Truck driver rest rules....really?
Discussion
caelite said:
Hey guys can I ask a silly question? How do VOSA/DVSA confirm there identity before you pull over? It is still 8am and I haven't had my coffee but all I can imagine is the waving of wallets out of windows at 55mph which seems a bit unfeasible.
they use marked vehicles ...followed the presence of marked police vehicles when you fail to stop for them as anyone who fails to stop for a marked DVSA or HATO vehicle has committedthe same offence as failing to stop for a marked police vehicle
750turbo said:
And are the relevant enforcement agencies that anally retentive that they are going to do him for moving 0.015Kms?
Really?
Surely he should have parked in a designated parking area though?
As a lorry driver the answer is YES IT REALLY IS THAT BAD...Really?
Surely he should have parked in a designated parking area though?
Driver over into a rest period GET A FINE
Interrupt a rest period YOU HAVE TO START ALL OVER AGAIN, AND RUN THE RISK OF HAVING A FINE AS WELL
Break the speed limit by a couple of mph 27 days ago and get stopped this week, Tacho checked. GET A FINE
Not enough hours between yesterday finishing and today's work starting GET A FINE
The Tacho can be checked for the past twenty eight days and you get fined for each and every infringement.
HGV drivers are now the most policed activity in the country.. Probabily on par with terrorism
Imaging if your family car had a Tacho fitted and over the last 28 day your entire driving history was assessed.. How many finds do you think you would receive? I reckon the any one reading this thread would be getting their credit card hit for a couple of grand in one go with a fine of £100 for each offence
I understand the whole 'hate the black box' thing, although we need to remember you're bearing down on me with 44 tonnes of ballast.....but issuing speeding fines when 2mph over on the tacho
? Really? Surely they have to respect the 10%+2mph guidance too? You're being dramatic for effect yeah?
? Really? Surely they have to respect the 10%+2mph guidance too? You're being dramatic for effect yeah?
As far as I am aware, your tachograph can only be used to support a police officers opinion that you were speeding, but it cannot be checked retrospectively in order to prosecute you for speeding.
If its full of >60mph overspeed infractions then they aren't going to ignore it, in the same way that they wont if you hit the limiter a few hundred yards out of your yard gate too (which Ive seen an operator's licence restricted for).
If its full of >60mph overspeed infractions then they aren't going to ignore it, in the same way that they wont if you hit the limiter a few hundred yards out of your yard gate too (which Ive seen an operator's licence restricted for).
That would be more likely to be an infringement letter surely (maybe with points leading up to a disciplinary)? The company can set its own rules with regards to speed of course, but I wouldn't entertain signing an infringement letter in that circumstance as that's not what it is.
The law states that a restricted vehicle cannot be powered over 56mph, not that it may not travel over 56mph. It is very clear that the upper speed limit is 60mph.
Of course, I wouldn't put myself in this position if I was going abroad!
The law states that a restricted vehicle cannot be powered over 56mph, not that it may not travel over 56mph. It is very clear that the upper speed limit is 60mph.
Of course, I wouldn't put myself in this position if I was going abroad!
grumpy52 said:
mph1977 said:
grumpy52 said:
When I explained to the last vosa chap that pulled me over that in certain circumstances vehicles carrying certain loads won't pull over or follow to inspection places until they are confirmed as legitiimate by the police he was not a happy bunny .I then asked him if he would pull over for anybody driving a Galaxy with viynl and amber lights on it if you had a load worth £millions ?
He was very very grumpy after 40mins he could find nothing to take money off me for .
which is why the DVSA and HATO staff doing stopping are uniformed and have suitable IDs He was very very grumpy after 40mins he could find nothing to take money off me for .
also 'failure of the attitude test really doesn;t help
One vosa official even asked me if I was 'job' when he approached me mistaking my work clothes for a uniform under a two tone hi-viz .
Anyone having security training is taught that the most common instance of high value load theft after inside knowledge is impersonation of police or other officials usually VOSA or Customs , trust no one !
Zedboy1200 said:
I understand the whole 'hate the black box' thing, although we need to remember you're bearing down on me with 44 tonnes of ballast.....but issuing speeding fines when 2mph over on the tacho
? Really? Surely they have to respect the 10%+2mph guidance too? You're being dramatic for effect yeah?
No not at all.. VOSA/DSA is now self funding, that's correct they have to pay for them selves... The only way they can do that is by fining drivers..? Really? Surely they have to respect the 10%+2mph guidance too? You're being dramatic for effect yeah?
Also forgot to mention that if you don't carry a card to prove that you did 35hrs CPC classroom training (even if you have been driving for thirty years you can be fined upto a £1000 even though they hold that information on computer...
GC8 said:
As far as I am aware, your tachograph can only be used to support a police officers opinion that you were speeding, but it cannot be checked retrospectively in order to prosecute you for speeding.
If its full of >60mph overspeed infractions then they aren't going to ignore it, in the same way that they wont if you hit the limiter a few hundred yards out of your yard gate too (which Ive seen an operator's licence restricted for).
No Vosa pull you over and check the info ... There are hundreds of Vosa checkpoints and hundreds of mobile patrols with this facility.... They might just give you a bIf its full of >60mph overspeed infractions then they aren't going to ignore it, in the same way that they wont if you hit the limiter a few hundred yards out of your yard gate too (which Ive seen an operator's licence restricted for).
king for a single minor infringement, but at the end of the day if they don't fine you there is no money in the kitty to pay thier wages... It is in thier interest to fine youGC8 said:
That would be more likely to be an infringement letter surely (maybe with points leading up to a disciplinary)? The company can set its own rules with regards to speed of course, but I wouldn't entertain signing an infringement letter in that circumstance as that's not what it is.
The law states that a restricted vehicle cannot be powered over 56mph, not that it may not travel over 56mph. It is very clear that the upper speed limit is 60mph.
Of course, I wouldn't put myself in this position if I was going abroad!
VOSA have credit card machines and can take payment on the spot ...The law states that a restricted vehicle cannot be powered over 56mph, not that it may not travel over 56mph. It is very clear that the upper speed limit is 60mph.
Of course, I wouldn't put myself in this position if I was going abroad!
It is a very different world these days
Muzzer79 said:
I don't think Snapper is talking about Police/VOSA retrospectively fining you; more the employer?
Both police and Vosa have access to your Tacho.. Don't carry credit card machine so they are now more likely to issue a NIP or involve Vosa... But yes it is Vosa fining you.. They now seem to have more power than the police these day regarding trucking.
Not only can they fine you. They can then fine or investigate the haulage company as well if you have a number of infringements and go through there intire fleet of drivers in one go if they want.
Drivers have to download their Tacho cards at the haulage base regularly and the haulage company has to hold two year worth of information on their whole fleet of trucks...
As for the firm fining driver.. I have not been in that situation.. But if an employer thinks the you are getting too many infringements they will have some tough words with you. And if that does not work they will get rid of you especially if they think that you would be putting there haulage licence at risk... Can lay some very heavy fines at the haulage company and even cancel their operators licence if they feel that it warrants it...
It is one off the reasons there is a big shortage of drivers... While doing my CPC training we was informed that last year approx 40,000 drivers left the haulage business due to conditions, wages, lifestyle, hours etc and approximate only 1400 new drivers pass their test a year..
As a recently newly qualified class 1 driver I was surprised at the number of job offers I got and all the employers have stated how they are really struggling to fill the vacancies....
Pretty sure GC8 has been a trucker for quite some time so he'll already be aware of most of that but this is just a load of old bks I'm afraid:
Fact is there is no driver shortage. The vast majority of those alleged 40k drivers will have left through retirement, nothing else.
What there actually is, is:
= a shortage of companies that aren't yet in the real world when it comes to pay and conditions.
= a shortage of drivers willing to work for peanuts.
Too many companies out there still paying less than a tenner an hour with time 1.5 after 8 for class 1 and so go crying to the RHA claiming there's a driver shortage when they can't get any mugs to steer their wagons. Up the money and your driver recruitment problems will instantly vanish. But most of them can't because they've already slashed the rates back to the bone to get the contracts and they would no longer make any profit if they increased the staff wages. There's still a lot of haulage firms out there that need to die before things will get better (and that's debatable with the doors opening to the Romanian's). At the moment they're managing to hang on by a thread due to the current drop in fuel costs but the writing is still on the wall.
ks I'm afraid:Snapper7 said:
It is one off the reasons there is a big shortage of drivers... While doing my CPC training we was informed that last year approx 40,000 drivers left the haulage business due to conditions, wages, lifestyle, hours etc and approximate only 1400 new drivers pass their test a year..
As a recently newly qualified class 1 driver I was surprised at the number of job offers I got and all the employers have stated how they are really struggling to fill the vacancies....
Of course it wouldn't be in the DCPC trainer's interests to tell everyone there's a driver shortage, would it? No VI there at all... oh no.. As a recently newly qualified class 1 driver I was surprised at the number of job offers I got and all the employers have stated how they are really struggling to fill the vacancies....
Fact is there is no driver shortage. The vast majority of those alleged 40k drivers will have left through retirement, nothing else.
What there actually is, is:
= a shortage of companies that aren't yet in the real world when it comes to pay and conditions.
= a shortage of drivers willing to work for peanuts.
Too many companies out there still paying less than a tenner an hour with time 1.5 after 8 for class 1 and so go crying to the RHA claiming there's a driver shortage when they can't get any mugs to steer their wagons. Up the money and your driver recruitment problems will instantly vanish. But most of them can't because they've already slashed the rates back to the bone to get the contracts and they would no longer make any profit if they increased the staff wages. There's still a lot of haulage firms out there that need to die before things will get better (and that's debatable with the doors opening to the Romanian's). At the moment they're managing to hang on by a thread due to the current drop in fuel costs but the writing is still on the wall.
All that jazz said:
Of course it wouldn't be in the DCPC trainer's interests to tell everyone there's a driver shortage, would it? No VI there at all... oh no..
Fact is there is no driver shortage. The vast majority of those alleged 40k drivers will have left through retirement, nothing else.
What there actually is, is:
= a shortage of companies that aren't yet in the real world when it comes to pay and conditions.
= a shortage of drivers willing to work for peanuts.
Too many companies out there still paying less than a tenner an hour with time 1.5 after 8 for class 1 and so go crying to the RHA claiming there's a driver shortage when they can't get any mugs to steer their wagons. Up the money and your driver recruitment problems will instantly vanish. But most of them can't because they've already slashed the rates back to the bone to get the contracts and they would no longer make any profit if they increased the staff wages. There's still a lot of haulage firms out there that need to die before things will get better (and that's debatable with the doors opening to the Romanian's). At the moment they're managing to hang on by a thread due to the current drop in fuel costs but the writing is still on the wall.
That is pretty much spot on, DCPC has probably turfed out a fair few older and 'hobby' drivers (looks in mirror Fact is there is no driver shortage. The vast majority of those alleged 40k drivers will have left through retirement, nothing else.
What there actually is, is:
= a shortage of companies that aren't yet in the real world when it comes to pay and conditions.
= a shortage of drivers willing to work for peanuts.
Too many companies out there still paying less than a tenner an hour with time 1.5 after 8 for class 1 and so go crying to the RHA claiming there's a driver shortage when they can't get any mugs to steer their wagons. Up the money and your driver recruitment problems will instantly vanish. But most of them can't because they've already slashed the rates back to the bone to get the contracts and they would no longer make any profit if they increased the staff wages. There's still a lot of haulage firms out there that need to die before things will get better (and that's debatable with the doors opening to the Romanian's). At the moment they're managing to hang on by a thread due to the current drop in fuel costs but the writing is still on the wall.
)I suppose it's no secret the RHA were in to have a chat with Mcgloughlin last Wednesday to have a gripe
http://www.rha.uk.net/campaigning/campaigning/nati...
There are other meetings going on with various peeps, who knows where it's going
https://www.gov.uk/government/people/patrick-mclou...
I had my CPC the other day, they said you can't be done for speeding with it. I've been over 60mph plenty of times, get loads of infringements for speeding by the tacho analyser company my boss uses but vosa never said anything to me, and I get pulled in regularly. One my colleagues told me they told him to "go steady on the hills" after seeing a 117km over speed.
I also don't buy into this "fines pay their wages" stuff. For one, I've asked them about it, Also, do you think fining a couple of polish blokes a day and the odd 70 quid to pull the bike lock off pays their wages? No chance. The fines are probably making up for 2 or 3% of their operating costs.
I also don't buy into this "fines pay their wages" stuff. For one, I've asked them about it, Also, do you think fining a couple of polish blokes a day and the odd 70 quid to pull the bike lock off pays their wages? No chance. The fines are probably making up for 2 or 3% of their operating costs.
cossy400 said:
Humper said:
Tacho checked retrospectively ? How? Unless you were doing more than 60 how do they prove you weren't on a motorway?
If they wanted to and id suppose you d have to have alot of 60+s on your card, they could request for your firms tracker data. Humper said:
cossy400 said:
Humper said:
Tacho checked retrospectively ? How? Unless you were doing more than 60 how do they prove you weren't on a motorway?
If they wanted to and id suppose you d have to have alot of 60+s on your card, they could request for your firms tracker data. Im tracked but for the amount of times I get rung in a day askin how im goin on you d think not.
cossy400 said:
Humper said:
cossy400 said:
Humper said:
Tacho checked retrospectively ? How? Unless you were doing more than 60 how do they prove you weren't on a motorway?
If they wanted to and id suppose you d have to have alot of 60+s on your card, they could request for your firms tracker data. Im tracked but for the amount of times I get rung in a day askin how im goin on you d think not.
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