Will McLaren survive their Honda contract?
Discussion
jammy_basturd said:
Could it be said that the McL isn't yet quick enough for the extra talent/experience of the world champion drivers to stand out over SV?
It might be that it's very hard to put clear air over a team mate now, even a new one. Hardly any drivers have been noticeably quicker than their team mate, vettel and Hamilton in recent times. I still don't think button is stand out fast in an f1 car considering how good he was at karting. Saw this onboard of Vandoorne posted in F1Technical and simply had to share:
https://vid.me/2R48
Skip to 1:35. Vandoorne makes a mistake in to the corner leading to a long straight goes off track, gets overtaken by one Torro Rosso promptly while another car comes along side. Then magic happens. The way he simply out drags the Force India? alongside him and reels in the Torro Rosso, sweet mercy...I'm beside myself. That Honda engine has a mega 1st lap mapping. [/fanboy]
OK, granted it's a 2015 Ferrari PU, but it was good to see them also beat the Force India cars who had always gone well here.
https://vid.me/2R48
Skip to 1:35. Vandoorne makes a mistake in to the corner leading to a long straight goes off track, gets overtaken by one Torro Rosso promptly while another car comes along side. Then magic happens. The way he simply out drags the Force India? alongside him and reels in the Torro Rosso, sweet mercy...I'm beside myself. That Honda engine has a mega 1st lap mapping. [/fanboy]
OK, granted it's a 2015 Ferrari PU, but it was good to see them also beat the Force India cars who had always gone well here.
Edited by Dr Z on Tuesday 5th April 12:39
Dr Z said:
Saw this onboard of Vandoorne posted in F1Technical and simply had to share:
https://vid.me/2R48
Skip to 1:35. Vandoorne makes a mistake in to the corner leading to a long straight goes off track, gets overtaken by one Torro Rosso promptly while another car comes along side. Then magic happens. The way he simply out drags the Force India? alongside him and reels in the Torro Rosso, sweet mercy...I'm beside myself. That Honda engine has a mega 1st lap mapping. [/fanboy]
OK, granted it's a 2015 Ferrari PU, but it was good to see them also beat the Force India cars who had always gone well here.
DRS, or was it too early for it to be enabled? Good to see him cock up (that bit's not good), but then keep his head and immediately regain the position with a good, fair overtake (that's the good bit).https://vid.me/2R48
Skip to 1:35. Vandoorne makes a mistake in to the corner leading to a long straight goes off track, gets overtaken by one Torro Rosso promptly while another car comes along side. Then magic happens. The way he simply out drags the Force India? alongside him and reels in the Torro Rosso, sweet mercy...I'm beside myself. That Honda engine has a mega 1st lap mapping. [/fanboy]
OK, granted it's a 2015 Ferrari PU, but it was good to see them also beat the Force India cars who had always gone well here.
Edited by Dr Z on Tuesday 5th April 12:39
Actually that's not a bad first F1 race lap, especially given the outbreak of stoke car driving the more experience drivers on the grid were partaking of on the same lap (and still not convinced Bottas deserved that penalty - looked like Hamilton closing the door way too late to me).
Very good reactions and awareness just a couple of seconds after the lights change when he finds himself blocked by a slow TR ahead but doesn't drive in to the fast-starting Hass on his left or the wall on the right, just waits for a gap to appear. This followed at the first corner by not losing his nose in the back of the FI. Seen many an experienced driver, let alone rockie fail those tests over the years.
Very good reactions and awareness just a couple of seconds after the lights change when he finds himself blocked by a slow TR ahead but doesn't drive in to the fast-starting Hass on his left or the wall on the right, just waits for a gap to appear. This followed at the first corner by not losing his nose in the back of the FI. Seen many an experienced driver, let alone rockie fail those tests over the years.
London424 said:
If you were McL and you had your prized young asset put in a performance like that I would think that Button will be the most likely to be done at the end of the season. Alonso still has another year on his contract.
Why pay mega money when you can get similar results for much less.
Add in the fact that Ron has a similar relationship with Stoffel as he had with Hakkinen and one has to expect that this is JB's last year at McLaren and probably F1. Unless Alonso takes a sabbatical...and stranger things have happened!Why pay mega money when you can get similar results for much less.
rubystone said:
London424 said:
If you were McL and you had your prized young asset put in a performance like that I would think that Button will be the most likely to be done at the end of the season. Alonso still has another year on his contract.
Why pay mega money when you can get similar results for much less.
Add in the fact that Ron has a similar relationship with Stoffel as he had with Hakkinen and one has to expect that this is JB's last year at McLaren and probably F1. Unless Alonso takes a sabbatical...and stranger things have happened!Why pay mega money when you can get similar results for much less.
Currently McLaren are lacking sponsorship income and Magnussen had some backing....Ron travelled to Denmark chasing global parters but the Danes were not impressed. Bye bye Kevin. Ron has always believed results bring investors and S V D may well bring the success that has been lacking and something his current pairing just cannot seem to deliver. It isn't just a bad car hampering the team there is more amiss.
Dr Z said:
Saw this onboard of Vandoorne posted in F1Technical and simply had to share:
https://vid.me/2R48
Skip to 1:35. Vandoorne makes a mistake in to the corner leading to a long straight goes off track, gets overtaken by one Torro Rosso promptly while another car comes along side. Then magic happens. The way he simply out drags the Force India? alongside him and reels in the Torro Rosso, sweet mercy...I'm beside myself. That Honda engine has a mega 1st lap mapping. [/fanboy]
OK, granted it's a 2015 Ferrari PU, but it was good to see them also beat the Force India cars who had always gone well here.
I think the highlight of that video was Button outbraking Vandoorne, Perez and Sainz in a single corner (at approx 0:58).https://vid.me/2R48
Skip to 1:35. Vandoorne makes a mistake in to the corner leading to a long straight goes off track, gets overtaken by one Torro Rosso promptly while another car comes along side. Then magic happens. The way he simply out drags the Force India? alongside him and reels in the Torro Rosso, sweet mercy...I'm beside myself. That Honda engine has a mega 1st lap mapping. [/fanboy]
OK, granted it's a 2015 Ferrari PU, but it was good to see them also beat the Force India cars who had always gone well here.
markcoznottz said:
Seen it all before though, magnusson was supposed to be the next big thing, finished second on his debut, Ron got all excited, but the remainder of his season was average.
Magnussen wasn't under Ron's wing. Stoffel is. But time will tell, as you say. Button was a Whitmarsh signing too, which might have an influence when it comes to contract renewal. But by that time Capito will be fully in charge, which could also impact things.belleair302 said:
Currently McLaren are lacking sponsorship income and Magnussen had some backing....Ron travelled to Denmark chasing global parters but the Danes were not impressed. Bye bye Kevin. Ron has always believed results bring investors and S V D may well bring the success that has been lacking and something his current pairing just cannot seem to deliver. It isn't just a bad car hampering the team there is more amiss.
But Belgium isn't stuffed with big name investors is it? Stoffel is there on merit and in many ways, it wouldn't for him any harm to only have that one start. There's no doubt K Mag's reputation was damaged by the poor car performance over the whole season.ralphrj said:
I think the highlight of that video was Button outbraking Vandoorne, Perez and Sainz in a single corner (at approx 0:58).
Yeah, that was great move. It's also why McLaren needs someone like Button in the car for next year. As a Button fan, I'd be annoyed if Ron decides to discard him just when the car starts to come good, after all the struggle he was put through. I really believe he deserves one more shot at the Championship, just as much as Alonso.rubystone said:
But Belgium isn't stuffed with big name investors is it? Stoffel is there on merit and in many ways, it wouldn't for him any harm to only have that one start. There's no doubt K Mag's reputation was damaged by the poor car performance over the whole season.
Mainly the beer companies are the big sponsors here, but they are more into sponsoring the football eg. Jupiler League. SvD is from the west of Belgium where Max Verstaapen was born and used to live just a few km from where I live before he moved to Monaco.Interesting little piece of info in the published accounts for McLaren Automotive:
McLaren Automotive Accounts said:
In May 2016 McLaren Automotive Limited issued new share capital to a new Shareholder, McKal Holdings. The price paid per share was £290, resulting in a new issue of 73,764 shares. In addition to these new shares, McKal Holdings purchased 96,529 of McLaren Automotive shares from the McLaren Technology Group Limited, leaving that company with no further shareholding in McLaren Automotive Limited.
McLaren Technology Group (the bit that owns the F1 team) has sold their stake in McLaren Automotive (the car company).ralphrj said:
McLaren Technology Group (the bit that owns the F1 team) has sold their stake in McLaren Automotive (the car company).
This has been stated for awhile, in fact if I think all the way back to 2010 and the launch of the MP4-12C at MTC, Ron Dennis stated he wanted the road car side of things to be completely autonomous when financially viable. Since they have performed ahead of expectations in the past few years then it stacks up.cgt2 said:
This has been stated for awhile, in fact if I think all the way back to 2010 and the launch of the MP4-12C at MTC, Ron Dennis stated he wanted the road car side of things to be completely autonomous when financially viable. Since they have performed ahead of expectations in the past few years then it stacks up.
Having read their accounts I wouldn't necessarily agree that things having been going as well for them as their press releases would have you believe. They are heavily in debt and the company has been kept afloat by a series of loans.For example:
McLaren say that they made a profit a year ahead of plan but their accounts show that they only made a profit because their investors converted their interest bearing loans into equity.
I'd be surprised if the original plan was to borrow money then after a few years say "we can't afford to pay you the interest, how about you write off the loan and turn it into shares which might be worth nothing".
rubystone said:
Who do you think are McKal? ........
McKal aren't registered in the UK so I can't see details of who they are but on 3 May this year a Mexican businessman called Roberto Aguirre was appointed as a director of McLaren Automotive so I expect it is an investment vehicle for him.Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff