Red Bull Appeal..

[TommoAE86]

Red Bull lose apparently

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/27009862

[London424]

So is that it?

Sorry your appeal didn't work. Why are there no penalties (financial or other) handed out for a very very serious breach of the rules?

[Scuffers]

London424 said:

So is that it?

Sorry your appeal didn't work. Why are there no penalties (financial or other) handed out for a very very serious breach of the rules?

I agree.....

They should.be hit.with a fine for bringing the sport into disrepute.

Edited by Scuffers on Tuesday 15th April 11:24

[Brabus Jord]

agree. surely this cant be it....

[Vaud]

Plenty of worse offences have gone unpunished. Benettons removal of the fuel filter in 1994 leaps to mind- they were found guilty but no punishment.

RB have been punished - the driver was disqualified.

[HTP99]

They won't be punished any more as the FIA will be worried that they would throw their toys out of the pram massively and potentially pull out of F1.

[anonymous-user]

Vaud said:

Plenty of worse offences have gone unpunished. Benettons removal of the fuel filter in 1994 leaps to mind- they were found guilty but no punishment.

RB have been punished - the driver was disqualified.

Exactly. The stewards imposed the penalty, this was the appeal against that. Turned down, end of story.

Must have been sweet revenge for MB after last year's episode over testing........

[rscott]

They may well get an additional penalty. At the very least, I'd expect an announcement on the costs of the appeal - FIA quite regularly award them against unsuccessful appellants.

[zac510]

Scuffers said:

I agree.....

They should.be hit.with a fine for bringing the sport into disrepute.

Edited by Scuffers on Tuesday 15th April 11:24

Come again?

Spare us your ridiculous axe-grinding.

[Adrian W]

So Red Bull caught red handed cheating, but somehow don't receive a huge fine or multi race ban.

Now that's a suprise!


I suppose the upside is at least it got investigated, unlike the traction control that the other drivers were complaining about last year.

[Scuffers]

zac510 said:

Come again?

Spare us your ridiculous axe-grinding.

What axe?

I have no issues with riciardo, just red bull managements appalling attitude over this event as I am sure most sane people are.

Have you actually followed what they have been saying since.

Aside that, gill should sue them for publicly trying to trash their products.

Edited by Scuffers on Tuesday 15th April 12:28

[IainT]

Vaud said:

Derek Smith said:

No increase in penalty then? That's unusual, and not only in the sense of being sensible.

Not sure I agree that it is unusual. There are many appeals, most of which don't seem to carry an increase in penalty?

http://www.fia.com/about-fia/fia-courts/internatio...

The FIA court appears to be considering further sanctions... "The court’s decision and reasoning together with any incremental sanctions will be published by the end of the week."

Incremental sanctions being those above the upheld steward's sanctions.

Could result in a large(r) fine, race bans (which seem unlikely) or nfa.

[Megaflow]

How they ever thought they could get away with it is just beyond me. It doesn't matter a toss what their numbers say, everybody else was running to FIA numbers. Mercedes might have been able to put 10% more fuel in if they had run to they're numbers.

[zac510]

Scuffers said:

What axe?

I have no issues with riciardo, just red bull managements appalling attitude over this event as I am sure most sane people are.

Have you actually followed what they have been saying since.

Aside that, gill should sue them for publicly trying to trash their products.

Edited by Scuffers on Tuesday 15th April 12:28

You basically just want them punished more for daring to use the appeal process that's in the sporting regulations.

The appeal might have been somewhat futile and the way it initiated not pretty but that's not reason to punish them more. It's acting purely out of spite.

[rscott]

zac510 said:

You basically just want them punished more for daring to use the appeal process that's in the sporting regulations.

The appeal might have been somewhat futile and the way it initiated not pretty but that's not reason to punish them more. It's acting purely out of spite.

FIA regularly impose additional penalties on appeal where they feel the appeal was without merit or frivolous, as this one appears to many of us.
At the very least I'd expect an award of costs against RBR and probably a fairly large fine.

[ajprice]

rscott said:

zac510 said:

You basically just want them punished more for daring to use the appeal process that's in the sporting regulations.

The appeal might have been somewhat futile and the way it initiated not pretty but that's not reason to punish them more. It's acting purely out of spite.

FIA regularly impose additional penalties on appeal where they feel the appeal was without merit or frivolous, as this one appears to many of us.
At the very least I'd expect an award of costs against RBR and probably a fairly large fine.

If/when that happens, is it likely to be with the fuller explanation at the end of the week?

[zac510]

rscott said:

FIA regularly impose additional penalties on appeal where they feel the appeal was without merit or frivolous, as this one appears to many of us.
At the very least I'd expect an award of costs against RBR and probably a fairly large fine.

I can't think of any recent examples, can you cite any?

[rubystone]

zac510 said:

You basically just want them punished more for daring to use the appeal process that's in the sporting regulations.

The appeal might have been somewhat futile and the way it initiated not pretty but that's not reason to punish them more. It's acting purely out of spite.

You, like me, read the details on this, correct? What it comes down to is that RBR sought to prove the sensor inaccurate via the use of models (and I am not talking about 6ft blondes with pneumatic chests dressed in RBR lycra suits - actually that might've worked)....

The FIA and everyone in the room argued that RBR could not prove through the use of anything as accurate (or inaccurate) as a sensor that the Gill version was inaccurate and thus the case was thrown out.

Surely the lawyers to whom RBR paid hundreds of thousands of Euros, should have spotted this flaw? If they did, and RR chose to push ahead, there's an argument that they were indeed arrogant.

But we'll never know that will we? Which is perhaps why the FIA decided not to levy any further penalty?

[NRS]

zac510 said:

Scuffers said:

What axe?

I have no issues with riciardo, just red bull managements appalling attitude over this event as I am sure most sane people are.

Have you actually followed what they have been saying since.

Aside that, gill should sue them for publicly trying to trash their products.

Edited by Scuffers on Tuesday 15th April 12:28

You basically just want them punished more for daring to use the appeal process that's in the sporting regulations.

The appeal might have been somewhat futile and the way it initiated not pretty but that's not reason to punish them more. It's acting purely out of spite.

You you think it was ok for RB to basically say the sensor was crap and so on, yet it appears obvious their measurements were not calibrated, had a larger uncertainty than that of the sensor "error", seemed to change to give more power when they needed it during the race and potentially the proper sensor "failed" because of modification? I think if I was Gill I'd be looking at some kind of court action, especially if they've been discussing any other contacts at the time that might have been influenced by RB's claims.

[zac510]

rubystone yes I get it, and I agree that the case was a bit silly and pointless.

However I just don't want to set the precedent of punishing them just for being arrogant. You punish them for technical infractions, not for emotions.