van de Garde sueing Sauber
Discussion
Sauber have apparently released a statement:
“Many of you read today’s statement on Giedo van der Garde’s Facebook page. So have we and we were, indeed, rather surprised. We don’t know about Giedo’s intentions. He may try to present himself as a winner, while we had actually hoped to come to rest after our agreement. Giedo decided to take a different approach – the reasoning behind we cannot understand.
“We’d have very good answers to the many statements and accusations in Giedo’s post. But to expand on this wouldn’t help our race team nor our fans and partners. It would only encourage a mud fight via the media and we will not lend ourselves to that. The next race in Malaysia is where our focus is and that’s where we will build up on last weekend’s success together with our drivers Marcus Ericsson and Felipe Nasr. All our efforts are drawn to this objective.
“With this in mind we’d like to encourage you to form your own opinion about what happened, however critical it may be. From our side we herewith close the matter and look already forward to celebrating future achievements at the race track together with you.
“Yours sincerely, Sauber F1 Team”
I'm of the opinion that a good mud fight might be more fun to watch than a repeat of last weeks race.
“Many of you read today’s statement on Giedo van der Garde’s Facebook page. So have we and we were, indeed, rather surprised. We don’t know about Giedo’s intentions. He may try to present himself as a winner, while we had actually hoped to come to rest after our agreement. Giedo decided to take a different approach – the reasoning behind we cannot understand.
“We’d have very good answers to the many statements and accusations in Giedo’s post. But to expand on this wouldn’t help our race team nor our fans and partners. It would only encourage a mud fight via the media and we will not lend ourselves to that. The next race in Malaysia is where our focus is and that’s where we will build up on last weekend’s success together with our drivers Marcus Ericsson and Felipe Nasr. All our efforts are drawn to this objective.
“With this in mind we’d like to encourage you to form your own opinion about what happened, however critical it may be. From our side we herewith close the matter and look already forward to celebrating future achievements at the race track together with you.
“Yours sincerely, Sauber F1 Team”
I'm of the opinion that a good mud fight might be more fun to watch than a repeat of last weeks race.
suffolk009 said:
Sauber have apparently released a statement:
“Many of you read today’s statement on Giedo van der Garde’s Facebook page. So have we and we were, indeed, rather surprised. We don’t know about Giedo’s intentions. He may try to present himself as a winner, while we had actually hoped to come to rest after our agreement. Giedo decided to take a different approach – the reasoning behind we cannot understand.
“We’d have very good answers to the many statements and accusations in Giedo’s post. But to expand on this wouldn’t help our race team nor our fans and partners. It would only encourage a mud fight via the media and we will not lend ourselves to that. The next race in Malaysia is where our focus is and that’s where we will build up on last weekend’s success together with our drivers Marcus Ericsson and Felipe Nasr. All our efforts are drawn to this objective.
“With this in mind we’d like to encourage you to form your own opinion about what happened, however critical it may be. From our side we herewith close the matter and look already forward to celebrating future achievements at the race track together with you.
“Yours sincerely, Sauber F1 Team”
I'm of the opinion that a good mud fight might be more fun to watch than a repeat of last weeks race.
If they'd reached a formal settlement, you'd expect them to sign a settlement agreement to record it, and part of that would deal with public announcements.“Many of you read today’s statement on Giedo van der Garde’s Facebook page. So have we and we were, indeed, rather surprised. We don’t know about Giedo’s intentions. He may try to present himself as a winner, while we had actually hoped to come to rest after our agreement. Giedo decided to take a different approach – the reasoning behind we cannot understand.
“We’d have very good answers to the many statements and accusations in Giedo’s post. But to expand on this wouldn’t help our race team nor our fans and partners. It would only encourage a mud fight via the media and we will not lend ourselves to that. The next race in Malaysia is where our focus is and that’s where we will build up on last weekend’s success together with our drivers Marcus Ericsson and Felipe Nasr. All our efforts are drawn to this objective.
“With this in mind we’d like to encourage you to form your own opinion about what happened, however critical it may be. From our side we herewith close the matter and look already forward to celebrating future achievements at the race track together with you.
“Yours sincerely, Sauber F1 Team”
I'm of the opinion that a good mud fight might be more fun to watch than a repeat of last weeks race.
Mind you, you'd expect a team run by a lawyer to not have more than 2 race drivers with binding contracts...
Leithen said:
F1 team principal in lack of principles shocker.
People appear to have forgotten the nickname of F1. The Piranha Club.
Why the sudden indignation toward an individual who is probably guilty of transgressions far meeker than many of her predecessors? All very strange.
None of this is particularly edifying, but given the financial structure of F1 it's hardly surprising.
Meanwhile CVC continue to count their billions.
F1 bosses may have a reputation for being ruthless, but taking money from someone for a 2015 drive then selling the same drive to someone else for more money is something entirely different. There doesn't even appear to be any grey areas, as far as I'm aware the courts have decided in VdG's favour every time. I'm disappointed in Sauber, I've always admired the way Sauber and Williams have gone about their business but the handling of this episode would appear to be incompetent at best.People appear to have forgotten the nickname of F1. The Piranha Club.
Why the sudden indignation toward an individual who is probably guilty of transgressions far meeker than many of her predecessors? All very strange.
None of this is particularly edifying, but given the financial structure of F1 it's hardly surprising.
Meanwhile CVC continue to count their billions.
Dear Monisha,
I am an experienced marketing and communications professional, I live just the other side of Zurisee from your factory, and am available for disaster management communications support on a freelance basis should you require it. I can only assume from your latest statement that something was lost in translation between the Schweitzer Deutch original and the English language version I read, as it comes across as a complete clusterf
k of biblical proportions. Frankly you'd have been better saying nothing than asking the public to 'form their own opinions' on something as clear cut and obvious as this, as the only person who will side with you is the over-enthusiastic commentator on SRF2 who I assume is periodically injected with Ritalin by Sebastian Buemi during the race to stop him exploding.
I await your call,
Jamie
I am an experienced marketing and communications professional, I live just the other side of Zurisee from your factory, and am available for disaster management communications support on a freelance basis should you require it. I can only assume from your latest statement that something was lost in translation between the Schweitzer Deutch original and the English language version I read, as it comes across as a complete clusterf
k of biblical proportions. Frankly you'd have been better saying nothing than asking the public to 'form their own opinions' on something as clear cut and obvious as this, as the only person who will side with you is the over-enthusiastic commentator on SRF2 who I assume is periodically injected with Ritalin by Sebastian Buemi during the race to stop him exploding.I await your call,
Jamie
jamiebae said:
Dear Monisha,
I can only assume from your latest statement that something was lost in translation between the Schweitzer Deutch original and the English language version I read, as it comes across as a complete clusterfk of biblical proportions. Frankly you'd have been better saying nothing than asking the public to 'form their own opinions' on something as clear cut and obvious as this.
Completely agree. The Sauber statement was too petulant for my liking.I can only assume from your latest statement that something was lost in translation between the Schweitzer Deutch original and the English language version I read, as it comes across as a complete clusterf
k of biblical proportions. Frankly you'd have been better saying nothing than asking the public to 'form their own opinions' on something as clear cut and obvious as this.How about an apology to their fans? How about an apology to GvG?
We know Sauber faced a difficult situation, but if they showed a little humility and empathy for the trouble their ineptitude has caused, I think it would go a long way.
suffolk009 said:
I'd previously had a quiet and slightly reserved admiration for Sauber.
Me too. Not any more and especially after their statement. Peter Sauber is an honourable guy. I bet he thought he'd offloaded the team to Kaltenborg...and she is clearly unused to strategic thinking. Bradgate said:
Kaltenborn realised that VDG, being a decent guy, when faced with the choice of enforcing his contract and bringing the whole thing crashing down with the loss of hundreds of jobs, or agreeing a financial settlement, had no realistic alternative but to do the latter.
She deserves to be sacked for creating this fiasco, I hope she is sacked, and I hope she never works in motorsport again.
She took his sponsors' money for his 2015 drive in EARLY 2014. Then she took upfront payments from first Ericsson and the Nasr at the end of 2014 for 2015. Regardless of protecting jobs etc, she did all this in the knowledge she would face a problem when 3 into 2 wouldn't go. She deserves to be sacked for creating this fiasco, I hope she is sacked, and I hope she never works in motorsport again.
This is why she is not fit to occupy the position she has. It has taken these two court case to drive out the fact that she took E8m off of VdG over a year before he was due to take up his drive. Shameful behaviour and potentially fraudulent behaviour. I know someone who did time for taking deposits and not honouring the delivery....sound familiar?....
RYH64E said:
F1 bosses may have a reputation for being ruthless, but taking money from someone for a 2015 drive then selling the same drive to someone else for more money is something entirely different. There doesn't even appear to be any grey areas, as far as I'm aware the courts have decided in VdG's favour every time. I'm disappointed in Sauber, I've always admired the way Sauber and Williams have gone about their business but the handling of this episode would appear to be incompetent at best.
Ruthless is the right description. This appears to be exactly what has happened here. A contract was broken, a dispute about the contract and the money involved ensued. It certainly wasn't the first or biggest contract broken in F1 history, and it won't be the last. Kudos to vdG in his court success and PR campaign. I can't see how he could have achieved more.The flip side of the coin is that this apparently incompetent team principal appears to have succeeded in resurrecting an almost insolvent team from a dismal performance the year before and has produced a car that is far more competitive than anyone expected. It's quite possible that without breaking vdG's contract Sauber would not have been in Australia, and/or might not have had the car they have now.
A s
tty situation - Sauber appear to have lost friends, but are alive and competitive. Possibly better than having friends and being bankrupt and/or trailing at the back though.They really would've been better just saying nothing and letting VdG's statement cover what are inevitably the facts anyway. To release that pile of st, and effectively saying nothing in it just makes them look petty and small minded.
Sauber were always one of the good guys as a team, produced good cars with a relatively small budget and always had exciting drivers. Like Mclaren they've become very unlikeable as a team over the last few months imo. While even more surprisingly Ferrari now have a straight talking team principal, 2 exciting drivers and a brit helping them get back to winning ways. And as a result are becoming a lot more likeable again.
t, and effectively saying nothing in it just makes them look petty and small minded. Sauber were always one of the good guys as a team, produced good cars with a relatively small budget and always had exciting drivers. Like Mclaren they've become very unlikeable as a team over the last few months imo. While even more surprisingly Ferrari now have a straight talking team principal, 2 exciting drivers and a brit helping them get back to winning ways. And as a result are becoming a lot more likeable again.
Leithen said:
Ruthless is the right description.
Taking money from someone for something you have no intention of supplying isn't being ruthless, selling the same thing to four drivers knowing you only have two drives available isn't being ruthless, failing to comply with court orders isn't being ruthless. There's a big difference between being ruthless and being a double dealing, cheating scumbag.RYH64E said:
Taking money from someone for something you have no intention of supplying isn't being ruthless, selling the same thing to four drivers knowing you only have two drives available isn't being ruthless, failing to comply with court orders isn't being ruthless. There's a big difference between being ruthless and being a double dealing, cheating scumbag.
And they accuse us of stereotyping lawyers eh?...RYH64E said:
Taking money from someone for something you have no intention of supplying isn't being ruthless, selling the same thing to four drivers knowing you only have two drives available isn't being ruthless, failing to comply with court orders isn't being ruthless. There's a big difference between being ruthless and being a double dealing, cheating scumbag.
No argument with that, if that is what happened. It appears unlikely however that there was intent to defraud when vdG's contract was signed and money changed hands. No doubt there would have been threats of criminal prosecution if that were the case rather than civil proceedings resulting in the threat of contempt of court.What appears likely to have happened is that Sauber took vdG's money and then found themselves on the brink of insolvency later in the year. At that point their only lifeline seems to have been signing another driver who offered more money and thus the breaking of vdG's contract.
Catch22 for vdG. Keep his seat and have no drive because the team has gone bust or lose his seat and watch the team survive.
Was vdG asked for for more money? If so, did he or his backers demand equity in return that wasn't forthcoming? Or was he simply unable or unwilling to pay more?
It's all very unsavoury, especially the manner in which Sauber appears to have broken the contract. But businesses with their backs to the wall take desperate measures including breaking contracts. Ultimately if Sauber had gone into administration, vdG would have become just another creditor and would most likely have not walked away with anything like what he has done now. Not much conciliation, but probably the reality.
Where has the money now come to pay off vdG? Given that Sauber are living on an advance of funds from Ecclestone, one must presume that the new backers have stumped up the cash to keep their driver in what appears to be a competitive car.
Leithen said:
No argument with that, if that is what happened. It appears unlikely however that there was intent to defraud when vdG's contract was signed and money changed hands. No doubt there would have been threats of criminal prosecution if that were the case rather than civil proceedings resulting in the threat of contempt of court.
What appears likely to have happened is that Sauber took vdG's money and then found themselves on the brink of insolvency later in the year. At that point their only lifeline seems to have been signing another driver who offered more money and thus the breaking of vdG's contract.
Catch22 for vdG. Keep his seat and have no drive because the team has gone bust or lose his seat and watch the team survive.
Was vdG asked for for more money? If so, did he or his backers demand equity in return that wasn't forthcoming? Or was he simply unable or unwilling to pay more?
It's all very unsavoury, especially the manner in which Sauber appears to have broken the contract. But businesses with their backs to the wall take desperate measures including breaking contracts. Ultimately if Sauber had gone into administration, vdG would have become just another creditor and would most likely have not walked away with anything like what he has done now. Not much conciliation, but probably the reality.
Where has the money now come to pay off vdG? Given that Sauber are living on an advance of funds from Ecclestone, one must presume that the new backers have stumped up the cash to keep their driver in what appears to be a competitive car.
I think you're very close to the truth. My biggest issue is that Sauber must have presented a business plan to VdG that showed they had the funds for 2015...or did he really take their word for the fact they would remain solvent on 2014 & 2015?What appears likely to have happened is that Sauber took vdG's money and then found themselves on the brink of insolvency later in the year. At that point their only lifeline seems to have been signing another driver who offered more money and thus the breaking of vdG's contract.
Catch22 for vdG. Keep his seat and have no drive because the team has gone bust or lose his seat and watch the team survive.
Was vdG asked for for more money? If so, did he or his backers demand equity in return that wasn't forthcoming? Or was he simply unable or unwilling to pay more?
It's all very unsavoury, especially the manner in which Sauber appears to have broken the contract. But businesses with their backs to the wall take desperate measures including breaking contracts. Ultimately if Sauber had gone into administration, vdG would have become just another creditor and would most likely have not walked away with anything like what he has done now. Not much conciliation, but probably the reality.
Where has the money now come to pay off vdG? Given that Sauber are living on an advance of funds from Ecclestone, one must presume that the new backers have stumped up the cash to keep their driver in what appears to be a competitive car.
suffolk009 said:
Sauber have apparently released a statement:
“Many of you read today’s statement on Giedo van der Garde’s Facebook page. So have we and we were, indeed, rather surprised. We don’t know about Giedo’s intentions. He may try to present himself as a winner, while we had actually hoped to come to rest after our agreement. Giedo decided to take a different approach – the reasoning behind we cannot understand.
“We’d have very good answers to the many statements and accusations in Giedo’s post. But to expand on this wouldn’t help our race team nor our fans and partners. It would only encourage a mud fight via the media and we will not lend ourselves to that. The next race in Malaysia is where our focus is and that’s where we will build up on last weekend’s success together with our drivers Marcus Ericsson and Felipe Nasr. All our efforts are drawn to this objective.
“With this in mind we’d like to encourage you to form your own opinion about what happened, however critical it may be. From our side we herewith close the matter and look already forward to celebrating future achievements at the race track together with you.
“Yours sincerely, Sauber F1 Team”
I'm of the opinion that a good mud fight might be more fun to watch than a repeat of last weeks race.
That press release reminds of a number of playground comebacks from kids who didn't have an answer, such as: "I know you are, but what am I?", and the old favourite: "Your mum".“Many of you read today’s statement on Giedo van der Garde’s Facebook page. So have we and we were, indeed, rather surprised. We don’t know about Giedo’s intentions. He may try to present himself as a winner, while we had actually hoped to come to rest after our agreement. Giedo decided to take a different approach – the reasoning behind we cannot understand.
“We’d have very good answers to the many statements and accusations in Giedo’s post. But to expand on this wouldn’t help our race team nor our fans and partners. It would only encourage a mud fight via the media and we will not lend ourselves to that. The next race in Malaysia is where our focus is and that’s where we will build up on last weekend’s success together with our drivers Marcus Ericsson and Felipe Nasr. All our efforts are drawn to this objective.
“With this in mind we’d like to encourage you to form your own opinion about what happened, however critical it may be. From our side we herewith close the matter and look already forward to celebrating future achievements at the race track together with you.
“Yours sincerely, Sauber F1 Team”
I'm of the opinion that a good mud fight might be more fun to watch than a repeat of last weeks race.
They would've been better off keeping quiet.
Ahonen said:
suffolk009 said:
Sauber have apparently released a statement:
“Many of you read today’s statement on Giedo van der Garde’s Facebook page. So have we and we were, indeed, rather surprised. We don’t know about Giedo’s intentions. He may try to present himself as a winner, while we had actually hoped to come to rest after our agreement. Giedo decided to take a different approach – the reasoning behind we cannot understand.
“We’d have very good answers to the many statements and accusations in Giedo’s post. But to expand on this wouldn’t help our race team nor our fans and partners. It would only encourage a mud fight via the media and we will not lend ourselves to that. The next race in Malaysia is where our focus is and that’s where we will build up on last weekend’s success together with our drivers Marcus Ericsson and Felipe Nasr. All our efforts are drawn to this objective.
“With this in mind we’d like to encourage you to form your own opinion about what happened, however critical it may be. From our side we herewith close the matter and look already forward to celebrating future achievements at the race track together with you.
“Yours sincerely, Sauber F1 Team”
I'm of the opinion that a good mud fight might be more fun to watch than a repeat of last weeks race.
That press release reminds of a number of playground comebacks from kids who didn't have an answer, such as: "I know you are, but what am I?", and the old favourite: "Your mum".“Many of you read today’s statement on Giedo van der Garde’s Facebook page. So have we and we were, indeed, rather surprised. We don’t know about Giedo’s intentions. He may try to present himself as a winner, while we had actually hoped to come to rest after our agreement. Giedo decided to take a different approach – the reasoning behind we cannot understand.
“We’d have very good answers to the many statements and accusations in Giedo’s post. But to expand on this wouldn’t help our race team nor our fans and partners. It would only encourage a mud fight via the media and we will not lend ourselves to that. The next race in Malaysia is where our focus is and that’s where we will build up on last weekend’s success together with our drivers Marcus Ericsson and Felipe Nasr. All our efforts are drawn to this objective.
“With this in mind we’d like to encourage you to form your own opinion about what happened, however critical it may be. From our side we herewith close the matter and look already forward to celebrating future achievements at the race track together with you.
“Yours sincerely, Sauber F1 Team”
I'm of the opinion that a good mud fight might be more fun to watch than a repeat of last weeks race.
They would've been better off keeping quiet.
All they needed to say is 'We are pleased to have been able to reach an agreement with GVdG and are looking forward to a successful season building on our double points finish in Australia. The team would like to thank our fans, staff and drivers for their support over the last two weeks and our focus is now 100% on the race in Malaysia.'
Instead they have released something that a first year marketing student would describe as 'staggeringly unprofessional' to throw more fuel on the fire.
Instead they have released something that a first year marketing student would describe as 'staggeringly unprofessional' to throw more fuel on the fire.
Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff