The Official 2016 Belgian Grand Prix Thread **Spoilers**

[Smollet]

VolvoT5 said:

Max has too much 'box office' appeal and so nothing will be done about his antics until he causes a Grosjean at Spa style pile up or he upsets one of the other drivers so much that they either deliberately ram him off the track or smack him in the chops post race. But by that point it could be too late.

The disappointing thing is that just like Schumacher he has so much talent he doesn't need to pull dirty tricks to get his own way most of the time, but he still chooses to. On the rare occasion he is beaten into a corner he should learn when is time to give it up. I don't care what the rules say there is a certain unwritten code of conduct in that the drivers should not break.... for safety and good sportsmanship purposes.

It started with Senna and his very dubious driving tactics. Schumacher just followed his example. If Senna had been penalised and banned then I doubt very much we would have seen what quite frankly is downright dangerous driving that has been copied by so called wunderkind with copious amounts of talent who don't need to resort to such antics. The sooner it's stamped on the better for everyone's sake. Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again if that what it takes to get the message across. He's a fking menace.

[M3ax]

Smollet said:

It started with Senna and his very dubious driving tactics. Schumacher just followed his example. If Senna had been penalised and banned then I doubt very much we would have seen what quite frankly is downright dangerous driving that has been copied by so called wunderkind with copious amounts of talent who don't need to resort to such antics. The sooner it's stamped on the better for everyone's sake. Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again if that what it takes to get the message across. He's a fking menace.

Harsh. But I agree.

[DeltonaS]

M3ax said:

Smollet said:

It started with Senna and his very dubious driving tactics. Schumacher just followed his example. If Senna had been penalised and banned then I doubt very much we would have seen what quite frankly is downright dangerous driving that has been copied by so called wunderkind with copious amounts of talent who don't need to resort to such antics. The sooner it's stamped on the better for everyone's sake. Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again if that what it takes to get the message across. He's a fking menace.

Harsh. But I agree.

Sure, how tendentious and tedious....

Would you say the same if was British. I bet most on here would just call it "racing".

[HustleRussell]

Hamilton's British. You may have noticed he's not universally liked here.

[M3ax]

DeltonaS said:

M3ax said:

Smollet said:

It started with Senna and his very dubious driving tactics. Schumacher just followed his example. If Senna had been penalised and banned then I doubt very much we would have seen what quite frankly is downright dangerous driving that has been copied by so called wunderkind with copious amounts of talent who don't need to resort to such antics. The sooner it's stamped on the better for everyone's sake. Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again if that what it takes to get the message across. He's a fking menace.

Harsh. But I agree.

Sure, how tendentious and tedious....

Would you say the same if was British. I bet most on here would just call it "racing".

Absolutely yes I would have the same opinion regardless of nationality.

[Smollet]

DeltonaS said:

M3ax said:

Smollet said:

It started with Senna and his very dubious driving tactics. Schumacher just followed his example. If Senna had been penalised and banned then I doubt very much we would have seen what quite frankly is downright dangerous driving that has been copied by so called wunderkind with copious amounts of talent who don't need to resort to such antics. The sooner it's stamped on the better for everyone's sake. Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again if that what it takes to get the message across. He's a fking menace.

Harsh. But I agree.

Sure, how tendentious and tedious....

Would you say the same if was British. I bet most on here would just call it "racing".

Yes I would. What has nationality got to do with dangerous driving?

[anonymous-user]

VolvoT5 said:

garyhun said:

freddytin said:

Who has the balls to dole out the black flags ?

Unfortunately no one it would seem.

I don't care what the rules say there is a certain unwritten code of conduct in that the drivers should not break.... for safety and good sportsmanship purposes.

As the Autosport article states, the issue is that rules have replaced the 'unwritten agreement" for some drivers and they therefore they find ways around those rules.

Max needs a to be shown that his antics are not acceptable or else the first time it does go horribly wrong someone will be badly injured or worse.

[DeltonaS]

Smollet said:

DeltonaS said:

M3ax said:

Smollet said:

It started with Senna and his very dubious driving tactics. Schumacher just followed his example. If Senna had been penalised and banned then I doubt very much we would have seen what quite frankly is downright dangerous driving that has been copied by so called wunderkind with copious amounts of talent who don't need to resort to such antics. The sooner it's stamped on the better for everyone's sake. Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again if that what it takes to get the message across. He's a fking menace.

Harsh. But I agree.

Sure, how tendentious and tedious....

Would you say the same if was British. I bet most on here would just call it "racing".

Yes I would. What has nationality got to do with dangerous driving?

Nothing of course.

But I seriously doubt you would argue the same and with the same strong language; "Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again".

Which of course is a totally ridiculous statement to make, if a driver needs to be corrected, a penalty would be a first option (which he didn't even get), an exclusion of 1 or mores races could be a second one and wrecking a career is pretty much the very last resort.

Senna and Schumi wouldn't have a career by the way, and a couple more.

But speaking of why nationality and judgement matters, an example outside of racing; Cavendish almost wrecked the Olympics for three riders, one of which was hospitalized, the later gold medaillist escaped from injury. A stunt by the way he pulled of a couple of times earlier in road racing, TdF for instance. And with the same outcome and the exact same Cavendish reactions (first ignoring the incident, than denying, than that awkward passive aggressive tone of him accusing and threatening others, than finally followed by an excuse to the persons he injured).

Italian, Dutch and Belgian commentators were stunned he wasn't disq. , Britain and PH however couldn't care less.

[DeltonaS]

garyhun said:

VolvoT5 said:

garyhun said:

freddytin said:

Who has the balls to dole out the black flags ?

Unfortunately no one it would seem.

I don't care what the rules say there is a certain unwritten code of conduct in that the drivers should not break.... for safety and good sportsmanship purposes.

As the Autosport article states, the issue is that rules have replaced the 'unwritten agreement" for some drivers and they therefore they find ways around those rules.

Max needs a to be shown that his antics are not acceptable or else the first time it does go horribly wrong someone will be badly injured or worse.

Race control is terribly inconsistent in a lot of incidents. One of the ways to improve their effectiveness is that it needs to be manned by the same persons at every race, not the tombola at every race of ex-racing drivers.

[Smollet]

DeltonaS said:

Nothing of course.

But I seriously doubt you would argue the same and with the same strong language; "Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again".

Which of course is a totally ridiculous statement to make, if a driver needs to be corrected, a penalty would be a first option (which he didn't even get), an exclusion of 1 or mores races could be a second one and wrecking a career is pretty much the very last resort.

Senna and Schumi wouldn't have a career by the way, and a couple more.

But speaking of why nationality and judgement matters, an example outside of racing; Cavendish almost wrecked the Olympics for three riders, one of which was hospitalized, the later gold medaillist escaped from injury. A stunt by the way he pulled of a couple of times earlier in road racing, TdF for instance. And with the same outcome and the exact same Cavendish reactions (first ignoring the incident, than denying, than that awkward passive aggressive tone of him accusing and threatening others, than finally followed by an excuse to the persons he injured).

Italian, Dutch and Belgian commentators were stunned he wasn't disq. , Britain and PH however couldn't care less.

Sorry to say but why is it a ridiculous statement to make?

[DeltonaS]

Smollet said:

Sorry to say but why is it a ridiculous statement to make?

Partly already explained in the above, ending a career on 1 or 2 mistakes is quite a punishment isn't it.

[glazbagun]

DeltonaS said:

TdF for instance. And with the same outcome and the exact same Cavendish reactions (first ignoring the incident, than denying, than that awkward passive aggressive tone of him accusing and threatening others, than finally followed by an excuse to the persons he injured).

Italian, Dutch and Belgian commentators were stunned he wasn't disq. , Britain and PH however couldn't care less.

I read the "never step in a car again" comment much as you describe your own policy- if he can do a Grosjean and improve his defending then great- theres been loads of love for Max on PH.

If (if!) he won't improve, it would be better that he leave altogether than hang around for two decades of pushing people into walls and inviting accidents like Senna/Schumacher did. IMO.

Re:the bike thing, that's not my sport. But you only need to roll back to the Ham/Rosberg crash at Spain to see that PH is no love-in for the Brits.

[slipstream 1985]

DeltonaS said:

Nothing of course.

But I seriously doubt you would argue the same and with the same strong language; "Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again".

Which of course is a totally ridiculous statement to make, if a driver needs to be corrected, a penalty would be a first option (which he didn't even get), an exclusion of 1 or mores races could be a second one and wrecking a career is pretty much the very last resort.

Senna and Schumi wouldn't have a career by the way, and a couple more.

But speaking of why nationality and judgement matters, an example outside of racing; Cavendish almost wrecked the Olympics for three riders, one of which was hospitalized, the later gold medaillist escaped from injury. A stunt by the way he pulled of a couple of times earlier in road racing, TdF for instance. And with the same outcome and the exact same Cavendish reactions (first ignoring the incident, than denying, than that awkward passive aggressive tone of him accusing and threatening others, than finally followed by an excuse to the persons he injured).

Italian, Dutch and Belgian commentators were stunned he wasn't disq. , Britain and PH however couldn't care less.

What did he do/say? link to article or video?

[HustleRussell]

DeltonaS said:

Smollet said:

DeltonaS said:

M3ax said:

Smollet said:

It started with Senna and his very dubious driving tactics. Schumacher just followed his example. If Senna had been penalised and banned then I doubt very much we would have seen what quite frankly is downright dangerous driving that has been copied by so called wunderkind with copious amounts of talent who don't need to resort to such antics. The sooner it's stamped on the better for everyone's sake. Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again if that what it takes to get the message across. He's a fking menace.

Harsh. But I agree.

Sure, how tendentious and tedious....

Would you say the same if was British. I bet most on here would just call it "racing".

Yes I would. What has nationality got to do with dangerous driving?

Nothing of course.

But I seriously doubt you would argue the same and with the same strong language; "Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again".

Which of course is a totally ridiculous statement to make, if a driver needs to be corrected, a penalty would be a first option (which he didn't even get), an exclusion of 1 or mores races could be a second one and wrecking a career is pretty much the very last resort.

Senna and Schumi wouldn't have a career by the way, and a couple more.

But speaking of why nationality and judgement matters, an example outside of racing; Cavendish almost wrecked the Olympics for three riders, one of which was hospitalized, the later gold medaillist escaped from injury. A stunt by the way he pulled of a couple of times earlier in road racing, TdF for instance. And with the same outcome and the exact same Cavendish reactions (first ignoring the incident, than denying, than that awkward passive aggressive tone of him accusing and threatening others, than finally followed by an excuse to the persons he injured).

Italian, Dutch and Belgian commentators were stunned he wasn't disq. , Britain and PH however couldn't care less.

DeltonaS Profile said:

Country: Netherlands

The irony of you accusing the British of being unpartisan while defending tooth and nail the dangerous driving (in this incident) of the Dutch driver has not been lost on me.

[NM62]

HustleRussell said:

The irony of you accusing the British of being unpartisan while defending tooth and nail the dangerous driving (in this incident) of the Dutch driver has not been lost on me.

... And it as been pointed out to DeltonaS before but he never responds/acknowledges it - strangely.

[Smollet]

DeltonaS said:

Smollet said:

Sorry to say but why is it a ridiculous statement to make?

Partly already explained in the above, ending a career on 1 or 2 mistakes is quite a punishment isn't it.

It'd certainly get the message across. Something that was missed with Senna and Schumacher.

[DeltonaS]

HustleRussell said:

DeltonaS said:

Smollet said:

DeltonaS said:

M3ax said:

Smollet said:

It started with Senna and his very dubious driving tactics. Schumacher just followed his example. If Senna had been penalised and banned then I doubt very much we would have seen what quite frankly is downright dangerous driving that has been copied by so called wunderkind with copious amounts of talent who don't need to resort to such antics. The sooner it's stamped on the better for everyone's sake. Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again if that what it takes to get the message across. He's a fking menace.

Harsh. But I agree.

Sure, how tendentious and tedious....

Would you say the same if was British. I bet most on here would just call it "racing".

Yes I would. What has nationality got to do with dangerous driving?

Nothing of course.

But I seriously doubt you would argue the same and with the same strong language; "Personally I don't care if Verstappen ever graces an F1 car ever again".

Which of course is a totally ridiculous statement to make, if a driver needs to be corrected, a penalty would be a first option (which he didn't even get), an exclusion of 1 or mores races could be a second one and wrecking a career is pretty much the very last resort.

Senna and Schumi wouldn't have a career by the way, and a couple more.

But speaking of why nationality and judgement matters, an example outside of racing; Cavendish almost wrecked the Olympics for three riders, one of which was hospitalized, the later gold medaillist escaped from injury. A stunt by the way he pulled of a couple of times earlier in road racing, TdF for instance. And with the same outcome and the exact same Cavendish reactions (first ignoring the incident, than denying, than that awkward passive aggressive tone of him accusing and threatening others, than finally followed by an excuse to the persons he injured).

Italian, Dutch and Belgian commentators were stunned he wasn't disq. , Britain and PH however couldn't care less.

DeltonaS Profile said:

Country: Netherlands

The irony of you accusing the British of being unpartisan while defending tooth and nail the dangerous driving (in this incident) of the Dutch driver has not been lost on me.

Maybe you should read your own reactions just a couple of times over next time, just to make sure it doesn't contain a reaction which completely (and deliberately?) misses the point.

But to help you somewhat, where did I defended what and secondly some on here seem to find an overreaction justified on one or two incidents that Race control didn't even respond to.

[HustleRussell]

DeltonaS said:

Maybe you should read your own reactions just a couple of times over next time, just to make sure it doesn't contain a reaction which completely (and deliberately?) misses the point.

Example?

[DeltonaS]

Smollet said:

DeltonaS said:

Smollet said:

Sorry to say but why is it a ridiculous statement to make?

Partly already explained in the above, ending a career on 1 or 2 mistakes is quite a punishment isn't it.

It'd certainly get the message across. Something that was missed with Senna and Schumacher.

Sure, different times, different rules. Which race control is in place to enforce, which it's doing very inconsistent.

Take for instance the number of times Hamilton squeezed other drivers and occasionally even crowded fellow drivers off track (literally in the FIA F1 rule book), but didn't receive a penalty for.

Dangerous driving might not be ok, disingenuous driving just the same. Except of course in Hamiltons case it just "racing".

But I don't mind if his career is ended as well then. Might get the message across.

But then we may up with a field full of Massa's.

[angrymoby]

DeltonaS said:

Take for instance the number of times Hamilton squeezed other drivers and occasionally even crowded fellow drivers off track (literally in the FIA F1 rule book), but didn't receive a penalty for. .

You don't understand the 'rules' do you?