they were signed - Sturridge came good and prospered with the faith shown in him but has proven fragile; Balotelli is clearly a law unto himself. We don't just sign prospects. We just have a fairly lousy transfer record in recent years.
I think Lallana has shown enough potential to succeed, he has been unlucky with injuries. Don't know what has happened with Lovren, but think he will stay and succeed next season.
Rumour yesterday that MS will be allowed to go to Germany. I hope not, we need to keep him.
Mario will go. DS I don't think will ever last a full season, he is just too fragile. We need at lest one top, experienced in the PL, striker in the summer. I think we should look at getting a couple of players like Milner, who have played in the PL all their career and have that experience to help and improve the team, albeit in the short term.
Rumour yesterday that MS will be allowed to go to Germany. I hope not, we need to keep him.
Mario will go. DS I don't think will ever last a full season, he is just too fragile. We need at lest one top, experienced in the PL, striker in the summer. I think we should look at getting a couple of players like Milner, who have played in the PL all their career and have that experience to help and improve the team, albeit in the short term.
Well after spending the best part of £200 yesterday for the first time in his 3 years BR has lost me - I actually fully believe this will be it for him, I do not believe for one second that FSG will accept this season as anything other than a massive failure. One thing that is screaming out to me at the moment with BR in charge is how easily we fold in the big game, Last year (Chelsea and Palace) This year UTD ARSENAL,BASEL, VILLA
Our CM is as poor as I have ever seen it, Everyone needs to remember Gerrard for what he was not what he is now - the guy is done and its a shame to now see him getting stick, at one point yesterday Can Broke got passed 2 players then got tackled 10 yards outside the villa box, Gerard was right next to him, they broke and can managed to get back to tackle on the edge of our box - where was SG , 5 yards over the half way line 'trying' to get back - the game totally pass by all 3 CM's - our suppose best CM player yesterday was Henderson - his best quality if you ask anyone is his 'engine' thats just not good enough.
The johnson sub baffled everyone - its a semi final ffs -, go for it, put Borini on - then Lambert , why even buy him if you trust him that little
Thoroughly long and disappointing day
Our CM is as poor as I have ever seen it, Everyone needs to remember Gerrard for what he was not what he is now - the guy is done and its a shame to now see him getting stick, at one point yesterday Can Broke got passed 2 players then got tackled 10 yards outside the villa box, Gerard was right next to him, they broke and can managed to get back to tackle on the edge of our box - where was SG , 5 yards over the half way line 'trying' to get back - the game totally pass by all 3 CM's - our suppose best CM player yesterday was Henderson - his best quality if you ask anyone is his 'engine' thats just not good enough.
The johnson sub baffled everyone - its a semi final ffs -, go for it, put Borini on - then Lambert , why even buy him if you trust him that little
Thoroughly long and disappointing day
type-r said:
Just saw on the BBC gossip column the headline "Falcao agent contacts Liverpool".
It made me chuckle but also was a sad reality that Gossip columns concerning Liverpool nowadays seem content to be linking high profile duds, is now the reputation Liverpool has garnered for itself.
There is a lot of talk about changing the manager. One thing for sure, is that Liverpool / FSG has to change is it's transfer ethos. Taking too many punts on potential is certainly not the way forward and certainly not £20m punts.
The sad reality is that is all £20m gets you now, a punt. Even Torres & Suarez were punts when we paid £20m+ for them. Yes you get some working out but they are in the minority. Proven quality now costs £40m minimum & even then it's not guaranteed to work out straight away, or be a good fit (Di Maria & Mangala spring to mind). What £40m gets you is an increased chance of it working out.It made me chuckle but also was a sad reality that Gossip columns concerning Liverpool nowadays seem content to be linking high profile duds, is now the reputation Liverpool has garnered for itself.
There is a lot of talk about changing the manager. One thing for sure, is that Liverpool / FSG has to change is it's transfer ethos. Taking too many punts on potential is certainly not the way forward and certainly not £20m punts.
Sanchez was the one that got away unfortunately. His work ethic & will to win is something clearly lacking in our team without Suarez. We had the basis of a good squad after last year, we didn't need to add so much quantity, just quality.
The hangers on who will just never be good enough need to be cut as well, just take a loss and get rid of them (Aspas, Borini, Coates, Alberto etc)
Edited by Sargeant Orange on Monday 20th April 10:02
Edited by Sargeant Orange on Monday 20th April 10:03
SydneyBridge said:
Yes - quite well thought out for the Mirror The lack of success in the big games belies a lack of belief from within the team I think.
As highlighted above - last season at Palace, Chelsea etc, this season, Arsenal, Basel, now Villa.
Games that in the main we should have been winning, but someone somewhere lost their bottle.
I agree that at this point i've lost faith in Rogers.
So..... Rafa or Klopp?
As highlighted above - last season at Palace, Chelsea etc, this season, Arsenal, Basel, now Villa.
Games that in the main we should have been winning, but someone somewhere lost their bottle.
I agree that at this point i've lost faith in Rogers.
So..... Rafa or Klopp?
m3sye said:
Well after spending the best part of £200 yesterday for the first time in his 3 years BR has lost me - I actually fully believe this will be it for him, I do not believe for one second that FSG will accept this season as anything other than a massive failure. One thing that is screaming out to me at the moment with BR in charge is how easily we fold in the big game, Last year (Chelsea and Palace) This year UTD ARSENAL,BASEL, VILLA
Our CM is as poor as I have ever seen it, Everyone needs to remember Gerrard for what he was not what he is now - the guy is done and its a shame to now see him getting stick, at one point yesterday Can Broke got passed 2 players then got tackled 10 yards outside the villa box, Gerard was right next to him, they broke and can managed to get back to tackle on the edge of our box - where was SG , 5 yards over the half way line 'trying' to get back - the game totally pass by all 3 CM's - our suppose best CM player yesterday was Henderson - his best quality if you ask anyone is his 'engine' thats just not good enough.
The johnson sub baffled everyone - its a semi final ffs -, go for it, put Borini on - then Lambert , why even buy him if you trust him that little
Thoroughly long and disappointing day
Sorry you had a crap day Sye, I felt it in my water and I normally like a day out but didn't fancy this. See my comments above, I think BR and FSG cannot go any further without a rethink and I doubt that rethink would include BR.Our CM is as poor as I have ever seen it, Everyone needs to remember Gerrard for what he was not what he is now - the guy is done and its a shame to now see him getting stick, at one point yesterday Can Broke got passed 2 players then got tackled 10 yards outside the villa box, Gerard was right next to him, they broke and can managed to get back to tackle on the edge of our box - where was SG , 5 yards over the half way line 'trying' to get back - the game totally pass by all 3 CM's - our suppose best CM player yesterday was Henderson - his best quality if you ask anyone is his 'engine' thats just not good enough.
The johnson sub baffled everyone - its a semi final ffs -, go for it, put Borini on - then Lambert , why even buy him if you trust him that little
Thoroughly long and disappointing day
DSLiverpool said:
Sorry you had a crap day Sye, I felt it in my water and I normally like a day out but didn't fancy this. See my comments above, I think BR and FSG cannot go any further without a rethink and I doubt that rethink would include BR.
I have to agree Dave - always been a supporter and I do believe in time he maybe able to do something as a manager - I just think maybe his time at Liverpool is now coming close to an end - we cannot be a club where he continues to keep learning and making mistakes - some of them yesterday and in the summer are inexcusable .I will support him till the end of the season but if FSG do get rid and bring someone else in (proven) then he will get my full support.
I just cannot see them staying with him if we dont get top 4, especially after removing the legend Kenny after winning a cup
We have six PL games left and we have to hold onto 5th and win as many of those games. We also have to consider the Europa League as a good thing
I don't think BR will be sacked before the start of next season, I think he is still part of the long term plans of the owners.
I do think he will be given minimal money in the summer, and he needs to really show in the next 6 games that he can stick to his plan (assuming he has a plan...) and we have to win at least 4 of those 6 games.
losing yesterday would have been a bit more acceptable if we had played well and been beaten by the better side. Villa were the better side but we just weren't there at all. BR is vastly more experienced that Sherwood so should have won that battle, but lost it big time. and then some of the crap he come out with afterwards, being overwhelmed etc... what a load of rubbish
I don't think BR will be sacked before the start of next season, I think he is still part of the long term plans of the owners.
I do think he will be given minimal money in the summer, and he needs to really show in the next 6 games that he can stick to his plan (assuming he has a plan...) and we have to win at least 4 of those 6 games.
losing yesterday would have been a bit more acceptable if we had played well and been beaten by the better side. Villa were the better side but we just weren't there at all. BR is vastly more experienced that Sherwood so should have won that battle, but lost it big time. and then some of the crap he come out with afterwards, being overwhelmed etc... what a load of rubbish
m3sye said:
I do believe in time he maybe able to do something as a manager - I just think maybe his time at Liverpool is now coming close to an end - we cannot be a club where he continues to keep learning and making mistakes - some of them yesterday and in the summer are inexcusable .
I will support him till the end of the season but if FSG do get rid and bring someone else in (proven) then he will get my full support.
I just cannot see them staying with him if we dont get top 4, especially after removing the legend Kenny after winning a cup
Agree with that, sadly. Very peed off.I will support him till the end of the season but if FSG do get rid and bring someone else in (proven) then he will get my full support.
I just cannot see them staying with him if we dont get top 4, especially after removing the legend Kenny after winning a cup
Cie said:
Somehow you've made me feel bad about being glad you're not in the final.
haha dont worry about it CIE - part of football, you just hope that on a day like that the players turn up - they didnt but it left me asking myself - did they not just turn up or actually a lot of these players not good enough for LFC - Our future captain is Henderson - best quality anyone will ever tell you he has is his Engine - sorry that is not good enough for us. We need this summer - GK to challenge, CB, RB - AM, DM , FW X2 - you would not think after spunking 120m last summer 6 players would be needed - Going to be a big test of FSG this summer - are they serious about us being in top 4 or is top 6 enough for this , this summer will give us fans a lot of answers.
m3sye said:
Well after spending the best part of £200 yesterday for the first time in his 3 years BR has lost me - I actually fully believe this will be it for him, I do not believe for one second that FSG will accept this season as anything other than a massive failure. One thing that is screaming out to me at the moment with BR in charge is how easily we fold in the big game, Last year (Chelsea and Palace) This year UTD ARSENAL,BASEL, VILLA
Our CM is as poor as I have ever seen it, Everyone needs to remember Gerrard for what he was not what he is now - the guy is done and its a shame to now see him getting stick, at one point yesterday Can Broke got passed 2 players then got tackled 10 yards outside the villa box, Gerard was right next to him, they broke and can managed to get back to tackle on the edge of our box - where was SG , 5 yards over the half way line 'trying' to get back - the game totally pass by all 3 CM's - our suppose best CM player yesterday was Henderson - his best quality if you ask anyone is his 'engine' thats just not good enough.
The johnson sub baffled everyone - its a semi final ffs -, go for it, put Borini on - then Lambert , why even buy him if you trust him that little
Thoroughly long and disappointing day
I agree with one small caveat - the FA Cup won't break his tenure but no CL will.Our CM is as poor as I have ever seen it, Everyone needs to remember Gerrard for what he was not what he is now - the guy is done and its a shame to now see him getting stick, at one point yesterday Can Broke got passed 2 players then got tackled 10 yards outside the villa box, Gerard was right next to him, they broke and can managed to get back to tackle on the edge of our box - where was SG , 5 yards over the half way line 'trying' to get back - the game totally pass by all 3 CM's - our suppose best CM player yesterday was Henderson - his best quality if you ask anyone is his 'engine' thats just not good enough.
The johnson sub baffled everyone - its a semi final ffs -, go for it, put Borini on - then Lambert , why even buy him if you trust him that little
Thoroughly long and disappointing day
If he gets 4th he's staying.
So who do you really think might want/take the job of LFC manager if BR gets the chop?
Personally, I think Kloop will only want a job with a team that's in the CL, and can challenge clubs like Bayern and Real Madrid. I think he'll be hoping for Man City, it was surely no coincidence that he stated his wish to leave just as the pressure was going on Pellegrine?
Not sure I can think of a manager of the qualities that you need, that would actually want to go to LFC at the moment.
I think you are going to struggle to attract someone better than BR.
Personally, I think Kloop will only want a job with a team that's in the CL, and can challenge clubs like Bayern and Real Madrid. I think he'll be hoping for Man City, it was surely no coincidence that he stated his wish to leave just as the pressure was going on Pellegrine?
Not sure I can think of a manager of the qualities that you need, that would actually want to go to LFC at the moment.
I think you are going to struggle to attract someone better than BR.
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