New HALO system tested

[HustleRussell]

24lemons said:

I get frustrated by arguments suggesting that this is somehow a kneejerk reaction to an imagined problem. It is a fact that open wheel drivers have been hurt and killed in recent years by avoidable head injuries. It isn't exclusively an F1 problem and the halo/screen are a reaction to those incidents.

The high profile cases in 2008 began the discussion and 8 years later we have the first working prototypes. Id hardly call that rushed through.

One of the key objections people voice about driver head protection is aesthetic impact and divergence from F1's roots. In my opinion F1 has always evolved and the current incarnation is a long way from its origins. With the aero shield the car will still be open cockpit for these who feel that is important, they effectively have a version of the windshields that were on some of the cars in the 1970s, so what's the problem?

The idea of doing nothing when there are still ways to improve safety is akin to accepting the casualties as a reasonable price for a Sunday's entertainment.

Fair enough, I didn't know they had been in the pipeline for so long. Still, these in my opinion bear little comparison to the aeroscreens we’ve seen before and this is compounded by the fact that drivers seem to sit lower relative to the top of the tubs than ever before (perhaps you’ll correct me on this, I wasn’t around I the 70s)

I just think it’s a big trade off in terms of spectator appeal vs. debatable safety advantage and I just don’t like it that much.

I might be typing from the comfort of my armchair now but I have raced semi-open cars and will race open cars in the future… It’s part of the appeal.

bakerstreet said:

HustleRussell said:

My issue with it is that F1 is historically an open cockpit formula and part of the draw is that you as a spectator can see the driver working.

You can see nothing apart from a head turning from left to right. On occasion, you might get an arm wave. In car cameras might show a bit of arm twirling, but most of the time all you will see is head movement and not much of it.

If you want to see 'working', then MotoGP, WSB or BSB is where to look.

I disagree, you can see the forces acting on the driver, the way they strain against the belts under braking, you can see when they look in their mirrors, you can see their hands when they are steering, their corrections, gear changes and dial adjustments… at the night races you can see the whites of their eyes. All of this will be compromised to an extent.

P.S. I do watch bike racing, I don't find it 'better', but 'different'.

[24lemons]

longshot said:

I don't see who this device is going to save.

It wouldn't have helped Bianchi.
It would have helped Massa and it's questionable whether it would have saved Henry Surtees.

Unless I'm missing some other incidents, there seems no reason behind it.

Who originally suggested this idea?

Off the top of my head, the significant head injuries in open cockpit racing cars that I can recall;

Christiano Da Matta, Champ Car, hit a deer at a test 2006
Felipe Massa, F1, hit by spring 2009
Henry Surtees, F2, hit by wheel 2009
Dan Wheldon, Indycar, hit a pole 2011
Maria De Villota, F1, hit race trailer 2012
James Hinchcliffe, Indycar, hit by debris 2014
Jules Bianchi, F1 hit tractor 2014
Justin Wilson, Indycar, hit by debris 2015


Admittedly the screen wont have saved everybody but nobody is claiming that it will. It may have reduced the severity of some injuries but we aren't to know. I dont think its fair to try and guess what would have happened to XY or Z as we will never know for sure.

What the list shows however is that drivers heads are vulnerable in open cockpits and my opinion is that if the technology exists to prevent further casualties then I'm all for it.

[glazbagun]

It wouldn't have helped Massa, but couldn't you just fit a cage over the cockpit? Or even two bars jutting up in front of the mirrors to catch cars/tyres.

[EnglishTony]

glazbagun said:

It wouldn't have helped Massa, but couldn't you just fit a cage over the cockpit? Or even two bars jutting up in front of the mirrors to catch cars/tyres.

Attach the mirrors to the bars.

[Eric Mc]

24lemons said:

Off the top of my head, the significant head injuries in open cockpit racing cars that I can recall;

Christiano Da Matta, Champ Car, hit a deer at a test 2006
Felipe Massa, F1, hit by spring 2009
Henry Surtees, F2, hit by wheel 2009
Dan Wheldon, Indycar, hit a pole 2011
Maria De Villota, F1, hit race trailer 2012
James Hinchcliffe, Indycar, hit by debris 2014
Jules Bianchi, F1 hit tractor 2014
Justin Wilson, Indycar, hit by debris 2015


Admittedly the screen wont have saved everybody but nobody is claiming that it will. It may have reduced the severity of some injuries but we aren't to know. I dont think its fair to try and guess what would have happened to XY or Z as we will never know for sure.

What the list shows however is that drivers heads are vulnerable in open cockpits and my opinion is that if the technology exists to prevent further casualties then I'm all for it.

Is head protection being stipulated for ALL open cockpit classes?

[37chevy]

24lemons said:

Off the top of my head, the significant head injuries in open cockpit racing cars that I can recall;

Christiano Da Matta, Champ Car, hit a deer at a test 2006
Felipe Massa, F1, hit by spring 2009
Henry Surtees, F2, hit by wheel 2009
Dan Wheldon, Indycar, hit a pole 2011
Maria De Villota, F1, hit race trailer 2012
James Hinchcliffe, Indycar, hit by debris 2014
Jules Bianchi, F1 hit tractor 2014
Justin Wilson, Indycar, hit by debris 2015

Im guessing that the screen would have only saved Justin Wilsons and maybe Henry Surtees life. the force of dans, jules and marias crash would have destroyed the screen.

my biggest worry is not how many lives a screen would save...which with debris, no doubt it will help, but rather how many injuries/ lives will be lost because of it. I see more cars that have ended upside down in crashes than drivers being hit by debris, if that's the case will drivers be trapped, fire risk, difficulty extracting drivers, if the screen breaks during impact where will the shards go etc etc.

yes you solve one problem but introduce another. also how will it work in really hot races...must be like a greenhouse in there!

[longshot]

24lemons said:

longshot said:

I don't see who this device is going to save.

It wouldn't have helped Bianchi.
It would have helped Massa and it's questionable whether it would have saved Henry Surtees.

Unless I'm missing some other incidents, there seems no reason behind it.

Who originally suggested this idea?

Off the top of my head, the significant head injuries in open cockpit racing cars that I can recall;

Christiano Da Matta, Champ Car, hit a deer at a test 2006
Felipe Massa, F1, hit by spring 2009
Henry Surtees, F2, hit by wheel 2009
Dan Wheldon, Indycar, hit a pole 2011
Maria De Villota, F1, hit race trailer 2012
James Hinchcliffe, Indycar, hit by debris 2014
Jules Bianchi, F1 hit tractor 2014
Justin Wilson, Indycar, hit by debris 2015


Admittedly the screen wont have saved everybody but nobody is claiming that it will. It may have reduced the severity of some injuries but we aren't to know. I dont think its fair to try and guess what would have happened to XY or Z as we will never know for sure.

What the list shows however is that drivers heads are vulnerable in open cockpits and my opinion is that if the technology exists to prevent further casualties then I'm all for it.

I very much doubt the outcome of most of those examples would be any different.
You know as well as I that when an Indy car has a major on an oval it's like throwing a piece of cheese at a grater.
The car is destroyed and sadly because of this the driver is in grave danger.

Using a screen will never work because they don't have tear offs. A car using a little oil could stop a race.
This leaves us with the Halo which is in essence a cage with most of the bars missing.
This restricts the amount of incidents in which it will be useful down to a few.
Going back to your list, probably and it is only probably, Henry Surtees.

[24lemons]

Eric Mc said:

Is head protection being stipulated for ALL open cockpit classes?

I believe that Indycar are looking at it as well http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/motor/2016/02... and they are interested in the FIA's response to the problem, which is being developed primarily for F1.

Other recent safety features such as raised cockpit sides, chassis crash structures, wheel tethers etc.. tend to get developed in F1 and then filter down through the different championships. I suppose F1 has the money and profile to drive the R&D which then trickles down to the lower formulae.

Outside of single seaters, LMP cars are gradually going toward the fully enclosed cockpit design.

[Eric Mc]

Caterham got there years ago.

[FourWheelDrift]

Halo seems to be dumped in favour of the Red Bull style windscreen "shield".

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/243410/1/fia-reveals-...