Is the safety car start, the beginning of the end?
Discussion
HustleRussell said:
Eric Mc said:
Yep - all those respected motor racing journalists like Nigel Roebuck, Mike Lawrence and (as mentioned above), Joe Saward. What do they know?
A lot. About the past. Eric Mc said:
As I mentioned earlier, those who think those six or so laps behind the "Safety Car" were anything to do with safety are completely deluded as to how modern F1 works.
I don't mind a differing of opinion, but I object to an inference of delusion when you are as much an armchair expert as many on this thread.C70R said:
Vaud said:
Eric Mc said:
Judgement - something human beings do have the ability to exercise.
Which is what was exercised. Judgement by the race director, drawing on a vast amount more information than we mortals have access to.Eric would much rather talk about how great it was in "the old days", and how progress/money/safety/celebrity/status/TV has ruined the sport.
The PH armchair experts are hilarious. The race director has more experience and information available to him than the combined total of this thread's contributors - not that this will stop the oldies knowing better, frothing at the mouth, and threatening to cancel their F1 Magazine subscriptions!
When the whole circus disappears because nobody wants to watch it, then you will see who held the more valid set of views.
Vaud said:
Eric Mc said:
As I mentioned earlier, those who think those six or so laps behind the "Safety Car" were anything to do with safety are completely deluded as to how modern F1 works.
I don't mind a differing of opinion, but I object to an inference of delusion when you are as much an armchair expert as many on this thread.Eric Mc said:
Vaud said:
Maybe. But in the modern world the viewing public and sponsors don't want to see their heroes die on live TV.
They never did. But they did and probably do want to see dramatic action. They want to see their driving heroes tested and pushing the edges - something they themselves as "ordinary" people would never do.If they see their "heroes" being mollycoddled and wrapped in cotton wool, they pretty soon won't be heroes.
So, it's safe/fair to say that the safety car had absolutely no bearing on how exciting the race was?
Please take your condescending "it was better in my day" nonsense somewhere else. Everyone sees it for exactly what it is - an excuse for you to moan about something.
C70R said:
I presume that you, like the OP, took to some light gardening work rather than watch the race? It was a race full of "dramatic action" (or as full as Monaco ever gets), full of drivers pushing themselves hard, and in a few cases pushing past the edge. It was probably the most eventful Monaco in recent years, and certainly generated plenty of buzz/column inches.
So, it's safe/fair to say that the safety car had absolutely no bearing on how exciting the race was?
Please take your condescending "it was better in my day" nonsense somewhere else. Everyone sees it for exactly what it is - an excuse for you to moan about something.
So - your next debating tactic is to tell me to "get lost". Are you long out of the school playground?So, it's safe/fair to say that the safety car had absolutely no bearing on how exciting the race was?
Please take your condescending "it was better in my day" nonsense somewhere else. Everyone sees it for exactly what it is - an excuse for you to moan about something.
I listened to the race live on Radio 5 and later watched it on Channel 4 - so I most definitely was not out in the garden (that's my wife's domain, anyway). It actually was not a bad race at all, as I have mentioned elsewhere, but those first few laps were unnecessary and tedious. - that's all I'm saying.
Vaud said:
Eric Mc said:
Well, what do you think the PRIME purpose of setting off behind the so-called "Safety Car" was?
I'm not entirely sure there is any point in debating it with you given your inferred insults. Only a page ago you were reacting to another poster who "insulted" you.But I do think you don't seem to understand the REAL reason why we have parade laps behind safety cars at the start of races.
Eric Mc said:
How insulting can a person get. They cover the modern scene as well - especially Saward and Roebuck.
They are Journalists. They report, dissect, analyse... even speculate. They do not influence. Just because of their knowledge and experience we are not obligated to agree with them. They are not running the show. For that you have to look to the drivers, team members, and the race director.Eric Mc said:
When the whole circus disappears because nobody wants to watch it, then you will see who held the more valid set of views.
Your views are as valid as my views, but if you're looking for the disappearance of a sport you love to validate yours then I pity your pessimism.
Eric Mc said:
C70R said:
Vaud said:
Eric Mc said:
Judgement - something human beings do have the ability to exercise.
Which is what was exercised. Judgement by the race director, drawing on a vast amount more information than we mortals have access to.Eric would much rather talk about how great it was in "the old days", and how progress/money/safety/celebrity/status/TV has ruined the sport.
The PH armchair experts are hilarious. The race director has more experience and information available to him than the combined total of this thread's contributors - not that this will stop the oldies knowing better, frothing at the mouth, and threatening to cancel their F1 Magazine subscriptions!
When the whole circus disappears because nobody wants to watch it, then you will see who held the more valid set of views.
"The whole circus" is showing no signs of "disappearing" any time soon. More people are watching F1 globally than ever before!
This growth comes in spite of attempts by the "it was better in my day" crowd to drag it back to the stone age.
(Please don't attempt to refute this by pulling up articles about declining viewing figures in the UK. It's moving in the opposite direction to lamost every other global market, and is not caused by lack of interest, but by a move to a subscription-only broadcaster in 2016.)
Eric Mc said:
C70R said:
I presume that you, like the OP, took to some light gardening work rather than watch the race? It was a race full of "dramatic action" (or as full as Monaco ever gets), full of drivers pushing themselves hard, and in a few cases pushing past the edge. It was probably the most eventful Monaco in recent years, and certainly generated plenty of buzz/column inches.
So, it's safe/fair to say that the safety car had absolutely no bearing on how exciting the race was?
Please take your condescending "it was better in my day" nonsense somewhere else. Everyone sees it for exactly what it is - an excuse for you to moan about something.
So - your next debating tactic is to tell me to "get lost". Are you long out of the school playground?So, it's safe/fair to say that the safety car had absolutely no bearing on how exciting the race was?
Please take your condescending "it was better in my day" nonsense somewhere else. Everyone sees it for exactly what it is - an excuse for you to moan about something.
I listened to the race live on Radio 5 and later watched it on Channel 4 - so I most definitely was not out in the garden (that's my wife's domain, anyway). It actually was not a bad race at all, as I have mentioned elsewhere, but those first few laps were unnecessary and tedious. - that's all I'm saying.
Then what are you flapping about? Do you enjoy moaning? Would you choose to watch an enjoyable race and still find something incidental to moan about?
C70R said:
"The whole circus" is showing no signs of "disappearing" any time soon. More people are watching F1 globally than ever before!
This growth comes in spite of attempts by the "it was better in my day" crowd to drag it back to the stone age.
(Please don't attempt to refute this by pulling up articles about declining viewing figures in the UK. It's moving in the opposite direction to almost every other global market, and is not caused by lack of interest, but by a move to a subscription-only broadcaster in 2016.)
I think you will find that this is not true. The growing markets actually aren't growing at all. And, some of the "new " markets have already given up. Adding new countries to attempt to increase TV viewing figures is not sustainable.This growth comes in spite of attempts by the "it was better in my day" crowd to drag it back to the stone age.
(Please don't attempt to refute this by pulling up articles about declining viewing figures in the UK. It's moving in the opposite direction to almost every other global market, and is not caused by lack of interest, but by a move to a subscription-only broadcaster in 2016.)
In fact, I was shocked to see massive gaps in the grandstands at Monaco during qualifying. This was MONACO - the jewel in the F1 crown - and it wasn't full, I couldn't believe it.
If you really think F1 is in good hands and set for a glowing future, I think you will find that is not where it's heading at the moment.
C70R said:
So you're saying that the safety car didn't spoil the race?
Then what are you flapping about? Do you enjoy moaning? Would you choose to watch an enjoyable race and still find something incidental to moan about?
Obviously you are either hard of thinking, hard of reading or maybe all three.Then what are you flapping about? Do you enjoy moaning? Would you choose to watch an enjoyable race and still find something incidental to moan about?
The sheer hypocrisy...Eric Mc said:
I wasn't calling you names.
But I do think you don't seem to understand the REAL reason why we have parade laps behind safety cars at the start of races.
Eric, you are a valued poster on many threads.But I do think you don't seem to understand the REAL reason why we have parade laps behind safety cars at the start of races.
But if you don't think this was an insult "those who think those six or so laps behind the "Safety Car" were anything to do with safety are completely deluded", then I suggest a pause a breath of fresh air, as you are capable and proven of a far higher quality of discussion.
C70R said:
The PH armchair experts are hilarious. The race director has more experience and information available to him than the combined total of this thread's contributors - not that this will stop the oldies knowing better, frothing at the mouth, and threatening to cancel their F1 Magazine subscriptions!
So you know the brief that the race director was working to, please tell us, I'm dying to know, did he tell you personally or by text 
C70R said:
Stop it with your simple common sense!
Eric would much rather talk about how great it was in "the old days", and how progress/money/safety/celebrity/status/TV has ruined the sport.
The PH armchair experts are hilarious. The race director has more experience and information available to him than the combined total of this thread's contributors - not that this will stop the oldies knowing better, frothing at the mouth, and threatening to cancel their F1 Magazine subscriptions!
That same race director who's being sued for not realising that the helicopter couldn't fly at Suzuka. People in powerful positions aren't always right.Eric would much rather talk about how great it was in "the old days", and how progress/money/safety/celebrity/status/TV has ruined the sport.
The PH armchair experts are hilarious. The race director has more experience and information available to him than the combined total of this thread's contributors - not that this will stop the oldies knowing better, frothing at the mouth, and threatening to cancel their F1 Magazine subscriptions!
Jez
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