Lewis Hamilton
Discussion
deadslow said:
swisstoni said:
Pretty sure Vettel got all the new aero bits (and anything else) before Webber. Fairly good sign of No.1 status.
Yes, but Mark was cruising towards the end of his career, while the wonderkid was beating all comers, though obviously rubbished on here because his car was perceived as dominant. 
LDN said:
The red bull most certainly was geared toward Seb'. As well Seb' didn't shine up against Ricciardo and Kimi has had his moments next to him also... make of that what you will.
Kimi has been doing pretty well this season this season. Especially compared to when he joined alongside Alonso and looked like a mistake signing!I get the feeling that Vettel is seeing exactly what Alonso was on about... what's the point of being second all the time; may as well be anywhere. If Ferrari don't pick with the changes next year: watch the Ferrari / Vettel relationship go sour... like the Alonso Ferrari relationship did. Both Vettel and Alonso deserve better... but at least Seb had all those years with a dominant RB. Alonso has never really made a genius move, team wise.
LDN said:
deadslow said:
swisstoni said:
Pretty sure Vettel got all the new aero bits (and anything else) before Webber. Fairly good sign of No.1 status.
Yes, but Mark was cruising towards the end of his career, while the wonderkid was beating all comers, though obviously rubbished on here because his car was perceived as dominant. Like most F1 drivers, Vettel has some driving characteristics which mean he can't beat everyone in any car. He prefers the car a certain way, and if development moves the car out of his comfort/flattery zone, his relative performance suffers. The only driver who can seem to drag any old dog around is Alonso, imho.
deadslow said:
LDN said:
deadslow said:
swisstoni said:
Pretty sure Vettel got all the new aero bits (and anything else) before Webber. Fairly good sign of No.1 status.
Yes, but Mark was cruising towards the end of his career, while the wonderkid was beating all comers, though obviously rubbished on here because his car was perceived as dominant. Like most F1 drivers, Vettel has some driving characteristics which mean he can't beat everyone in any car. He prefers the car a certain way, and if development moves the car out of his comfort/flattery zone, his relative performance suffers. The only driver who can seem to drag any old dog around is Alonso, imho.
This season more than any has had 2 by 2 qualifying results, which just shows exactly where the cars performance is, i.e
You'd have to trawl the stats to see where drivers over achieved. Funny how I never here about Bottas much as the great hope, funny that as it was the Merc engine in that Williams making him look better than he was in comparison to others.
Who do i think has stood out this season. I'd say personally the German kid in the Manor and as such also theThai lad in the Manor who got ditched and Ocon now in the Manor. And also Gutierez.
Edited by tommunster10 on Thursday 27th October 15:11
tommunster10 said:
Who do i think has stood out this season. I'd say personally the German kid in the Manor and as such also theThai lad in the Manor who got ditched and Ocon now in the Manor. And also Gutierez.
For me, you've selected 3 people who have driven the same car at about the same level and one driver who has been comprehensively outperformed by his teammate. All that the Manor drivers have demonstrated is that any competent driver can jump into a back of the grid F1 car and avoid being lapped by the front runners for the first 10 laps. They've also proven that the Manor isn't as good a car as a Haas DallaraEdited by tommunster10 on Thursday 27th October 15:11
For me, Verstappen is the stand-out driver this year. I didn't expect him to get on top of the car so quickly, to keep it out of the wall and to be competitive on most of the circuits. He's improved so much from when I saw him in the junior formulae.
rubystone said:
HustleRussell said:
You mean the Indonesian one?
I think he would of mentioned him. He kept the German one quite honest and he's highly regarded and a future Merc driver, i'm sure if he made the step up the the factory Merc he'd stick it in 2nd place pretty routinely was sort of my point i was making, so for his team mates to be close to him or beating him is a good performance.
swisstoni said:
tommunster10 said:
Whatever, don't really follow the drivers that closely I just follow the sport.
Hmmm. You seem to have a lot to say on this thread about one particular driver.It's a Friday I'll let you off... LOL.
tommunster10 said:
Whatever, don't really follow the drivers that closely I just follow the sport.
He kept the German one quite honest and he's highly regarded and a future Merc driver, i'm sure if he made the step up the the factory Merc he'd stick it in 2nd place pretty routinely was sort of my point i was making, so for his team mates to be close to him or beating him is a good performance.
I'm confused. Are we talking about the Thai guy, the Indonesian guy, the French guy or the German guy now? He kept the German one quite honest and he's highly regarded and a future Merc driver, i'm sure if he made the step up the the factory Merc he'd stick it in 2nd place pretty routinely was sort of my point i was making, so for his team mates to be close to him or beating him is a good performance.
rubystone said:
tommunster10 said:
Whatever, don't really follow the drivers that closely I just follow the sport.
He kept the German one quite honest and he's highly regarded and a future Merc driver, i'm sure if he made the step up the the factory Merc he'd stick it in 2nd place pretty routinely was sort of my point i was making, so for his team mates to be close to him or beating him is a good performance.
I'm confused. Are we talking about the Thai guy, the Indonesian guy, the French guy or the German guy now? He kept the German one quite honest and he's highly regarded and a future Merc driver, i'm sure if he made the step up the the factory Merc he'd stick it in 2nd place pretty routinely was sort of my point i was making, so for his team mates to be close to him or beating him is a good performance.
Sorry my bad for not knowing all the names of the Manor drivers, but point still stands.
tommunster10 said:
Pascal Wehrlein is the German guy who if he stepped up to Merc factory team would stick it in 2nd on the grid in Qualy so anyone next to him at Manor getting close to him is doing OK.
Sorry my bad for not knowing all the names of the Manor drivers, but point still stands.
Surely even Palmer would stick a Merc on the front row, given the level of their dominance?Sorry my bad for not knowing all the names of the Manor drivers, but point still stands.
Trabi601 said:
Surely even Palmer would stick a Merc on the front row, given the level of their dominance?
Any driver on the grid would, as well as most on the GP2 grid. Once they'd mastered all the systems. As long as neither Mercedes factory driver was in the mix. This is why one can really only measure one's performance against one's team-mate.rubystone said:
Trabi601 said:
Surely even Palmer would stick a Merc on the front row, given the level of their dominance?
Any driver on the grid would, as well as most on the GP2 grid. Once they'd mastered all the systems. As long as neither Mercedes factory driver was in the mix. This is why one can really only measure one's performance against one's team-mate.All 2nd in the Merc means is you lost to your team mate it doesn't mean you beat the drivers behind you on any merit other than being in the Class A car to their Class B cars.
I agree any of the drivers in F1 could get at least 2nd in that Merc.
rubystone said:
Trabi601 said:
Surely even Palmer would stick a Merc on the front row, given the level of their dominance?
Any driver on the grid would, as well as most on the GP2 grid. Once they'd mastered all the systems. As long as neither Mercedes factory driver was in the mix. This is why one can really only measure one's performance against one's team-mate.NM62 said:
rubystone said:
Trabi601 said:
Surely even Palmer would stick a Merc on the front row, given the level of their dominance?
Any driver on the grid would, as well as most on the GP2 grid. Once they'd mastered all the systems. As long as neither Mercedes factory driver was in the mix. This is why one can really only measure one's performance against one's team-mate.Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff