Manned Spaceflight - the Next 30 Years
Discussion
http://uk.businessinsider.com/5-undeniable-reasons...
Interesting article here about the need for manned missions to Mars.
Interesting article here about the need for manned missions to Mars.
el stovey said:
So should we/they/you be concentrating on developing and using drones to go to Mars and deliver and build a habitable base there? The limiting factors are the systems for supporting humans. What do we want from Mars? If it's just resources, we can get them without even sending people there.
Why do humans need to go at all. Everyone was inspired by the first moon missions but even those lost popularity after a while. I'm all for manned space exploration but do humans just need to go into space when the earth is no longer a suitable home.
The main problem is funding and governments are now unwilling to fund manned expeditions into space just because "it's there" or "because it's hard" there needs to be a real use for human space flight. The previous need was because of the Cold War. What's the need now?
Who knows. All I know is that the human race is an "exploring" race and once a location has been identified a human being will want to get there. For the vast bulk of our existence the only way to experience a location was to be there in person. With modern technology we can, to some extent, experience these locations remotely. But I still think the urge to physically stand at a place - however remote - is literally part of our DNA.Why do humans need to go at all. Everyone was inspired by the first moon missions but even those lost popularity after a while. I'm all for manned space exploration but do humans just need to go into space when the earth is no longer a suitable home.
The main problem is funding and governments are now unwilling to fund manned expeditions into space just because "it's there" or "because it's hard" there needs to be a real use for human space flight. The previous need was because of the Cold War. What's the need now?
And it MAY BE the main reason we have been such a successful organism on this planet.
I feel that if we do NOT actually travel to these places in person, we are doomed as a species. It is fundamentally contradicting who and what we are by NOT going.
However, I am having a job stopping people raising the issue of whether man should be in space. That was not the point of this thread. Man is ALREADY in space and will be for the foreseeable future. The point of this thread was to chat about the technologies and targets for maned flight over the next few decades.
Eric Mc said:
Who knows. All I know is that the human race is an "exploring" race and once a location has been identified a human being will want to get there. For the vast bulk of our existence the only way to experience a location was to be there in person. With modern technology we can, to some extent, experience these locations remotely. But I still think the urge to physically stand at a place - however remote - is literally part of our DNA.
Eric an expanded view could be exploration does not have to be in person and if the 'experience' is required this could be achieved by Telepresence which is sensation of being elsewhere, created by virtual reality technology, as this technology gets better then there is less reason for Humans to be at the actual location, also this can be a shared experience. And what of Cybernetics how will this change the need to actually be at the 'location'
Eric Mc said:
And it MAY BE the main reason we have been such a successful organism on this planet.
Success is debatable in how man is tearing up the planets resources,and whole species being wipe out because of Humans and their success may be Agent smith was right when he described Humans are a Virus https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rvuueqs3vI
Eric Mc said:
I feel that if we do NOT actually travel to these places in person, we are doomed as a species. It is fundamentally contradicting who and what we are by NOT going.
If we continue to wreck our own planet then we are doomed anyway 
Eric Mc said:
However, I am having a job stopping people raising the issue of whether man should be in space. That was not the point of this thread. Man is ALREADY in space and will be for the foreseeable future. The point of this thread was to chat about the technologies and targets for maned flight over the next few decades.
Agreed Man is in space, near space that is and looking at the technologies we won't have huge numbers of humans in space for a considerable time if ever so robots, drones and VR seem the best way to overcome an awful lot of these issues and will still allow exploration to happen this should not be viewed as negative but highly efficient and productive.
Eric Mc said:
But not very exciting for those who really want to go to these places. And there will be people like that. Being "efficient" isn't what inspires people.
Eric by using VR you will be able to experience other worlds and would open up the possibility for all to experience what being at that other world would be like, what this means is that rather than traveling to the experience the experience comes to you.The air force are using drones, the pilots are at the base with displays as if they where in the cockpit, ships can be sent around the world without a crew, Google, Apple, Tesla and the major motor manufacturers are creating driver assisted or driverless cars, using software from companies such as windriver http://www.windriver.com/whitepapers/autonomous-dr...
Like it or not autonomous systems are here, have a look at Robonaut, the First Humanoid Robot in Space
"Robonaut 2, or R2, which launched to the International Space Station on the space shuttle Discovery as part of the STS-133 mission, is the first dexterous humanoid robot in space. The computing environment chosen for the Robonaut project includes several state-of-the-art technologies. R2 uses the VxWorks RTOS to support varied development activities".
The nEUROn Unmanned Combat Aerial Vehicle (UCAV) demonstrator, the first large-size stealth platform designed in Europe
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embed...
Or what about Northrop Grumman X-47B Achieves Historic Catapult Launch and Landing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PL9BA73768DFBBC...
And MBARI Breaking New Ground with Integrated Unmanned Submersible Research Platforms
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embed...
Thinking about it isn't the Sea a in hospitable environment isn't that what other planets are?
Going back to your question around manned flights, there may be some but limited against the background of autonomous exploration.
Just edited to say this is space exploration and Science it isn't always sexy or exciting however for the scientist involved it can be enormously inspirational and exciting. I believe it was Prof Laura Mersini-Houghton spoke briefly on a BBC documentary a short while ago argued a theory of the existence of parallel universe's (Multiverse)and has now found some evidence to support it. She described the moment she saw the CMB and what it meant and how excited she was.
So is science exiting, well it can be but it can also be quite dry as well but I guess that's what makes us all different.
Edited by Toaster on Friday 30th October 11:29
Edited by Toaster on Friday 30th October 11:30
Eric Mc said:
And I wish people would stop trying to slew the topic into a debate of "manned v'unmanned" spaceflight (not you Mart).
Maybe I should start a topic called "Unmanned Spaceflight - the Next 30 years" and see how that thread goes.
Eric, you asked about manned space flight over the next 30 years, the answer if you choose to be rational based on current technology and drivers is very few, the majority will be autonomous.Maybe I should start a topic called "Unmanned Spaceflight - the Next 30 years" and see how that thread goes.
Now starting from a rational standpoint where will man go and how many
and finally the topic should be spaceflight over the next 30 years
Toaster said:
Eric, you asked about manned space flight over the next 30 years, the answer if you choose to be rational based on current technology and drivers is very few, the majority will be autonomous.
Now starting from a rational standpoint where will man go and how many
and finally the topic should be spaceflight over the next 30 years
Start another thread if you want to to cover the unmanned spectrum. It's an interesting topic in its own right - just not as interesting on the basis that the unmanned programmes will be a case of a continuation and refinement of what we are currently doing.Now starting from a rational standpoint where will man go and how many
and finally the topic should be spaceflight over the next 30 years
I decided on this topic as there are lots of pretty new and imminent upcoming manned options. We haven't been in this situation for a long time - if ever. I actually think we are at the start of a new era for manned spaceflight and we don't yet know exactly where it will lead and how it will evolve over the next 30 years.
I selected 30 years as to me, that is about the life span that you will expect to get out of one particular class of space technology. The Shuttle operated for 34 years. Soyuz, in its various permutations, is now over 40 years old.
MartG said:
And completely ignores the communications delay - turn your head and 40 minutes later your view of Mars moves
Not if the area was downloaded first there would not be a delay, therefore you would be within a virtual environment in 'real time' https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bO7wE8snf2E.Eric Mc said:
Speaking of trains - stop trying to derail the thread.
Eric surely not acknowledging that multiple technologies will help exploration of our planets provides an incomplete picture, will man fly to Mars in the next 30 years? Is there going to be wholesale human activity on the moon with moon bases this is doubtful. In fact there is more chance of becoming a driver of a steam train.
Its all guess ology and if the past predicts the future then you know its only going to be a handful of manned space flights.
Eric, IMO what we need is a Space Ship.
Yes, we have Orion (probably when its ready) which is a great command module but no one is seriously going to want to spend months or even weeks in it without some more space to do/store things.
Since you mentioned The Martian, one thing Andy got right (IMVHO) was the need for and rough specs of a Space Ship, although he hand-waves through the details of Hermes in terms of "its radiation shielded" he's right on when saying "it was so expensive they just built one and it will be used on all the Mars missions" and that is what perhaps we should be aiming towards?
Build a one off Space ship (doesn't have to be pretty) just a glorified ISS with motive power, shielding etc, use it for Moon visits, asteroid tours and Mars trips, manned Venus flyby :-) or whatever and each time bring it back to LEO, resupply, new crew then off they go again.
Yes, we have Orion (probably when its ready) which is a great command module but no one is seriously going to want to spend months or even weeks in it without some more space to do/store things.
Since you mentioned The Martian, one thing Andy got right (IMVHO) was the need for and rough specs of a Space Ship, although he hand-waves through the details of Hermes in terms of "its radiation shielded" he's right on when saying "it was so expensive they just built one and it will be used on all the Mars missions" and that is what perhaps we should be aiming towards?
Build a one off Space ship (doesn't have to be pretty) just a glorified ISS with motive power, shielding etc, use it for Moon visits, asteroid tours and Mars trips, manned Venus flyby :-) or whatever and each time bring it back to LEO, resupply, new crew then off they go again.
I'm sure something along those lines will get built - and possibly within the next twenty years. The Orion module is designed to be used with an attached "habitation section" - a bit like the Laboratory section of the US Air Force's cancelled MOL project. Not quite as grandiose as "Hermes" in "The Martian" but I'm sure it could be enlarged and added to as the ISS was.
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