Discussion
Speed addicted said:
What if the capsule breaks down or catches fire, you would be stuck between stations in an environment you couldn't survive. It's not just airless, it's a vacuum so things like scuba masks wouldn't work, you would need a space suit.
It would be like being in a submarine that couldn't surface. I think the biggest problem with this wouldn't be the technical side, it would be selling it to people as a safe way of traveling.
Well - people get on planes don't they? The failure modes there are just as disastrous.It would be like being in a submarine that couldn't surface. I think the biggest problem with this wouldn't be the technical side, it would be selling it to people as a safe way of traveling.
Its a bit daft.
The amount of power required to maintain a vacuum/or low pressure over a long distance of pipework will be immense. I suspect the little you gain from pushing a vehicle through the lower pressure will be offset by the cost of maintaining the vacuum. However interesting to see the figures.
As for its invention. I assume the actual new technology here with be the method of creating the vacuum over that distance. If its proved to work then BR no doubt will start creating plastic covers for its train track, but I wouldn't hold your breath.
Also the invention isn't actually an invention. As jumbo jets have been flying at high altitudes for this very reason since the jet engine was invented. You could almost say the inventor of the jet engine invented this, because it was likely forefront in his mind when deciding that jet engines had a benefit.
The amount of power required to maintain a vacuum/or low pressure over a long distance of pipework will be immense. I suspect the little you gain from pushing a vehicle through the lower pressure will be offset by the cost of maintaining the vacuum. However interesting to see the figures.
As for its invention. I assume the actual new technology here with be the method of creating the vacuum over that distance. If its proved to work then BR no doubt will start creating plastic covers for its train track, but I wouldn't hold your breath.
Also the invention isn't actually an invention. As jumbo jets have been flying at high altitudes for this very reason since the jet engine was invented. You could almost say the inventor of the jet engine invented this, because it was likely forefront in his mind when deciding that jet engines had a benefit.
I really don't "get" this as an infrastructure add on.
We have trains which run on comparatively simple infrastructure at respectable speeds. This thing runs on much more complex infrastructure, which will be subject to the same building constraints as existing rails - so it won't be able to go in a dead straight line any more than HS2 can.
It's also not that clear on the "scale" of the pods - are there going to be pods like trains, or are there going to be a multitude of small pods going point to point? The large pods will suffer badly from the requirements to stop - the thing will have to decelerate, get onto a platform "branch", repressurise, open the doors, let people on and off, depressurise, accelerate again. The idea of this whizzing around at anything like 500 mph is delusional in terms of average speed. Small pods are going to need a quite extraordinary level of scheduling to maintain speeds on a network - pods joining the "main line" will need to accelerate incredibly fast to join the "flow".
If you had a world with huge point to point requirements (as opposed to stopping services), then it might fly. You build a pair of tubes between the points and large pods + small pods can all sit in the tunnel at 500 mph. Unfortunately, planet earth is not really laid out like that. IMO Musk has a greater chance of building this on Mars than Earth.
We have trains which run on comparatively simple infrastructure at respectable speeds. This thing runs on much more complex infrastructure, which will be subject to the same building constraints as existing rails - so it won't be able to go in a dead straight line any more than HS2 can.
It's also not that clear on the "scale" of the pods - are there going to be pods like trains, or are there going to be a multitude of small pods going point to point? The large pods will suffer badly from the requirements to stop - the thing will have to decelerate, get onto a platform "branch", repressurise, open the doors, let people on and off, depressurise, accelerate again. The idea of this whizzing around at anything like 500 mph is delusional in terms of average speed. Small pods are going to need a quite extraordinary level of scheduling to maintain speeds on a network - pods joining the "main line" will need to accelerate incredibly fast to join the "flow".
If you had a world with huge point to point requirements (as opposed to stopping services), then it might fly. You build a pair of tubes between the points and large pods + small pods can all sit in the tunnel at 500 mph. Unfortunately, planet earth is not really laid out like that. IMO Musk has a greater chance of building this on Mars than Earth.
julian64 said:
Its a bit daft.
The amount of power required to maintain a vacuum/or low pressure over a long distance of pipework will be immense. I suspect the little you gain from pushing a vehicle through the lower pressure will be offset by the cost of maintaining the vacuum. However interesting to see the figures.
Does it maintain the vacuum throughout the length or does it do it in sections as the pods pass through?The amount of power required to maintain a vacuum/or low pressure over a long distance of pipework will be immense. I suspect the little you gain from pushing a vehicle through the lower pressure will be offset by the cost of maintaining the vacuum. However interesting to see the figures.
It would make sense to section it all as it can't be a vacuum at the 'stations'.
rxe said:
... Unfortunately, planet earth is not really laid out like that. IMO Musk has a greater chance of building this on Mars than Earth.
Could work in countries like China. They don't really have planning procedures that listen to stakeholders and allow Swampy to handcuff himself to a tree with 3 appeals by Human Rights lawyers 
they just proceed at speed and anyone who gets in the way is bulldozed.But does appear unlikely to take off.
Wonder who is funding this? Is it government, as Branson is broke having bailed out his airline (Yes, not broke as in broke, but you know what I mean)
Edited by hyphen on Wednesday 11th November 11:19
feef said:
julian64 said:
Its a bit daft.
The amount of power required to maintain a vacuum/or low pressure over a long distance of pipework will be immense. I suspect the little you gain from pushing a vehicle through the lower pressure will be offset by the cost of maintaining the vacuum. However interesting to see the figures.
Does it maintain the vacuum throughout the length or does it do it in sections as the pods pass through?The amount of power required to maintain a vacuum/or low pressure over a long distance of pipework will be immense. I suspect the little you gain from pushing a vehicle through the lower pressure will be offset by the cost of maintaining the vacuum. However interesting to see the figures.
It would make sense to section it all as it can't be a vacuum at the 'stations'.
jammy-git said:
feef said:
julian64 said:
Its a bit daft.
The amount of power required to maintain a vacuum/or low pressure over a long distance of pipework will be immense. I suspect the little you gain from pushing a vehicle through the lower pressure will be offset by the cost of maintaining the vacuum. However interesting to see the figures.
Does it maintain the vacuum throughout the length or does it do it in sections as the pods pass through?The amount of power required to maintain a vacuum/or low pressure over a long distance of pipework will be immense. I suspect the little you gain from pushing a vehicle through the lower pressure will be offset by the cost of maintaining the vacuum. However interesting to see the figures.
It would make sense to section it all as it can't be a vacuum at the 'stations'.
volume of the tube per km length
time it would take to evacuate 1 km of tube
work out length that can be evacuated in the time it takes to cover the same distance
that won't factor in the time it takes to open and close gates, but it should give an idea if it's remotely feasible,
Beati Dogu said:
Places like the test track in Nevada are built to work out the practicalities. I'm sure a lot of theoretical work has gone on already.
Nah. I bet it's just been like The A-Team. They've just stuck a load of guys in a lock-up for a few weeks with nothing but a welder and some old car scraps and told them to build it.rxe said:
We have trains which run on comparatively simple infrastructure at respectable speeds.
And today, in alot of countries, that existing, really simple network, is obsolete and running very very poorly. Try and use a train the uk, and once you've been nearly bankrupted by the cost, you'll be physically amazed by the lack of comfort, the fact nothing runs on time, and the poor cross-linking of final mile services etcSo, the hyperloop, which brings significantly higher costs to everything from track to rolling stock, how exactly is that going to solve any problem we have with trains?
I mean, Virgin Trains are currently a joke and struggling to maintain any sort of commercial viability, how is Virgin Hyperloop going to be any better?
Monty Python said:
Just watched Virgin's latest video, and couldn't help noticing that they didn't even build a proper pod - all they've done is chopped up a private jet and used part of the fuselage. What a joke.
not a bad way to get started. it's already a pressure vessel designed for passenger transportGassing Station | Science! | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff