Red Bull Stratos: A Mission to the Edge of Space. 08th Oct
Discussion
AnotherClarkey said:
mrmr96 said:
Mach 1.24 unofficially achieved. (From live press conference)
Absolutely amazing. I wonder what it felt like (if it felt like anything at all)? Makes you wonder what a high altitude emergency bail-out from a spacecraft might be like.Protection from the heat would be the main problem. A couple of years ago, I spoke to a representative of an Italian company that was developing a personal "re-entry bag" to allow escape from a crashing re-entering spaceship. It was essentially a cloth, zip-up sphere, which was impregnated with ceramic fibres to prevent it from buring up.
The problem with bailing out of a spcecraft is that the spacecraft has to have initiated re-entry first before the astronauts can jump out to make their own separate re-entry. If the spacecraft is in orbit and somebody "bails out" - all they do is continue in orbit floating alongside the spacecraft. They may re-enter naturally - but that could take weeks - and by then they would have long run out of air.
Eric Mc said:
AnotherClarkey said:
mrmr96 said:
Mach 1.24 unofficially achieved. (From live press conference)
Absolutely amazing. I wonder what it felt like (if it felt like anything at all)? Makes you wonder what a high altitude emergency bail-out from a spacecraft might be like.Protection from the heat would be the main problem. A couple of years ago, I spoke to a representative of an Italian company that was developing a personal "re-entry bag" to allow escape from a crashing re-entering spaceship. It was essentially a cloth, zip-up sphere, which was impregnated with ceramic fibres to prevent it from buring up.
The problem with bailing out of a spcecraft is that the spacecraft has to have initiated re-entry first before the astronauts can jump out to make their own separate re-entry. If the spacecraft is in orbit and somebody "bails out" - all they do is continue in orbit floating alongside the spacecraft. They may re-enter naturally - but that could take weeks - and by then they would have long run out of air.
They would need to have some sort of rocket (and the related fuel system) to enable them to slow enough to start re-entry. The space shuttle knocked off about 200 mph from its orbital velocity of 17,500 mph - which allowed its trajectory to change and for the shuttle to intercept the upper layers of the atmosphere - which then initiated rentry. However, the gap between firing the rockets and re-entry begining was about 30 to 45 minutes.
A human would need to slow down a bit more rapidly as their air supply would probably not be able to last that long - unless thay had the equivalent of an EVA backpack in each re-entry sphere.
I'm sure it's not an insurmountable problem - but a lot of work would need to go into such devices before they become viable - if ever.
A human would need to slow down a bit more rapidly as their air supply would probably not be able to last that long - unless thay had the equivalent of an EVA backpack in each re-entry sphere.
I'm sure it's not an insurmountable problem - but a lot of work would need to go into such devices before they become viable - if ever.
Eric Mc said:
Would be a VERY different proposition. The atmospheric entry speed would be in the order of 17,500 mph for a start (not Zero as it was for Baumgartner).
Protection from the heat would be the main problem. A couple of years ago, I spoke to a representative of an Italian company that was developing a personal "re-entry bag" to allow escape from a crashing re-entering spaceship. It was essentially a cloth, zip-up sphere, which was impregnated with ceramic fibres to prevent it from buring up.
The problem with bailing out of a spcecraft is that the spacecraft has to have initiated re-entry first before the astronauts can jump out to make their own separate re-entry. If the spacecraft is in orbit and somebody "bails out" - all they do is continue in orbit floating alongside the spacecraft. They may re-enter naturally - but that could take weeks - and by then they would have long run out of air.
Certainly a re-entry bailout would be a complex proposition but what about during ascent? I wonder whether this jump has added or taken away credibility from the pole they fitted to Shuttles after Challenger that was meant to poke out through the hatch and facilitate the crew getting out at high speed?Protection from the heat would be the main problem. A couple of years ago, I spoke to a representative of an Italian company that was developing a personal "re-entry bag" to allow escape from a crashing re-entering spaceship. It was essentially a cloth, zip-up sphere, which was impregnated with ceramic fibres to prevent it from buring up.
The problem with bailing out of a spcecraft is that the spacecraft has to have initiated re-entry first before the astronauts can jump out to make their own separate re-entry. If the spacecraft is in orbit and somebody "bails out" - all they do is continue in orbit floating alongside the spacecraft. They may re-enter naturally - but that could take weeks - and by then they would have long run out of air.
AnotherClarkey said:
Certainly a re-entry bailout would be a complex proposition but what about during ascent? I wonder whether this jump has added or taken away credibility from the pole they fitted to Shuttles after Challenger that was meant to poke out through the hatch and facilitate the crew getting out at high speed?
Why would it have taken away, the only problem would have been the process of getting unstrapped, opening the door and jumping, the descent shouldn't have been a problem as they'll be in pressurised space suits during launch?AnotherClarkey said:
Eric Mc said:
Would be a VERY different proposition. The atmospheric entry speed would be in the order of 17,500 mph for a start (not Zero as it was for Baumgartner).
Protection from the heat would be the main problem. A couple of years ago, I spoke to a representative of an Italian company that was developing a personal "re-entry bag" to allow escape from a crashing re-entering spaceship. It was essentially a cloth, zip-up sphere, which was impregnated with ceramic fibres to prevent it from buring up.
The problem with bailing out of a spcecraft is that the spacecraft has to have initiated re-entry first before the astronauts can jump out to make their own separate re-entry. If the spacecraft is in orbit and somebody "bails out" - all they do is continue in orbit floating alongside the spacecraft. They may re-enter naturally - but that could take weeks - and by then they would have long run out of air.
Certainly a re-entry bailout would be a complex proposition but what about during ascent? I wonder whether this jump has added or taken away credibility from the pole they fitted to Shuttles after Challenger that was meant to poke out through the hatch and facilitate the crew getting out at high speed?Protection from the heat would be the main problem. A couple of years ago, I spoke to a representative of an Italian company that was developing a personal "re-entry bag" to allow escape from a crashing re-entering spaceship. It was essentially a cloth, zip-up sphere, which was impregnated with ceramic fibres to prevent it from buring up.
The problem with bailing out of a spcecraft is that the spacecraft has to have initiated re-entry first before the astronauts can jump out to make their own separate re-entry. If the spacecraft is in orbit and somebody "bails out" - all they do is continue in orbit floating alongside the spacecraft. They may re-enter naturally - but that could take weeks - and by then they would have long run out of air.
There was no escape at all from a Shuttle during ascent.
Eric Mc said:
The pole escape system could not be used during ascent and it could not be used during descent until the speed had dropped to about 300 mph or so. In other words, its only "window of use" was in the last ten minutes before landing.
There was no escape at all from a Shuttle during ascent.
Yes, I had just scuttled away and read up on it. Seemed a lot of trouble to go to for something that could only be used from controlled flight at low altitude and speed.There was no escape at all from a Shuttle during ascent.
Eric Mc said:
They would need to have some sort of rocket (and the related fuel system) to enable them to slow enough to start re-entry. The space shuttle knocked off about 200 mph from its orbital velocity of 17,500 mph - which allowed its trajectory to change and for the shuttle to intercept the upper layers of the atmosphere - which then initiated rentry. However, the gap between firing the rockets and re-entry begining was about 30 to 45 minutes.
A human would need to slow down a bit more rapidly as their air supply would probably not be able to last that long - unless thay had the equivalent of an EVA backpack in each re-entry sphere.
I'm sure it's not an insurmountable problem - but a lot of work would need to go into such devices before they become viable - if ever.
A small solid rocket motor would probably do the job, though you'd also need an attitude control system to make sure you were pointing the right way when it fired. You'd also need to make sure whatever propulsion system was used gave the correct delta V to avoid either skipping off the atmosphere or coming in too steep and burning up/suffering excessive deceleration g forcesA human would need to slow down a bit more rapidly as their air supply would probably not be able to last that long - unless thay had the equivalent of an EVA backpack in each re-entry sphere.
I'm sure it's not an insurmountable problem - but a lot of work would need to go into such devices before they become viable - if ever.
MartG said:
Eric Mc said:
They would need to have some sort of rocket (and the related fuel system) to enable them to slow enough to start re-entry. The space shuttle knocked off about 200 mph from its orbital velocity of 17,500 mph - which allowed its trajectory to change and for the shuttle to intercept the upper layers of the atmosphere - which then initiated rentry. However, the gap between firing the rockets and re-entry begining was about 30 to 45 minutes.
A human would need to slow down a bit more rapidly as their air supply would probably not be able to last that long - unless thay had the equivalent of an EVA backpack in each re-entry sphere.
I'm sure it's not an insurmountable problem - but a lot of work would need to go into such devices before they become viable - if ever.
A small solid rocket motor would probably do the job, though you'd also need an attitude control system to make sure you were pointing the right way when it fired. You'd also need to make sure whatever propulsion system was used gave the correct delta V to avoid either skipping off the atmosphere or coming in too steep and burning up/suffering excessive deceleration g forcesA human would need to slow down a bit more rapidly as their air supply would probably not be able to last that long - unless thay had the equivalent of an EVA backpack in each re-entry sphere.
I'm sure it's not an insurmountable problem - but a lot of work would need to go into such devices before they become viable - if ever.
Which is more or less what was decided on in the end. Powerful ejector seats were fitted for the first three Shuttle missions but even they only offered a very limited amount of added safety. They couldn't really be used during ascent. If they were fired at low altitude, the astronauts would have entered the SRB plumes and killed. If they ejected after the SRBs were spent, they were two high for use.
I well remember the call "Columbia, you are negative seats".
I well remember the call "Columbia, you are negative seats".
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