Welcome back Jenson?
Discussion
RobGT81 said:
BritishRacinGrin said:
It's always a shame to see a clearly talented driver forced out of the sport
You realise that there is other forms of racing outside of F1?If he can get over his fear of multiclass racing and F1 snobbery, he will make a great sports car driver.
I think webbers had some decent talks with button, he can still get his racing kick but get my time off with his family.
dr_gn said:
None of which really has anything to do with the mindset of the drivers: The fact they needed a mediator just goes to show how badly things must have deteriorated. It was probably more for the benefit of the team to somehow 'prove' they were being fair.
Why was a mediator required in the first place?Oh yeah, for the first time since Minardi Alonso was in a team where his manager (who has something to gain if FA's reputation in enhanced) was not the team principal. What Alonso's perception of equal treatment (I would suggest) was somewhat far from the reality of equal. LH was no angel in this and prompted the Hungary qualifying pit box toy throwing. From that point on Alonso took it upon himself to destroy his employee/employer relationship by making accusations of bias and eventually attempting to blackmail his boss. All because he had equal status.
stevesingo said:
dr_gn said:
None of which really has anything to do with the mindset of the drivers: The fact they needed a mediator just goes to show how badly things must have deteriorated. It was probably more for the benefit of the team to somehow 'prove' they were being fair.
Why was a mediator required in the first place?Oh yeah, for the first time since Minardi Alonso was in a team where his manager (who has something to gain if FA's reputation in enhanced) was not the team principal. What Alonso's perception of equal treatment (I would suggest) was somewhat far from the reality of equal. LH was no angel in this and prompted the Hungary qualifying pit box toy throwing. From that point on Alonso took it upon himself to destroy his employee/employer relationship by making accusations of bias and eventually attempting to blackmail his boss. All because he had equal status.
Nothing to see here.
egor110 said:
Fear of endurance racing?
I think webbers had some decent talks with button, he can still get his racing kick but get my time off with his family.
Button said he wouldn't race at Le Mans while its mixed class because of the speed differential. I think webbers had some decent talks with button, he can still get his racing kick but get my time off with his family.
Ok, he probably isn't scared and he has changed his tune about racing at Le Mans over the last 6 months, probably thanks to Webber as you say.
Isn't the big issue here not about JB or KM and who they choose, but the simple fact that McLaren have shown themselves to be weak and not in control of their own destiny?
No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
RobGT81 said:
egor110 said:
Fear of endurance racing?
I think webbers had some decent talks with button, he can still get his racing kick but get my time off with his family.
Button said he wouldn't race at Le Mans while its mixed class because of the speed differential. I think webbers had some decent talks with button, he can still get his racing kick but get my time off with his family.
Ok, he probably isn't scared and he has changed his tune about racing at Le Mans over the last 6 months, probably thanks to Webber as you say.
Maybe with the loss of his dad he's maybe rethinking do i really want to spend 10 months of the year working and travelling, i could half that and still have a very comfortable lifestyle and see more of the family.
toppstuff said:
Isn't the big issue here not about JB or KM and who they choose, but the simple fact that McLaren have shown themselves to be weak and not in control of their own destiny?
No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
Pretty much.No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
I have trouble squaring the mess they're in right now with this drippy idea that "because mclaren-honda" that they'll be a title chasing team.
hairyben said:
toppstuff said:
Isn't the big issue here not about JB or KM and who they choose, but the simple fact that McLaren have shown themselves to be weak and not in control of their own destiny?
No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
Pretty much.No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
I have trouble squaring the mess they're in right now with this drippy idea that "because mclaren-honda" that they'll be a title chasing team.
London424 said:
hairyben said:
toppstuff said:
Isn't the big issue here not about JB or KM and who they choose, but the simple fact that McLaren have shown themselves to be weak and not in control of their own destiny?
No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
Pretty much.No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
I have trouble squaring the mess they're in right now with this drippy idea that "because mclaren-honda" that they'll be a title chasing team.
toppstuff said:
Isn't the big issue here not about JB or KM and who they choose, but the simple fact that McLaren have shown themselves to be weak and not in control of their own destiny?
No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
Well said.No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
egor110 said:
People can change.
Maybe with the loss of his dad he's maybe rethinking do i really want to spend 10 months of the year working and travelling, i could half that and still have a very comfortable lifestyle and see more of the family.
Thats very true. Maybe with the loss of his dad he's maybe rethinking do i really want to spend 10 months of the year working and travelling, i could half that and still have a very comfortable lifestyle and see more of the family.
I'm looking forward to Porsche announcing their first car line up as Webber, Button, Alonso.
Europa1 said:
toppstuff said:
Isn't the big issue here not about JB or KM and who they choose, but the simple fact that McLaren have shown themselves to be weak and not in control of their own destiny?
No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
Well said.No driver should ever be bigger than the team.
The team must have the confidence and the courage to choose who will drive on THEIR terms. Being effectively dictated to by Alonso and Ferrari is a pathetic state of affairs. It sends a really bad message to sponsors and tarnishes the McLaren image.
McLaren should be the ones in charge. They should have chosen their driver line up months ago, rather than end up on dangling on a hook like this.
Mclaren look bungling and weak, without any control of the situation. McLaren need stability and the ability to plan ahead - they have a development programme with a new engine to deliver. This uncertainty is bad for everyone. It also makes McLaren look like clowns.
No driver is worth destroying your reputational capital over - not even Fred Alonso.
McLaren should have told Alonso to either join them two months ago or f***k off.
If I were a sponsor I would be massively unimpressed.
MrBaker said:
RobGT81 said:
Thats very true.
I'm looking forward to Porsche announcing their first car line up as Webber, Button, Alonso.
Haha, I thought the same, that would be some line up !I'm looking forward to Porsche announcing their first car line up as Webber, Button, Alonso.
Button to wec isn't massive news, alonso on the other hand would be.
Firstly, I am a JB. Moving on..
Even with JB, they have been very weak with sponsors, Hugo Boss, and Jonny Walker have gone.
With the Merc lump they have been poor.
As harsh as it sounds, they need Alonso (he brings major Spanish sponsorship, and at least in F1.motorsport circles, Global coverage).
They need Honda as well - they need Honda to out trump the mercs.
Having JB in the 2nd seat is almost irrelevant; might has well have a chump (KM), and Alonso to lead with Honda backing.
Will be great to see JB in WEC.
Even with JB, they have been very weak with sponsors, Hugo Boss, and Jonny Walker have gone.
With the Merc lump they have been poor.
As harsh as it sounds, they need Alonso (he brings major Spanish sponsorship, and at least in F1.motorsport circles, Global coverage).
They need Honda as well - they need Honda to out trump the mercs.
Having JB in the 2nd seat is almost irrelevant; might has well have a chump (KM), and Alonso to lead with Honda backing.
Will be great to see JB in WEC.
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