+++ The Official Italian (Monza) Grand Prix Thread 2015 +++
Discussion
There's some pricks on this forum. Absolute pricks.
Does anyone remember 2009?
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xahf5i_formule-1-...
Hamilton pushing for a podium on the last lap, bins it.
2015; he's asked to push on tyres he knows could (maybe) go pop (Spa, last week) after dominating from start to finish. Knowing (remember 2009? No? Look to the top of this post if I'm asking too much of your memory)
"he should do his job"
He did his job, you stupid moron. He won the race and brought the car home. That's his job.
I'm no fan boi. I like Lewis Hamilton, he's an astonishing driver and seems like a genuinely nice lad. But I cringe at his after-work personality.
But the idiocy on these forums is breath taking.
Does anyone remember 2009?
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xahf5i_formule-1-...
Hamilton pushing for a podium on the last lap, bins it.
2015; he's asked to push on tyres he knows could (maybe) go pop (Spa, last week) after dominating from start to finish. Knowing (remember 2009? No? Look to the top of this post if I'm asking too much of your memory)
"he should do his job"
He did his job, you stupid moron. He won the race and brought the car home. That's his job.
I'm no fan boi. I like Lewis Hamilton, he's an astonishing driver and seems like a genuinely nice lad. But I cringe at his after-work personality.
But the idiocy on these forums is breath taking.
moanthebairns said:
Zoobeef said:
moanthebairns said:
Zoobeef said:
moanthebairns said:
leglessAlex said:
RichB said:
moanthebairns said:
...Then complained like a whining b
h that I was now needing to push for 5 laps.
It really gets under your skin doesn't it! h that I was now needing to push for 5 laps. 
Deal with it. Hardly like they asked him to drive without a seatbelt. Its what your paid for.
Meaning, they haven't asked him to do something really dangerous so he should just do it. I.e stop being scared about going fast.
king job. "Then complained like a whining b
h that I was now needing to push for 5 laps."Five laps of risk taking when he's worked all season to secure a good lead in the championship. If he'd binned it, Rosberg could still be on his back.
"What gets under my skin is a driver getting paid millions,"
Totally irrelevant.
"who's meant to be the best in the world"
He's the current (and likely going to win his third) World Champion. By any measure, he is the 'best in the world'.
"in a car that's 5 or 6 seconds slower than a decade ago"
Just because a car is slower doesn't make it any easier to drive. Look at the torque and downforce - more and less respectively. The 2015 cars are everywhere out the corners, they only look smooth because the drivers (the best in the world, remember?) drive them LIKE PROS. The limit of adhesion doesn't become any less risky when you're 5 seconds a lap down from 10 years ago.
"with a huge lead in the championship
Which could vanish in one race.
"Deal with it"
He did. To the amazement of everyone (I didn't even see the race, I'm just going on the drivers and managers reactions to his pace - all united in praise)
"No, they asked him to do his f
king job"FFS.
HewManHeMan said:
Does anyone know what happened to the two Lotus?
I've had a search but cant find why Mal dropped off the circuit.
I think there was a Sauber on the inside who clunked Grosjean who bounced into someone who bounced into Pastor, who took evasive action and went over the kerbs at speed and broke the floor of the car...I've had a search but cant find why Mal dropped off the circuit.
HewManHeMan said:
moanthebairns said:
Zoobeef said:
moanthebairns said:
Zoobeef said:
moanthebairns said:
leglessAlex said:
RichB said:
moanthebairns said:
...Then complained like a whining bh that I was now needing to push for 5 laps.
It really gets under your skin doesn't it! h that I was now needing to push for 5 laps. Deal with it. Hardly like they asked him to drive without a seatbelt. Its what your paid for.
Meaning, they haven't asked him to do something really dangerous so he should just do it. I.e stop being scared about going fast.
king job. "Then complained like a whining b
h that I was now needing to push for 5 laps."Five laps of risk taking when he's worked all season to secure a good lead in the championship. If he'd binned it, Rosberg could still be on his back.
"What gets under my skin is a driver getting paid millions,"
Totally irrelevant.
"who's meant to be the best in the world"
He's the current (and likely going to win his third) World Champion. By any measure, he is the 'best in the world'.
"in a car that's 5 or 6 seconds slower than a decade ago"
Just because a car is slower doesn't make it any easier to drive. Look at the torque and downforce - more and less respectively. The 2015 cars are everywhere out the corners, they only look smooth because the drivers (the best in the world, remember?) drive them LIKE PROS. The limit of adhesion doesn't become any less risky when you're 5 seconds a lap down from 10 years ago.
"with a huge lead in the championship
Which could vanish in one race.
"Deal with it"
He did. To the amazement of everyone (I didn't even see the race, I'm just going on the drivers and managers reactions to his pace - all united in praise)
"No, they asked him to do his f
king job"FFS.
Every other week we hear how boring these cars are to drive from the racers, how they aren't on the limit then when asked to punch in 5 laps at quick “race” pace no questions asked, not qualifying pace. This suddenly changes what was an utterly tedious glorified track day into one for the history books. To sit and appreciate it and go wow, f
k me, it’s the pinnacle of 4 wheel motor racing, they should be doing this for 70 laps not 5. What we see from this is that for 65 laps of that race Hamilton wasn’t pushing 100 % or anywhere near. It’s a sad reflection on it to be honest. HewManHeMan said:
There's some pricks on this forum. Absolute pricks.
I hope it hasn't taken you your 1k+ posts to realise this.... haha 
I'm no Lewis fanboy (ok, a bit....(who am i kidding?!haha))but he is arguably the best F1 driver of the past decade (yes, i rate him above Alonso - who i rate very highly)....and, he DOES know how to set-up his car (can't believe people see spout sh*te saying that he can't)
but the more reasoned of us must understand that Hamilton could walk on water and plenty will still try and slate him.
anyhow, i knew nothing was going to come out of this tyre thing.....not now we have a 'brighter' Lewis
moanthebairns said:
Every other week we hear how boring these cars are to drive from the racers, how they aren't on the limit then when asked to punch in 5 laps at quick “race” pace no questions asked, not qualifying pace. This suddenly changes what was an utterly tedious glorified track day into one for the history books. To sit and appreciate it and go wow, fk me, it’s the pinnacle of 4 wheel motor racing, they should be doing this for 70 laps not 5. What we see from this is that for 65 laps of that race Hamilton wasn’t pushing 100 % or anywhere near. It’s a sad reflection on it to be honest.
You are ignoring the old maxim of winning at the slowest pace possible, the lead driver with a 20 second gap 5 laps from the end does not have to push at anywhere near 100% normally. Yesterday it was good to see it can be done when needed.k me, it’s the pinnacle of 4 wheel motor racing, they should be doing this for 70 laps not 5. What we see from this is that for 65 laps of that race Hamilton wasn’t pushing 100 % or anywhere near. It’s a sad reflection on it to be honest. Moominator said:
I don't know Lewis nor can I profess to have any industry/expertise or experience but from his early days of F1 where his raw talent was very apparent, then his fuddled years where anything at all in or outside the car affected his driving- any subsequent wheel-to-wheel action became him binning it. Remember him and Massa for a while?
Finally- his head starts to clear and his talent matures.
Anyone else would have lost their self-belief. I do believe that Lewis still has an element of untapped talent. Who knows but what if hes got another 5yrs of full-tilt in him? I think he'll quit at three titles though.
Umm, you think Hamilton will quit this season if he wins his third title?Finally- his head starts to clear and his talent matures.
Anyone else would have lost their self-belief. I do believe that Lewis still has an element of untapped talent. Who knows but what if hes got another 5yrs of full-tilt in him? I think he'll quit at three titles though.
Moominator said:
I don't know Lewis nor can I profess to have any industry/expertise or experience but from his early days of F1 where his raw talent was very apparent, then his fuddled years where anything at all in or outside the car affected his driving- any subsequent wheel-to-wheel action became him binning it. Remember him and Massa for a while?
Finally- his head starts to clear and his talent matures.
Anyone else would have lost their self-belief. I do believe that Lewis still has an element of untapped talent. Who knows but what if hes got another 5yrs of full-tilt in him? I think he'll quit at three titles though.
I'll doubt he'll quit at the end of this year? ...he's contracted for another 3 seasons too & unless there's another big shift in the regs, that'll be another 3 years in probably the fastest car.Finally- his head starts to clear and his talent matures.
Anyone else would have lost their self-belief. I do believe that Lewis still has an element of untapped talent. Who knows but what if hes got another 5yrs of full-tilt in him? I think he'll quit at three titles though.
After that who knows? ...but i reckon he'll bag at least 5 titles in total
I never quite see the need of some to piss over Hamilton. I was never a great fan of Schumacher, but he has was a superbly talented bloke was never in question. I thought the jury was still out on Sen to be honest until this season - I think thT has highlighted his true ability more than rather riding on Mr Neweys coat tails. Senna - again, not a great fan but to deny he was one of the immortals would be just plain silly.
Same goes for Lewis. It was immediately obvious in his first season that you were looking at someone special and fastest outright Brit there has been in a very long time!
When a blonde has talent you just have to give the chap a nod of your head.
Same goes for Lewis. It was immediately obvious in his first season that you were looking at someone special and fastest outright Brit there has been in a very long time!
When a blonde has talent you just have to give the chap a nod of your head.
DJRC said:
I never quite see the need of some to piss over Hamilton. I was never a great fan of Schumacher, but he has was a superbly talented bloke was never in question. I thought the jury was still out on Sen to be honest until this season - I think thT has highlighted his true ability more than rather riding on Mr Neweys coat tails. Senna - again, not a great fan but to deny he was one of the immortals would be just plain silly.
Same goes for Lewis. It was immediately obvious in his first season that you were looking at someone special and fastest outright Brit there has been in a very long time!
When a blonde has talent you just have to give the chap a nod of your head.
Yep! When all's said and done he will go down as one of the greats. Same goes for Lewis. It was immediately obvious in his first season that you were looking at someone special and fastest outright Brit there has been in a very long time!
When a blonde has talent you just have to give the chap a nod of your head.
ash73 said:
RichB said:
I'll tell you what Ash73, I hope you don't take everyone's ridicule of your posts personally and do stay on this forum as our resident Nico Fanboy just so I can have a good laugh at the hilarious things you post! 
You can gloat as much as you like, I don't give a st. The fact is when Merc was being investigated every Lewis fan to a man was searching for excuses, even comparing it to Williams fitting mismatched tyres which must be the stupidest thing I've ever read on here. I said if they've broken the rules *both* drivers should be penalised; and you turned that into Lewis hate. Like I said, no class.In effect both Ash and the people "against" him were saying the same thing, but there was a lot of people out there saying Mercedes were probably ok and it was someone else's fault, whereas if it was Red Bull and Vettel a few seasons back they would have been saying they should have been punished rather than being given the benefit of the doubt when it was unknown what would happen/ was happening.
NRS said:
As much as I find Ash's love-in posts about Rosberg, there is also the opposite from others. Ash said if they'd been cheating they should be punished. Effectively the same as anyone else. Look at it this way; what was said about Red Bull when they had "things" brought up by the FIA (flexy nose perhaps)? Everyone was saying they were cheating and should be thrown out/ punished etc.
not the same thing.Look, the rule was badly set to make the recommendations mandatory.
if your going to set a rule, you need to define *exactly* under what test conditions will be used to measure for compliance.
In this case, they kind of did, ie, max temp for a tyre in blankets and a min pressure for tyres when fitted to the car.
Problem is that what they should have done was has a table of pressures against tyre temps, ie,
110C min is 19.5 Psi
100C min 19 Psi
90C min 18.5 Psi
80C min 18 Psi
20C min 14.9 Psi
etc etc...
this is the same as any engineer will tell you when making empirical measurements, without stating at what temp etc, the measurement is meaningless (if you ever going into an engineering measuring room, they are temp controlled environments for this very reason).
Scuffers said:
NRS said:
As much as I find Ash's love-in posts about Rosberg, there is also the opposite from others. Ash said if they'd been cheating they should be punished. Effectively the same as anyone else. Look at it this way; what was said about Red Bull when they had "things" brought up by the FIA (flexy nose perhaps)? Everyone was saying they were cheating and should be thrown out/ punished etc.
not the same thing.Look, the rule was badly set to make the recommendations mandatory.
if your going to set a rule, you need to define *exactly* under what test conditions will be used to measure for compliance.
In this case, they kind of did, ie, max temp for a tyre in blankets and a min pressure for tyres when fitted to the car.
Problem is that what they should have done was has a table of pressures against tyre temps, ie,
110C min is 19.5 Psi
100C min 19 Psi
90C min 18.5 Psi
80C min 18 Psi
20C min 14.9 Psi
etc etc...
this is the same as any engineer will tell you when making empirical measurements, without stating at what temp etc, the measurement is meaningless (if you ever going into an engineering measuring room, they are temp controlled environments for this very reason).
NRS said:
Yeap, I agree and so does Ash I would suspect now we know the proper picture of what happened. However my point was we didn't KNOW what happened with the measurements and so they could have been done at the correct temperatures and so on. However with Mercedes everyone assumed it was ok and they were probably not cheating before this was confirmed. Whereas with some other teams/ drivers most people automatically think they are cheating at first and so should be punished. Even when it was not clear.
Ah, OK, I get you.the difference here is that in all the RB flexing stuff, the test was clear and RB made the part to pass said test.
Now, some say that's against the spirit of the regs, but that's bull, there is no spirit of the regs, if it's not in black and white, it means nothing.
The problem with flexing was 100% down to the FIA and their stupidity in setting the test criteria.
As for teams, RB (or more precisely, Mr Newey) will always punish mistakes in the regs on this stuff, much as Mr Braun did with the diffuser, and many more before them in years gone by.
this is not the same as the bulls
t we went through with Ferrari and their barge-board tolerances, and plethora of other rule breaking, or Renault and their illegal software, fuel rig, etc. that were all clearly illegal but fudged over (by the FIA)Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff