The Official Liverpool FC Thread [Vol 11]
Discussion
Flip Martian said:
Interesting interview with Ian Ayre - addressing the ticket pricing and the quote on the FSG website about consumers.
http://www.thisisanfield.com/2016/02/video-ian-ayr...
He is a Grade A cockhttp://www.thisisanfield.com/2016/02/video-ian-ayr...
Sos reply
http://www.spiritofshankly.com/news/response-to-lf...
Flip Martian said:
Interesting interview with Ian Ayre - addressing the ticket pricing and the quote on the FSG website about consumers.
http://www.thisisanfield.com/2016/02/video-ian-ayr...
He is a Grade A cockhttp://www.thisisanfield.com/2016/02/video-ian-ayr...
Sos reply
http://www.spiritofshankly.com/news/response-to-lf...
m3sye said:
Flip Martian said:
Interesting interview with Ian Ayre - addressing the ticket pricing and the quote on the FSG website about consumers.
http://www.thisisanfield.com/2016/02/video-ian-ayr...
He is a Grade A cockhttp://www.thisisanfield.com/2016/02/video-ian-ayr...
Sos reply
http://www.spiritofshankly.com/news/response-to-lf...
If you were nailed on third place or better, then you might say value for money.
m3sye said:
Exit strategy for me .. maybe 2 yrs time
Ayre is just a puppet on strings
I genuinely don't think FSG currently have an exited strategy. I think owning LFC and the Red Sox allows them to make money through other, related businesses. Whilst we're an appreciating asset for them I think they'll stay as owners.Ayre is just a puppet on strings
So much for make things more affordable and so much for not raising prices to pay for the new stand. The club has paid lip service to the fans concerns and I think badly misread the depth of feeling on this. Something for everyone says Ayre. No, its a dogs dinner of a solution. Just a simple question, but why do local fans deserve cheaper tickets? I will be walking out on 77 tomorrow, I hope the numbers are huge and hope the club's owners are embarrassed.
As an aside only Everton voted for £30 away tickets at a recent PL vote. Shameful.
As an aside only Everton voted for £30 away tickets at a recent PL vote. Shameful.
Yes saw Everton had done that, well done them
Just read this on RAWK, long but for me spot on
Well done to everyone who organised and are taking part in this.
My gut feeling is that the price increase is all part of FSG’s exit plan: they’ll be gone shortly after that stand is finished. So the good news is, I don’t think FSG will raise prices anymore after this; the bad news is that whoever they sell the club to will, with great relish, unless it’s made clear that football is not a traditional business and supporters are not traditional “customers”. So anyone who doesn’t see the value in the walkout tomorrow needs to look beyond £77 and see it as the touchstone it is because that figure is not an end, it’s only the beginning. For that reason we also need to look beyond a single mass exodus on 77 minutes and see this as a starting point for something more sustained because the club we all love is in grave danger of falling into a spiral from which it may never recover.
FSG’s goal is to push the value of the club as high as it possibly can before selling to the next set of investors, thereby maximising the return on their initial investment. And by god it’ll be some return: it was easy to laugh at Gillett and Hicks back in 2010 when they cried “epic swindle” but the truth is that, due to the circumstances involved, FSG did get a hefty discount at £300m (or six times what Fernando Torres would go for a few months later). Last May, less than five years removed from their arrival, Forbes valued the club at $982, just shy of a billion. And with a new TV deal just around the corner, it will surely exceed that figure in the near future (virtually all of that without Champions League football).
£2m extra per annum on top of current matchday revenues might seem like loose change given the figures we’re talking about here, and it is in and of itself, but it all helps to maximise that overall bottom line in which potential investors will be so interested. Perhaps more importantly, it will also look great on the graphs they’ll no doubt use as part of the pitch to illustrate just how much value they’ve added during their time in charge. Don’t think about it as a mere £2m extra from ticket sales, think of it as an attractive percentage improvement (a) on what the club was making purely from ticket sales in 2010, and (b) on what the redeveloped Anfield – with its increased ticket prices, more seats and more corporate boxes – will be turning over.
Now imagine Ayre, Gordon or some other suit giddily making that presentation and painting a picture with numbers to a team of foreign investors who don’t see £77 but £87 or £97 or even £107, who see capacity attendance figures every week, even for games against lesser teams, and, making their projections, come to the conclusion that the customer base could easily withstand a 15 to 25% increase in ticket prices over the first three years. You might scoff at that and argue that the matchgoing fanbase would completely disintegrate were that to happen, that the new owners would quickly find themselves looking out over a half-empty Anfield from their executive boxes, but at what point does it become too much then? If £77 isn’t the straw that breaks the camel's back, then who’s to say £87 or £97 would be?
More importantly, and this is why action is needed now before it’s too late: FSG clearly see no difference between hardcore local support and their global “customers”. If they did, their new ticketing policy would be different. Indeed, they probably value the latter more highly since Anfield sits in one of the most deprived areas of the country and fans arriving once or twice a year from elsewhere will potentially have more money in their wallets to spend inside the stadium. Some argue that treating the local supporters like this is ultimately commercial suicide, that it will further dilute the atmosphere in the stadium and erode those parts of the “brand” that are most valuable in selling the club to commercial partners and investors. And I would agree, but why would FSG give a s
t about any of that if they’re already preparing their exit?
If theirs is, for the sake of argument, a two-year plan from this point, how long does it take the fanbase or commercial partnerships to erode given that Liverpool have reached the Champions League once in seven seasons and yet are making more revenue than they ever have, even leaving aside television deals? Are those things eroding now, right this very second? Possibly, but how long will it take to start affecting the bottom line? A year? Two years? FSG could be gone by then and the consequences will be someone else’s problem, none of which is conducive to what we all want, namely success on the pitch.
Their plan will be to push up matchday revenues via the redevelopment and increased ticket prices, add it to the impressive array of corporate sponsors they’ve managed to attract and the humongous television deal, give it a year or so to clear some of the debt on the new stand and then bolt, before fan sentiment turns so toxic that attendances fall through the floor and their business plan along with it, especially if Klopp is unable to serve up a better “product” to the “customer” in that time. And then the next increase in ticket prices won’t come from FSG, it’ll come from whatever assortment of bullstters pay them a billion for what’s left of Liverpool Football Club
Back in Boston counting the dollars, FSG’s main players won’t be giving two fks when the fanbase decides “enough is enough” at the next set of increases, and attendances fall and the “brand” suffers. That’ll be someone else’s problem then. FSG executives will add greatly to their wealth, Ayre will still be riding around on Harleys, the players will still be living in gated mansions. The only ones who stand to lose something and end this process with a massive hole in their lives are the supporters. This, as far as I’m concerned, is the one chance Liverpool supporters have to make the owners sit up and take notice. Pay the £77 now without a noise, and they’ll be gone by the time the next opportunity arises to galvanise people.
Let’s not forget how instrumental the fans were in getting rid of Gillett and Hicks. Potential investors to whom they went begging in order to keep their claws in the club were quickly dissuaded at that time. FSG have obviously run the club well from a business point of view, so it’s a slightly different scenario, but the point remains: this can work if there’s enough buy-in. Another advantage this time is that supporters of other clubs might see themselves as having a stake too. Accept it now, though, and the club will get passed around like a bomb to various different investors until they finally piss us off enough that we act and it blows up in their faces. By then it’ll be too late
Just read this on RAWK, long but for me spot on
Well done to everyone who organised and are taking part in this.
My gut feeling is that the price increase is all part of FSG’s exit plan: they’ll be gone shortly after that stand is finished. So the good news is, I don’t think FSG will raise prices anymore after this; the bad news is that whoever they sell the club to will, with great relish, unless it’s made clear that football is not a traditional business and supporters are not traditional “customers”. So anyone who doesn’t see the value in the walkout tomorrow needs to look beyond £77 and see it as the touchstone it is because that figure is not an end, it’s only the beginning. For that reason we also need to look beyond a single mass exodus on 77 minutes and see this as a starting point for something more sustained because the club we all love is in grave danger of falling into a spiral from which it may never recover.
FSG’s goal is to push the value of the club as high as it possibly can before selling to the next set of investors, thereby maximising the return on their initial investment. And by god it’ll be some return: it was easy to laugh at Gillett and Hicks back in 2010 when they cried “epic swindle” but the truth is that, due to the circumstances involved, FSG did get a hefty discount at £300m (or six times what Fernando Torres would go for a few months later). Last May, less than five years removed from their arrival, Forbes valued the club at $982, just shy of a billion. And with a new TV deal just around the corner, it will surely exceed that figure in the near future (virtually all of that without Champions League football).
£2m extra per annum on top of current matchday revenues might seem like loose change given the figures we’re talking about here, and it is in and of itself, but it all helps to maximise that overall bottom line in which potential investors will be so interested. Perhaps more importantly, it will also look great on the graphs they’ll no doubt use as part of the pitch to illustrate just how much value they’ve added during their time in charge. Don’t think about it as a mere £2m extra from ticket sales, think of it as an attractive percentage improvement (a) on what the club was making purely from ticket sales in 2010, and (b) on what the redeveloped Anfield – with its increased ticket prices, more seats and more corporate boxes – will be turning over.
Now imagine Ayre, Gordon or some other suit giddily making that presentation and painting a picture with numbers to a team of foreign investors who don’t see £77 but £87 or £97 or even £107, who see capacity attendance figures every week, even for games against lesser teams, and, making their projections, come to the conclusion that the customer base could easily withstand a 15 to 25% increase in ticket prices over the first three years. You might scoff at that and argue that the matchgoing fanbase would completely disintegrate were that to happen, that the new owners would quickly find themselves looking out over a half-empty Anfield from their executive boxes, but at what point does it become too much then? If £77 isn’t the straw that breaks the camel's back, then who’s to say £87 or £97 would be?
More importantly, and this is why action is needed now before it’s too late: FSG clearly see no difference between hardcore local support and their global “customers”. If they did, their new ticketing policy would be different. Indeed, they probably value the latter more highly since Anfield sits in one of the most deprived areas of the country and fans arriving once or twice a year from elsewhere will potentially have more money in their wallets to spend inside the stadium. Some argue that treating the local supporters like this is ultimately commercial suicide, that it will further dilute the atmosphere in the stadium and erode those parts of the “brand” that are most valuable in selling the club to commercial partners and investors. And I would agree, but why would FSG give a s
t about any of that if they’re already preparing their exit?If theirs is, for the sake of argument, a two-year plan from this point, how long does it take the fanbase or commercial partnerships to erode given that Liverpool have reached the Champions League once in seven seasons and yet are making more revenue than they ever have, even leaving aside television deals? Are those things eroding now, right this very second? Possibly, but how long will it take to start affecting the bottom line? A year? Two years? FSG could be gone by then and the consequences will be someone else’s problem, none of which is conducive to what we all want, namely success on the pitch.
Their plan will be to push up matchday revenues via the redevelopment and increased ticket prices, add it to the impressive array of corporate sponsors they’ve managed to attract and the humongous television deal, give it a year or so to clear some of the debt on the new stand and then bolt, before fan sentiment turns so toxic that attendances fall through the floor and their business plan along with it, especially if Klopp is unable to serve up a better “product” to the “customer” in that time. And then the next increase in ticket prices won’t come from FSG, it’ll come from whatever assortment of bulls
tters pay them a billion for what’s left of Liverpool Football Club Back in Boston counting the dollars, FSG’s main players won’t be giving two f
ks when the fanbase decides “enough is enough” at the next set of increases, and attendances fall and the “brand” suffers. That’ll be someone else’s problem then. FSG executives will add greatly to their wealth, Ayre will still be riding around on Harleys, the players will still be living in gated mansions. The only ones who stand to lose something and end this process with a massive hole in their lives are the supporters. This, as far as I’m concerned, is the one chance Liverpool supporters have to make the owners sit up and take notice. Pay the £77 now without a noise, and they’ll be gone by the time the next opportunity arises to galvanise people.Let’s not forget how instrumental the fans were in getting rid of Gillett and Hicks. Potential investors to whom they went begging in order to keep their claws in the club were quickly dissuaded at that time. FSG have obviously run the club well from a business point of view, so it’s a slightly different scenario, but the point remains: this can work if there’s enough buy-in. Another advantage this time is that supporters of other clubs might see themselves as having a stake too. Accept it now, though, and the club will get passed around like a bomb to various different investors until they finally piss us off enough that we act and it blows up in their faces. By then it’ll be too late
type-r said:
For me it was the mid-eighties (think we are giving away our age here!) - however it was nice to see a Liverpool team again that was rock-solid in defence, even though we were setup to be boring under Houllier, we got results. Was actually nice reliving it unexpectedly. Like many on here, those were the days where I couldn't wait to see our next game.
Yeah I've forgotten what that felt like. Although that Suarez season got fairly close for excitement, we still shipped lots of silly goals.m3sye said:
Flip Martian said:
Interesting interview with Ian Ayre - addressing the ticket pricing and the quote on the FSG website about consumers.
http://www.thisisanfield.com/2016/02/video-ian-ayr...
He is a Grade A cockhttp://www.thisisanfield.com/2016/02/video-ian-ayr...
Sos reply
http://www.spiritofshankly.com/news/response-to-lf...
t you see from most corporate spokespeople then.A different but excellent take on ticket prices and TV income and China's growing influemce by Arsene Wenger.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35502898
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35502898
type-r said:
A different but excellent take on ticket prices and TV income and China's growing influemce by Arsene Wenger.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35502898
This constant desire or aim to be the "biggest and the best" bothers me. I don't really care if the Premier League is no longer the best and doesn't have the best players. In the early 90s, the Italian league was seen as the best; didn't stop any of us supporting our clubs. If players want to chase the dollar over in China, then good luck to them. I really don't see why we need to match their spending power except to maintain the large numbers of staff the biggest clubs have on their payroll now - and I'm not talking about players. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35502898
type-r said:
A different but excellent take on ticket prices and TV income and China's growing influemce by Arsene Wenger.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35502898
Don't agree..have you seen their and our net spends? And as part of the agreement only a % over he tv money can be spent on player wages http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35502898
Flip Martian said:
This constant desire or aim to be the "biggest and the best" bothers me. I don't really care if the Premier League is no longer the best and doesn't have the best players. In the early 90s, the Italian league was seen as the best; didn't stop any of us supporting our clubs. If players want to chase the dollar over in China, then good luck to them. I really don't see why we need to match their spending power except to maintain the large numbers of staff the biggest clubs have on their payroll now - and I'm not talking about players.
There will always be a few wanting the big bucks, let them go they are no loss to our league. .there is plenty of players out there that will want the premiership
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