Has anyone ever done an engine replacement.
Discussion
Im wanting to modify my car to my personal preference, the only thing stopping me at the moment is the concern of how much an engine replacement costs should anything go wrong.
Has anyone ever blown an engine and can advise what each option is like, is it cheaper to refurb the engine or get a second hand engine, how do you arrange to get a second hand engine fitted if its from a scrapyard and how do you arrange it with a garage. How much does the labour usually cost to straight swap an engine on average, i know there will be variables? How much are refurbs compared to second hand engine?
I can find engines for my car for 2.5k as an idea.
Did you keep your car after swapping the engine, any other associated problems surface? Did it put you off the car?
I wont really be putting more power through my engine (maybe a stage 1 remap) but i know modifications will cancel out any potential goodwill from the manufacturer so just preparing myself worst case.
Has anyone ever blown an engine and can advise what each option is like, is it cheaper to refurb the engine or get a second hand engine, how do you arrange to get a second hand engine fitted if its from a scrapyard and how do you arrange it with a garage. How much does the labour usually cost to straight swap an engine on average, i know there will be variables? How much are refurbs compared to second hand engine?
I can find engines for my car for 2.5k as an idea.
Did you keep your car after swapping the engine, any other associated problems surface? Did it put you off the car?
I wont really be putting more power through my engine (maybe a stage 1 remap) but i know modifications will cancel out any potential goodwill from the manufacturer so just preparing myself worst case.
Depends on the car/engine. I had a modified Rover 200 in the early noughties and got it to the point where I wanted to swap the 1.8 k series for a 2.0 turbo from a Tomcat. Came to the conclusion that the end result would not be effective so I sold it and bought a 200SX S14a instead.
I did have the engine replaced in my Focus ST mk2 as the cambelt went and took the valves with it. Ford wanted £10k fitted for an official recon lump but I got a second hand engine from a breakers and got a local trusted garage to fit it for c£2k all in (an RS engine would have been £2k from the same place). It drove better than it did before so I modded it to stage 2 soon after and kept it for over a year. Great car.
I did have the engine replaced in my Focus ST mk2 as the cambelt went and took the valves with it. Ford wanted £10k fitted for an official recon lump but I got a second hand engine from a breakers and got a local trusted garage to fit it for c£2k all in (an RS engine would have been £2k from the same place). It drove better than it did before so I modded it to stage 2 soon after and kept it for over a year. Great car.
If it's same engine type back into a car, the logistics of size and weight, as well as taking your time and being methodical are the biggest things.
If it's modifying a car to take a better engine, IMHO you need the WHOLE donor car unless it's a swap you've done before.
Source: built 24v cosworth mk3 capri. Would not do again.
If it's modifying a car to take a better engine, IMHO you need the WHOLE donor car unless it's a swap you've done before.
Source: built 24v cosworth mk3 capri. Would not do again.
Last one I did was a 1600 CVH in place of a 1300 Endura, changed the box at the same time, four speed to five speed. Piece of cake, as the drive shafts were the same, the loom had the same ends on, and the hoses lined up.
Might be a slight bit more involved with a more modern motor...
Might be a slight bit more involved with a more modern motor...
Ultrafunkula said:
Depends on the car/engine. I had a modified Rover 200 in the early noughties and got it to the point where I wanted to swap the 1.8 k series for a 2.0 turbo from a Tomcat. Came to the conclusion that the end result would not be effective so I sold it and bought a 200SX S14a instead.
I did have the engine replaced in my Focus ST mk2 as the cambelt went and took the valves with it. Ford wanted £10k fitted for an official recon lump but I got a second hand engine from a breakers and got a local trusted garage to fit it for c£2k all in (an RS engine would have been £2k from the same place). It drove better than it did before so I modded it to stage 2 soon after and kept it for over a year. Great car.
Would any garages source and fit an engine and supply warranty etc? Eg if it was a bmw would a bmw indy supply and fit a used engine. I did have the engine replaced in my Focus ST mk2 as the cambelt went and took the valves with it. Ford wanted £10k fitted for an official recon lump but I got a second hand engine from a breakers and got a local trusted garage to fit it for c£2k all in (an RS engine would have been £2k from the same place). It drove better than it did before so I modded it to stage 2 soon after and kept it for over a year. Great car.
I've done this with cars that are now considered classics.
Examples:
- Triumph Dolomite Sprint engine into a TR7
- Triumph Dolomite Sprint engine into a Spitfire (friend's car, not mine)
- Triumph GT6 engine & gearbox into an MGB
- Chevy 5.7 Hemi-head into a Triumph Stag(!)
However, these were carb fed engines with simple wiring. Not so sure I'd fancy trying to do this with modern tech engines, where the engine swap is also going to require a new ECU, wiring looms, potential Canbus changes etc.
Examples:
- Triumph Dolomite Sprint engine into a TR7
- Triumph Dolomite Sprint engine into a Spitfire (friend's car, not mine)
- Triumph GT6 engine & gearbox into an MGB
- Chevy 5.7 Hemi-head into a Triumph Stag(!)
However, these were carb fed engines with simple wiring. Not so sure I'd fancy trying to do this with modern tech engines, where the engine swap is also going to require a new ECU, wiring looms, potential Canbus changes etc.
Do you mean swap in an identical engine, or fit a different type?
The former is pretty straight forward if you have the tools. You just need to know which bolts are reusable and which are one-time only then keep careful records of exactly what came from where as you take the old one out (many, many photographcs as you go is generally a good idea). Depending on how old the car is, some components (especially electrical plugs) will break as you remove them and will need replacing so don't expect to be able to do it in one go.
Generally front engined FWD cars are easier than anything driving the rear wheels because the hwole drivetrain can be removed in one piece but I've done it with front engined RWD cars without too much difficulty. I used to run a classic racing car and would happily swap engines over in a week's worth of eventings. The 2CV guys who were often racing the same day as us (yes people really do race 2CVs, highly amusing to watch) could swap engine in an hour (seemed to be quite a common occurance).
ETA: Ah just realised you're talking about paying someone else to do it rather than doing it yourself. I'd expect a garage to charge you a few tens of hours of labour. How many tends of hours will depend on the car. You wont get a warranty if you supply the parts yourself; some garages will supply used engines with a warranty but I've no idea how common it is if it's a straight replacement engine which hasn't been stripped down and rebuilt.
The former is pretty straight forward if you have the tools. You just need to know which bolts are reusable and which are one-time only then keep careful records of exactly what came from where as you take the old one out (many, many photographcs as you go is generally a good idea). Depending on how old the car is, some components (especially electrical plugs) will break as you remove them and will need replacing so don't expect to be able to do it in one go.
Generally front engined FWD cars are easier than anything driving the rear wheels because the hwole drivetrain can be removed in one piece but I've done it with front engined RWD cars without too much difficulty. I used to run a classic racing car and would happily swap engines over in a week's worth of eventings. The 2CV guys who were often racing the same day as us (yes people really do race 2CVs, highly amusing to watch) could swap engine in an hour (seemed to be quite a common occurance).
ETA: Ah just realised you're talking about paying someone else to do it rather than doing it yourself. I'd expect a garage to charge you a few tens of hours of labour. How many tends of hours will depend on the car. You wont get a warranty if you supply the parts yourself; some garages will supply used engines with a warranty but I've no idea how common it is if it's a straight replacement engine which hasn't been stripped down and rebuilt.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 22 July 09:05
Hi
My horsebox blew the engine at 300K miles. Renault chassis. Found Vauxhall engine on line and local garage swapped it no problem. We were all a bit worried about various bits all talking to each other but it started up first time and run perfectly since. Also many moons ago I swapped Morris Minor engine for a supercharged Ford engine. That made the B*****r go
Rob
My horsebox blew the engine at 300K miles. Renault chassis. Found Vauxhall engine on line and local garage swapped it no problem. We were all a bit worried about various bits all talking to each other but it started up first time and run perfectly since. Also many moons ago I swapped Morris Minor engine for a supercharged Ford engine. That made the B*****r go
Rob
Totally depends on the car, as others have said. Older stuff is much simpler to work on, owing to the lack of electronics. When I was 17 me and my brother changed the engine in his mini from an 850 to a 1000cc. Was a piece of cake that we did on our driveway in a weekend.
Wouldn't like to touch anything modern, although I'd happily have a go at my 182 if the need arose (and I could find the time...)
Wouldn't like to touch anything modern, although I'd happily have a go at my 182 if the need arose (and I could find the time...)
What car is it, and what do you want to do?
This is a very broad subject, and while fundamentally you can fit any engine in any car if ability/money/sheer bloodymindedness is there to support the idea, the kind of questions you're asking make it seem like youd be out of your depth very quickly.
This is a very broad subject, and while fundamentally you can fit any engine in any car if ability/money/sheer bloodymindedness is there to support the idea, the kind of questions you're asking make it seem like youd be out of your depth very quickly.
As has already been asked, depending on the car and engine really. It may be cheaper to modify (properly) what you have i.e. turbo charge it, supercharge etc.
Older engine swaps are easy, modern engines with multiple ECUs and sensors will require a far more technical approach with a good methodology or understanding on how wiring, sensor and looms impact on the running of the engine.
Then of course there's brake upgrades, suspension, insurance risk blah blah. All adds to the final bill, and ultimately you will pour thousands of pounds and man hours creating a beast that you may love but others will be less likely to purchase if you get bored or want to sell it. You have to be prepared to commit for the long haul!
Older engine swaps are easy, modern engines with multiple ECUs and sensors will require a far more technical approach with a good methodology or understanding on how wiring, sensor and looms impact on the running of the engine.
Then of course there's brake upgrades, suspension, insurance risk blah blah. All adds to the final bill, and ultimately you will pour thousands of pounds and man hours creating a beast that you may love but others will be less likely to purchase if you get bored or want to sell it. You have to be prepared to commit for the long haul!
Pupbelly said:
As has already been asked, depending on the car and engine really. It may be cheaper to modify (properly) what you have i.e. turbo charge it, supercharge etc.
Older engine swaps are easy, modern engines with multiple ECUs and sensors will require a far more technical approach with a good methodology or understanding on how wiring, sensor and looms impact on the running of the engine.
Then of course there's brake upgrades, suspension, insurance risk blah blah. All adds to the final bill, and ultimately you will pour thousands of pounds and man hours creating a beast that you may love but others will be less likely to purchase if you get bored or want to sell it. You have to be prepared to commit for the long haul!
This ^ and of coarse depending on your age if going for a change of engine, size, power, etc you my have insurance woes too , later cars are far more complicated to transplant a different engine than cars of old due to engine management exhaust emissions controls etc as mentioned already Older engine swaps are easy, modern engines with multiple ECUs and sensors will require a far more technical approach with a good methodology or understanding on how wiring, sensor and looms impact on the running of the engine.
Then of course there's brake upgrades, suspension, insurance risk blah blah. All adds to the final bill, and ultimately you will pour thousands of pounds and man hours creating a beast that you may love but others will be less likely to purchase if you get bored or want to sell it. You have to be prepared to commit for the long haul!
M140i B58 engine, nothing wrong with it like i say but going to modify the car and just want to know i can afford to get a new engine should this one go bang (although very unlikely as generally reliable) as i wont get any goodwill from bmw.
Just wanting an idea really, used engines appear to cost 2500, is that cheaper than refurb? What sort of labour costs etc to swap like for like?
Just wanting an idea really, used engines appear to cost 2500, is that cheaper than refurb? What sort of labour costs etc to swap like for like?
bigenginesmallcar said:
M140i B58 engine, nothing wrong with it like i say but going to modify the car and just want to know i can afford to get a new engine should this one go bang (although very unlikely as generally reliable) as i wont get any goodwill from bmw.
Just wanting an idea really, used engines appear to cost 2500, is that cheaper than refurb? What sort of labour costs etc to swap like for like?
Depends how the engine fails, I guess. Maybe be conservative with the mods so the engine isn’t thrashed excessively.Just wanting an idea really, used engines appear to cost 2500, is that cheaper than refurb? What sort of labour costs etc to swap like for like?
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