Red Bull will pull out of F1 unless Audi come in
Discussion
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/32688667
Strange posture to take, appearing to try and blackmail Renault and Audi at the same time. Red Bull contracted to F1 until 2020, they rolled the dice and chose their partners.
If Audi were to come into F1 (big IF) then I doubt it would be as just an engine supplier, surely they would want their own team. Maybe Red Bull are just posturing to try and become a customer of Audi engines.
Strange posture to take, appearing to try and blackmail Renault and Audi at the same time. Red Bull contracted to F1 until 2020, they rolled the dice and chose their partners.
If Audi were to come into F1 (big IF) then I doubt it would be as just an engine supplier, surely they would want their own team. Maybe Red Bull are just posturing to try and become a customer of Audi engines.
as Lewis once said, Redbull are just a drinks company.
they have had their 4 years of marketing, soon as it's got hard, they want to bail.
I really can't see VAG wanting anything to do with F1 in it's current form, they would have to spend the best part of $1Tn to get exactly what?
they already have a motorsport pedigree with Le-mans (won it 11 times), and it's been far easier for their marketing to relate this to their road cars.
they have had their 4 years of marketing, soon as it's got hard, they want to bail.
I really can't see VAG wanting anything to do with F1 in it's current form, they would have to spend the best part of $1Tn to get exactly what?
they already have a motorsport pedigree with Le-mans (won it 11 times), and it's been far easier for their marketing to relate this to their road cars.
Both Audi and Red Bull are in motorsport for what they can get out of it.
I accept the same could be said of Williams/Head and Dennis but they are enthusiasts for the sport. Things have gone badly for McL over the last few weeks, months, years but they are still in it. The same can be said for Williams and their wilderness years, which seem to be ending but still some way to go.
If RB don't get returns, then they will jump ship if the cost of doing so is less that staying in. There will be a fair bit of negative publicity but if they salt the battlefield, by suggesting that their bad performance is all down to engines and the regulations are unfair, that they tried to go for another supplier (despite that supplier not giving any hint that they wanted in on F1) then they might feel they could leave the sport with some mitigation.
They take two teams with them (I assume).
I would also assume that they will sell on their assets to two new owners as this would negate their losses to an extent.
RB have kept in the background in the main, leaving it to their warm-up man to say things, but if this ends then I think the writing will be on the wall.
The problem is knowing whether the suggestion of VAG coming in is genuine or not. If so, then I think it is good for the sport. If no, it means RB is preparing to leave, and whether that is good for the sport or not is a personal matter.
I accept the same could be said of Williams/Head and Dennis but they are enthusiasts for the sport. Things have gone badly for McL over the last few weeks, months, years but they are still in it. The same can be said for Williams and their wilderness years, which seem to be ending but still some way to go.
If RB don't get returns, then they will jump ship if the cost of doing so is less that staying in. There will be a fair bit of negative publicity but if they salt the battlefield, by suggesting that their bad performance is all down to engines and the regulations are unfair, that they tried to go for another supplier (despite that supplier not giving any hint that they wanted in on F1) then they might feel they could leave the sport with some mitigation.
They take two teams with them (I assume).
I would also assume that they will sell on their assets to two new owners as this would negate their losses to an extent.
RB have kept in the background in the main, leaving it to their warm-up man to say things, but if this ends then I think the writing will be on the wall.
The problem is knowing whether the suggestion of VAG coming in is genuine or not. If so, then I think it is good for the sport. If no, it means RB is preparing to leave, and whether that is good for the sport or not is a personal matter.
s.Listening to Ricciardo post race he alluded to the fact that they haven't even been able to really test out the chassis yet. Lets hope its a good one! Once the engine penalties kick in at least we should see plenty of overtaking from him from even further down the grid.
Given all of the "empathy" flowing from Horner during their domination his current situation amuses me.
If they were to withdraw both teams this would surely have a really detrimental effect on the image of F1. Hence I guess they feel this is their best bargaining position.
Given all of the "empathy" flowing from Horner during their domination his current situation amuses me.
If they were to withdraw both teams this would surely have a really detrimental effect on the image of F1. Hence I guess they feel this is their best bargaining position.
Red Bull have shown themselves to be bad losers, and in doing so have lost a lot of admirers. It's easy to be the good guys when you're winning, but true character shows through in the hard times.
Williams, McLaren & Ferrari have all been through tough times recently. They didn't whinge or Criticise their partners. They got their heads down and worked hard to put things right. McLaren still have much work to do but, for all his faults, you don't hear Ron slagging off Honda.
F1 will survive without Red Bull. They are upstarts who have only been racing for less than a decade.
Williams, McLaren & Ferrari have all been through tough times recently. They didn't whinge or Criticise their partners. They got their heads down and worked hard to put things right. McLaren still have much work to do but, for all his faults, you don't hear Ron slagging off Honda.
F1 will survive without Red Bull. They are upstarts who have only been racing for less than a decade.
Maybe it is time for Renault to play the same game as Red Bull. It seems pretty obvious that the Red Bull chassis isn't great this year as they are regularly beaten by Torro Rosso, the only direct comparison in terms of engines. Whilst Renault are obviously struggling to get the engine performance right maybe they should just save money and stop development now, say that very publicly and save themselves a lot of money whilst leaving Red Bull to do whatever they can to improve on their own - do Renault really need the hassle?
Gaz. said:
I'd happily see the back of RBR. What is the penalty for them leaving before 2020?
If Audi joined it would be as a full on works team like Mercedes, the most dilution I can see them settling for is in partnership with Sauber as BMW did before.
The ex Ferrari boss repaired a report for the board at VW, it put the price of Chassis and engine at 1 billion, to win a world title. Buying Red Bull, who could be available cheap as Red Bull are committed to F1, don't buy into the £300m price tag.Your doing Red Bull a favour by getting them out of a commitment for £££ to Bernie.If Audi joined it would be as a full on works team like Mercedes, the most dilution I can see them settling for is in partnership with Sauber as BMW did before.
I think utlimately Audi will join in 2017/18 with Red Bull as engine supplier. Funny enough i would imagine they are watching Honda to see how that plays out
revrange said:
The ex Ferrari boss repaired a report for the board at VW, it put the price of Chassis and engine at 1 billion, to win a world title. Buying Red Bull, who could be available cheap as Red Bull are committed to F1, don't buy into the £300m price tag.Your doing Red Bull a favour by getting them out of a commitment for £££ to Bernie.
I think utlimately Audi will join in 2017/18 with Red Bull as engine supplier. Funny enough i would imagine they are watching Honda to see how that plays out
Redbull engine supplier, what? I think utlimately Audi will join in 2017/18 with Red Bull as engine supplier. Funny enough i would imagine they are watching Honda to see how that plays out
The only way Audi would come into the sport imho is with a works team, the very reason they want to be there is promotion of their own brand, not win and advertise another direct competitor. Why would they want to buy Redbull and give Renault custom.
whatleytom said:
revrange said:
The ex Ferrari boss repaired a report for the board at VW, it put the price of Chassis and engine at 1 billion, to win a world title. Buying Red Bull, who could be available cheap as Red Bull are committed to F1, don't buy into the £300m price tag.Your doing Red Bull a favour by getting them out of a commitment for £££ to Bernie.
I think utlimately Audi will join in 2017/18 with Red Bull as engine supplier. Funny enough i would imagine they are watching Honda to see how that plays out
Redbull engine supplier, what? I think utlimately Audi will join in 2017/18 with Red Bull as engine supplier. Funny enough i would imagine they are watching Honda to see how that plays out
The only way Audi would come into the sport imho is with a works team, the very reason they want to be there is promotion of their own brand, not win and advertise another direct competitor. Why would they want to buy Redbull and give Renault custom.
only time it makes sense for a new player to enter is at the point of major rule changes.
Edited by Scuffers on Tuesday 12th May 21:09
RobGT81 said:
They are committed to next years LMP1 car at least, so you're looking at a 2020 entry at the earliest I would think. Which is when the next big engine rule change is due?
can't see a big engine change anytime soon, the manufacturers would just say GF, they have spent way too much on the current ones to even think about a change.Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff