The Official Manchester United Thread [Vol 5]

[Alpinestars]

Bit of a Unit said:

I'm somewhat of a lone voice of positivity at Old Trafford with those that sit by me. So it may well be a personality trait! Bit like yourself a few years back I've recently questioned why I drag myself there every week. I'm longing for the atmosphere and performance levels that took us to Moscow, but that's 8 years ago now. However I remain confident we'll get there. Misguided as that may turn out to be!

You keep going and here's to you being right

[ORD]

The progress has been enormous. I really don't know how people have such short memories. Utd looked like being mid-table for 5 years when Moyes was at Utd. 7th place flattered us. And now we are likely to compete for the title and have some excellent young players. We are a transitional side that is pretty much top of the league and yet the fans moan.

It's getting to be like listening to Liverpool fans! We should have won 4 titles already this year and be scoring 7 goals a game.

[LoonR1]

ORD said:

The progress has been enormous. I really don't know how people have such short memories. Utd looked like being mid-table for 5 years when Moyes was at Utd. 7th place flattered us. And now we are likely to compete for the title and have some excellent young players. We are a transitional side that is pretty much top of the league and yet the fans moan.

It's getting to be like listening to Liverpool fans! We should have won 4 titles already this year and be scoring 7 goals a game.

I do so despise being misquoted.

[ORD]

LoonR1 said:

I do so despise being misquoted.

Nobody quoted you, cry baby.

[LoonR1]

ORD said:

LoonR1 said:

I do so despise being misquoted.

Nobody quoted you, cry baby.

I was laughing when I wrote that and I'm laughing even more now.

My point is still valid, as is Alpine-Stars' and we're the ones less than happy about the performances. In a professional capacity I've had many hundreds of people working for me over time and without doubt the ones who succeed are those who try the hardest and keep trying. I use an analogy around doing things the right way vs results.

There are many examples in ,y line of work where people do things wrong and get the right result and ones where people do the rot thing and get the wrong result. However, those doing the right things will always end up getting the right result more often than not. We are not doing things right IMO. We were within 4 minutes of drawing today due to not trying to win. We got lucky. That luck will run out, as next time it might be nearer full time, or the other side might not panic as readily.

[greygoose]

I think some of you have been spoilt and expect exciting football and winning titles all the time, it isn't that common. For all the excitement he may have delivered (though I seem to remember a lot of last minute wins too) Ferguson left United with a pretty crap squad, LVG is rebuilding and has you second in the league yet you hate him, perhaps your expectations are unrealistic?

[LoonR1]

greygoose said:

I think some of you have been spoilt and expect exciting football and winning titles all the time, it isn't that common. For all the excitement he may have delivered (though I seem to remember a lot of last minute wins too) Ferguson left United with a pretty crap squad, LVG is rebuilding and has you second in the league yet you hate him, perhaps your expectations are unrealistic?

And again, for the hard of reading.

I don't care if we go trophy less for a while, I want to see enjoyable football. The reality is that a good squad playing well will challenge ge for the title. We might not win it, but I'd rather go close that way than the way we're currently playing.

I've said my piece on how SAF left the squad many times on here.

[rouge59]

LoonR1 said:

And again, for the hard of reading.

I don't care if we go trophy less for a while, I want to see enjoyable football. The reality is that a good squad playing well will challenge ge for the title. We might not win it, but I'd rather go close that way than the way we're currently playing.

I've said my piece on how SAF left the squad many times on here.

My thoughts entirely.

I've been a United fan since 1976 & I've seen us win everything, so now what I want is to be entertained & win games the United way, bombing forward with a 'If you score 4, we'll score 5' mindset.

I realise this doesn't fit it with the modern corporate mentality of 'win at all costs', but I'm too old & grumpy to give a fk about that.

Edited by rouge59 on Saturday 21st November 22:27

[greygoose]

LoonR1 said:

greygoose said:

I think some of you have been spoilt and expect exciting football and winning titles all the time, it isn't that common. For all the excitement he may have delivered (though I seem to remember a lot of last minute wins too) Ferguson left United with a pretty crap squad, LVG is rebuilding and has you second in the league yet you hate him, perhaps your expectations are unrealistic?

And again, for the hard of reading.

I don't care if we go trophy less for a while, I want to see enjoyable football. The reality is that a good squad playing well will challenge ge for the title. We might not win it, but I'd rather go close that way than the way we're currently playing.

I've said my piece on how SAF left the squad many times on here.

I'm not sure the reality is that there is a challenge for the title as many Arsenal fans may agree. A mate at work travels up from Kent for every home game and he is quite content with winning in a dull way, not everyone is unhappy. LVG has been given a target by the owners and I doubt it included entertainment.

[LoonR1]

greygoose said:

I'm not sure the reality is that there is a challenge for the title as many Arsenal fans may agree. A mate at work travels up from Kent for every home game and he is quite content with winning in a dull way, not everyone is unhappy. LVG has been given a target by the owners and I doubt it included entertainment.

Just think a little before you type. United are 1 point behind Leicester who are currently the leaders. So next week is a top of the table clash, with the winner going / staying top. That's kind of the definition of a title challenge. It might not last until May, but it is a challenge.

I do t want it if we can only do it this way. I'd like to win every game by the odd goal in 9, but that's not realistic. However, having more than one attempt at goal in a match is a fairly realistic target.

[Bit of a Unit]

rouge59 said:

My thoughts entirely.

I've been a United fan since 1976 & I've seen us win everything, so now what I want is to be entertained & win games the United way, bombing forward with a 'If you score 4, we'll score 5' mindset.

I realise this doesn't fit it with the modern corporate mentality of 'win at all costs', but I'm too old & grumpy to give a fk about that.

Edited by rouge59 on Saturday 21st November 22:27

So just after you started supporting we got relegated. Bloody jinx. Hardly the united way that. This you score 4 we'll score 5 is utter bks. The only manager that ever advocated that was Keegan. And he threw away a 12 point lead after being crushed by a ruthlessly efficient United. Not a devil may care united a ruthlessly efficient one.

It's not a corporate mentality, it's just playing the cards we've got. We haven't got Ronaldo or Messi. We've a burnt out Rooney, a promising young striker and an incredible keeper with a fantastically organised defence. I can slip on the treble video anytime. In the meantime I'll take scraped victories and a shot at the title.

[franki68]

People would stand for 1-2 seasons of playing really attractive football without winning anything ,and then they would call for the head of the coach.

we looked really good until Herrera got injured and we had to re jiggle the formation,and if you didn't buzz off the last few minutes then I don't know because when they scored we went up a gear and we've not done that for a long time .
The pig farmer managed a full 90 minutes and looked back to full fitness ,the forwards played well and the movement made a refreshing change form Rooney dropping back to give the ball away ,although Memphis is still a lazy sod ,he plays like Ronaldo ,but with 10% of the talent.He needs to put a bit more work rate in .
We've been hammered by injuries and are currently above city having had a tougher fixture schedule ,things could be worse.

[NailedOn]

LoonR1 said:

Bit of a Unit said:

I'm unsure on Giggs, but I guess the romantic in me would like to see Giggs and perhaps Neville alongside taking us onto greater glories. I do see us getting better though. Martial, Memphis, Lingard, Pereira there's youthful talent there it just needs time.

We'll have to disagree on winning the league with dull football. I'd take winning leagues over the glorious failures a la Arsenal over the last 10 years or Liverpool winning today.

As for the free flowing football we both know it went with Ronaldo. There's been nothing close since. Perhaps that's why the likes of a Best or Ronaldo are so revered, or the uniqueness of the Class of '92. They clearly are once in a generation. At least I got to see them. (Best admittedly was at a legends game at Moss Lane and he was a shade past his peak)

I really want us to get better, I'm trying not to be our version of raja over on the Scouse thread. I just don't see anything at the moment to convince me. I want to see us have a go at the really crap teams and try to beat them by a few goals, even if it doesn't pay off. At the moment it's a C for results and a D- for effort, with an A for league position. Make it a B- for effort and I'd be happy.

It was an insight to see 'Class of 92- out of their league.' What came across was that Neville is the leader but the insights on tactics and management came from Scholsey. Giggs was fairly quiet which would indicate he's fine as No 2 but not a natural boss.

[GTO-3R]

NailedOn said:

It was an insight to see 'Class of 92- out of their league.' What came across was that Neville is the leader but the insights on tactics and management came from Scholsey. Giggs was fairly quiet which would indicate he's fine as No 2 but not a natural boss.

You're judging the future of Ryan Giggs as United manager based on a TV programme?

[E63M6]

The last 5 mins or so for me showed what we're capable of. We probably wont get it under LVG because of his 'philosophy'.

[LoonR1]

franki68 said:

People would stand for 1-2 seasons of playing really attractive football without winning anything ,and then they would call for the head of the coach.

we looked really good until Herrera got injured and we had to re jiggle the formation,and if you didn't buzz off the last few minutes then I don't know because when they scored we went up a gear and we've not done that for a long time .
The pig farmer managed a full 90 minutes and looked back to full fitness ,the forwards played well and the movement made a refreshing change form Rooney dropping back to give the ball away ,although Memphis is still a lazy sod ,he plays like Ronaldo ,but with 10% of the talent.He needs to put a bit more work rate in .
We've been hammered by injuries and are currently above city having had a tougher fixture schedule ,things could be worse.

I used to watch teams equalise against us and think "you lucky bds, now let's batter them for 5 mins". I don't now, I think "Oh crap, that's another two dropped points". Don't get me wrong the last 5 mins were great, but we shouldn't be in that position. We're good enough to stick 3 past them in the first hour and then shut up shop. I hate the way we score and then our approach is to shut up shop. Better teams than Watford will get through us if they want to.

I'm not knocking our position in the league. In fact I've been very complimentary, although the fact that other teams are again imploding does flatter us. I want us to continue to battle at the sharp end to be in the mix and to try to make it last to the end of the season. I just want to see some flair. If we win it by paying turgid football, then it encourages more turgid football.

[NailedOn]

GTO-3R said:

NailedOn said:

It was an insight to see 'Class of 92- out of their league.' What came across was that Neville is the leader but the insights on tactics and management came from Scholsey. Giggs was fairly quiet which would indicate he's fine as No 2 but not a natural boss.

You're judging the future of Ryan Giggs as United manager based on a TV programme?

The TV programme provided an insight. I don't know any of the class of 92 personally. Do you?
Relax will you. This is called Gassing Station for a reason.

[Bit of a Unit]

NailedOn said:

GTO-3R said:

NailedOn said:

It was an insight to see 'Class of 92- out of their league.' What came across was that Neville is the leader but the insights on tactics and management came from Scholsey. Giggs was fairly quiet which would indicate he's fine as No 2 but not a natural boss.

You're judging the future of Ryan Giggs as United manager based on a TV programme?

The TV programme provided an insight. I don't know any of the class of 92 personally. Do you?
Relax will you. This is called Gassing Station for a reason.

I think the programme was pretty clear that the time spent or input at Salford from Giggsy and Butt is minimal due to their United commitments.
The utterly ruthless way he dealt with his extra marital shenanigans give pause for thought in a very perverse way (pun intended)as to the credentials for the top job. It's a moot point for now but one can't help but think about Guadliola and is Giggs our version or do we just bring in Pep?

On an even more ludicrous point every bloody tabloid paper carried the Ronaldo story today and Van Gaal did admit on Friday that he wants him back.

That means either 8 months of shameless flirting until the window closes, heartbreak in June as he signs for PSG or the unthinkable and he becomes the final piece in LVG's jigsaw and the ste we are watching now is prepping the team to be able to carry an ageing Ronaldo and unleash his unstoppable magic in the final third. Letting LVG bow out with a treble....

I really should put down this Pinot Noir.

[NailedOn]

Bit of a Unit said:

I really should put down this Pinot Noir.

I'll drink to that! Sadly only vinc blanco these days. An age thing. The mind is strong but the body weak....

[franki68]

LoonR1 said:

I used to watch teams equalise against us and think "you lucky bds, now let's batter them for 5 mins". I don't now, I think "Oh crap, that's another two dropped points". Don't get me wrong the last 5 mins were great, but we shouldn't be in that position. We're good enough to stick 3 past them in the first hour and then shut up shop. I hate the way we score and then our approach is to shut up shop. Better teams than Watford will get through us if they want to.

I'm not knocking our position in the league. In fact I've been very complimentary, although the fact that other teams are again imploding does flatter us. I want us to continue to battle at the sharp end to be in the mix and to try to make it last to the end of the season. I just want to see some flair. If we win it by paying turgid football, then it encourages more turgid football.

You don't think there has been a noticeable attempt to move away from that dreary pass backwards /sideways stuff at the start of the season ? I think it's very noticeable.Its not helped by rooneys abject form ,nor the current crop of injuries ,but I think it's very noticeable.
There are not many easy games these days,the top teams are worse than they used to be and the rest are better ,