Revelations of the Pyramids
Discussion
As OP hasn't replied, I'll tell you...
The gist of the story is that they are man made, but to a pre-designed plan left by a previously wiped out superior race warning of climate change.
One of the last things the narrator says is along the lines of 'this is an encoded message telling us what happened to them and that it will happen to us if we don't watch out'
Despite my 'woo-wooing', I did find a lot of it interesting, it only got silly in my opinion when they made everything fit to their own conclusions. There again, that's what frontier scientists do as well!
Finally though, if this 'superior' race left us a message that we were all going to be wiped out and sent it as a warning, why go to all the trouble of the pyramid plans, the easter island plans, the Machu Pichu (sp) plans, why not just tell someone or write it down in a way that everyone could understand. There's really no need to be all cryptic. Hang on...they could be Freemasons!
The gist of the story is that they are man made, but to a pre-designed plan left by a previously wiped out superior race warning of climate change.
One of the last things the narrator says is along the lines of 'this is an encoded message telling us what happened to them and that it will happen to us if we don't watch out'
Despite my 'woo-wooing', I did find a lot of it interesting, it only got silly in my opinion when they made everything fit to their own conclusions. There again, that's what frontier scientists do as well!
Finally though, if this 'superior' race left us a message that we were all going to be wiped out and sent it as a warning, why go to all the trouble of the pyramid plans, the easter island plans, the Machu Pichu (sp) plans, why not just tell someone or write it down in a way that everyone could understand. There's really no need to be all cryptic. Hang on...they could be Freemasons!
TheHeretic said:
OP... Aliens of human builders?
I hear ya, I hear ya! However much I'd like to spend all day reading and posting on PH, my work unfortunately doesn't always allow it. 
Why it's so important what I think or believe I don't know. As said before I honestly don't know and I'm open to possibilities, is that a problem then ?
The pyramids etc have been studied for hundreds of years by many great minds and we still don't have any definitive answers. Egyptologists say it was done this way and many professionals in their field say they're talking rubbish. Surely we could have worked it all out by now if it was all that simple.
Scratching a piece of granite with a copper saw or whatever, then getting out a calculator does not produce a Pyramid or a work of art !
Silvagod will hopefully remember the pathetic effort of Egyptologists trying to lift a stone which took then over 10 hours to lift and put in place. I'm yet to see any of these halfwits produce anything comparable to what these ancient people produced, be it the Pyramid or a granite vase. Yet they bang on and on how simple it all was.....well go and make something remotely comparable then !!!!
silvagod said:
Finally though, if this 'superior' race left us a message that we were all going to be wiped out and sent it as a warning, why go to all the trouble of the pyramid plans, the easter island plans, the Machu Pichu (sp) plans, why not just tell someone or write it down in a way that everyone could understand. There's really no need to be all cryptic. Hang on...they could be Freemasons!
Maybe they thought, whoever made all this stuff, writing something down can be open to interpretation. We all know how that if something is written in an ancient text it is interpreted as fiction if it doesn't fit with our world or nicey nicey view of the past.Setting something in stone that doesn't move or change over time challenges questions.
Like the documentary says, how many coincidences do you want before you look at something and think maybe just maybe it isn't all coincidence after all... I don't know, I found it interesting though.
hairykrishna said:
last time Westy was arguing that cutting granite with copper saws was impossible.
No I didn't ! I have said though that I don't believe we have found all the tools they used.Apparently they didn't have a wheel......So they managed all this amazing stuff with so-called simple tools and not one of those people dropped a round plate on the floor, watch it roll and it never struck an idea.....give over will ya. Only recently they found a load of Pyramids etc they didn't know they had using satellite technology, yet they say they have found all the tools.
IIRC in that documentary one single core drill sample found objects they didn't know they had!Sorry, back to work
Edited by Westy Pre-Lit on Friday 13th January 07:39
Westy is the type of person who will always look for the weird and wayout solution to a problem that didn't require one.
I have visited many of these sites and even one of the quarries where the blocks were hewn from the bedrock. Not only can you see the marks left by the tools used in the rocks, you can also see half completed blocks where, for whatever reason (usually a split), the attempt to remove the block was abandoned.
Ancient people were not dumb, They were clever engineers and knew how to work and fashion the building materials available to them.
They didn't need any technology beyond what was available to them.
I have visited many of these sites and even one of the quarries where the blocks were hewn from the bedrock. Not only can you see the marks left by the tools used in the rocks, you can also see half completed blocks where, for whatever reason (usually a split), the attempt to remove the block was abandoned.
Ancient people were not dumb, They were clever engineers and knew how to work and fashion the building materials available to them.
They didn't need any technology beyond what was available to them.
Westy Pre-Lit said:
We all know how that if something is written in an ancient text it is interpreted as fiction if it doesn't fit with our world or nicey nicey view of the past.
We do? What about the Bible?
Ancient text that was written and also warns of disasters if certain things are not followed.
(I personally think it's a work of fiction)
Westy Pre-Lit said:
The pyramids etc have been studied for hundreds of years by many great minds and we still don't have any definitive answers. Egyptologists say it was done this way and many professionals in their field say they're talking rubbish. Surely we could have worked it all out by now if it was all that simple.
Scratching a piece of granite with a copper saw or whatever, then getting out a calculator does not produce a Pyramid or a work of art !
You do that Denys Stocks chap and his colleagues a massive disservice. Have you actually looked at the links to that book, or his papers posted earlier? The experimental work he carried out goes far beyond 'scratching a piece of granite'. He comprehensively demonstrated most, if not all, of the tools and techniques required to produce ancient Egyptian stonework. I know it doesn't fit into your 'it's all so mysterious' mantra but he's had a damn good go at definitive answers as have many others.Scratching a piece of granite with a copper saw or whatever, then getting out a calculator does not produce a Pyramid or a work of art !
And that is my main problem wuiith this type of thinking. It a gross insult to two groups - those who have carried out extensive archeological research into the work of the ancients and the ancients themselves, who were just as clever, if not more clever, than an awful lot of us today.
Eric Mc said:
who were just as clever, if not more clever, than an awful lot of us today.
its funny isn't it- we thin the Pyramids are hugely mysterious, because of their size, but don't think the same thing of numerous Roman constructions (the colloseum for example, whichh is a much much much cleverer piece of engineering and architecture). Once you can make blocks of a uniform size, building a pyramid is really quite easy- you don't even need to do any sums. On the other hand building hundreds of thousands of straight roads between myriad points, which have lasted 2000 years of wear is a much harder feat.
hairykrishna said:
Odie said:
I was sure I saw a documentary that showed evidence that copper tools had been used (tools marks etc) and that after each cut the teeth of the saw had to be resharpened in some cases to such an extent that the blade had new teeth for every cut.
They found, in that paper, that a flat 'saw' with no teeth pressing on a layer of cutting powder worked better than a toothed saw. The copper's not hard enough to do the cutting alone.hairykrishna said:
You do that Denys Stocks chap and his colleagues a massive disservice. Have you actually looked at the links to that book, or his papers posted earlier? The experimental work he carried out goes far beyond 'scratching a piece of granite'. He comprehensively demonstrated most, if not all, of the tools and techniques required to produce ancient Egyptian stonework. I know it doesn't fit into your 'it's all so mysterious' mantra but he's had a damn good go at definitive answers as have many others.
You will also remember then that I linked to the site that those experiments were taken place.It was noted that a lot of material was being lost on the cutting tool throughout the cutting process. It has also been mentioned elsewhere that it is believed that was nowhere near enough cooper available at the time to produce all this stuff even when you factor in recycling.
Westy Pre-Lit said:
You will also remember then that I linked to the site that those experiments were taken place.
It was noted that a lot of material was being lost on the cutting tool throughout the cutting process. It has also been mentioned elsewhere that it is believed that was nowhere near enough cooper available at the time to produce all this stuff even when you factor in recycling.
No. You linked to this blokes site; http://www.cheops-pyramide.ch/khufu-pyramid/stone-...It was noted that a lot of material was being lost on the cutting tool throughout the cutting process. It has also been mentioned elsewhere that it is believed that was nowhere near enough cooper available at the time to produce all this stuff even when you factor in recycling.
He concludes that you can't feasibly cut granite with copper because he fails and because iron is better. He mentions the NOVA program but, much like you, he ignores the fact that people have actually done real research and shown it can be done. Do you have a link to someone who's actually aware of the experiments that show copper loss and done the maths to show there wasn't enough copper available? Or is it all assertion?
A link I have previously posted was from on the NOVA site, maybe I have posted it elsewhere.
I can't remember where I read about the copper issue but IIRC it was something to do with the amount that had be mined. Will try to find them later...sorry am rushing around all over the place atm I'm afraid.
I can't remember where I read about the copper issue but IIRC it was something to do with the amount that had be mined. Will try to find them later...sorry am rushing around all over the place atm I'm afraid.
Edited by Westy Pre-Lit on Sunday 15th January 13:46
The paper I found showed a copper loss of ~25g per hour when sawing the rose granite blocks. Similar to the rate of granite removal. I imagine that some of this would be recoverable. Seems a manageable amount to me but at the same time I have no feel for what copper reserves the ancient Egyptians had access to.
Even without the specifics it boils down to what seems reasonable - Occam's razor.
Option 1: An ancient civilisation built these pyramids thousands of years ago. Whilst we have a good idea how they did it the huge time gap means that specific elements are still open for debate and we don't know exactly how some of the results were achieved. When, and if, we ever do, we'll find those methods to be broadly commensurate with the knowledge of the day.
Option 2: These ancient civilisations had access to a level of technology more advanced than we have today. They left no evidence of this other than some stone pyramids, which could have been built using traditional hard labour. Then they forgot about it.
Option 3: Aliens came down to Earth and constructed the pyramids using their super-advanced anti-gravity machines and cutting tools, as a cryptic warning to future civilisations against something or other.
Shh, I'm thinking...
Option 1: An ancient civilisation built these pyramids thousands of years ago. Whilst we have a good idea how they did it the huge time gap means that specific elements are still open for debate and we don't know exactly how some of the results were achieved. When, and if, we ever do, we'll find those methods to be broadly commensurate with the knowledge of the day.
Option 2: These ancient civilisations had access to a level of technology more advanced than we have today. They left no evidence of this other than some stone pyramids, which could have been built using traditional hard labour. Then they forgot about it.
Option 3: Aliens came down to Earth and constructed the pyramids using their super-advanced anti-gravity machines and cutting tools, as a cryptic warning to future civilisations against something or other.
Shh, I'm thinking...
To be fair to Westy I don't believe he necessarily subscribes to 2 or 3. As I understand it he thinks they made use of iron implements earlier than is widely believed amongst Egyptologists. Mainly because he thinks copper implements were inadequate and/or not available in sufficient quantity. I think this is a theory lacking in evidence and ignores the fact that people have demonstrated that copper implements are all that's required. I think it's wrong but not flat out mental like the UFO proponents.
Admittedly I'm not sure where all of the speed of light guff from the documentary in the OP fits in.
Admittedly I'm not sure where all of the speed of light guff from the documentary in the OP fits in.
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