McLaren - Ron Dennis set to leave McLaren F1
Discussion
PeetBee said:
Sounds like the clear out continues with Jost Capito being shown the door now
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38891645
Makes you wonder who will be next
Apparently they couldn't find common ground on how to move forward and be successful!! This guy built a team that won everything for 4 years, if you can't find common ground with him the chances are you are in the wrong!!http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38891645
Makes you wonder who will be next
Indeed i think they have let a talented guy go. You can see Ron's thinking of hiring who he did, one guy to look after the commercial side, one the run the team with Bouiller as his right hand man.
The structure was in place given time to maybe get the team going in the right direction.
Shareholders seem to have gone for the lets get some sponsors quick and then use that cash to improve things approach. Might work well!
The structure was in place given time to maybe get the team going in the right direction.
Shareholders seem to have gone for the lets get some sponsors quick and then use that cash to improve things approach. Might work well!
revrange said:
Indeed i think they have let a talented guy go. You can see Ron's thinking of hiring who he did, one guy to look after the commercial side, one the run the team with Bouiller as his right hand man.
The structure was in place given time to maybe get the team going in the right direction.
Shareholders seem to have gone for the lets get some sponsors quick and then use that cash to improve things approach. Might work well!
You still need the right people in charge to improve those things though.The structure was in place given time to maybe get the team going in the right direction.
Shareholders seem to have gone for the lets get some sponsors quick and then use that cash to improve things approach. Might work well!
The current game of whack-a-mole isn't exactly the message that will entice the small number of highest-calibre people you assume mclaren will deem fit for leadership roles away from whatever they're doing right now IMO.
mjb1 said:
The only thing I can see Mclaren winning this season is the most babies thrown out with the bath water. Is Boullier still there? Have to say that I don't rate him very highly.
On what?He's no PR guy, but talking to the TV people is approximately 0.1% of his job.
Nobody complained about him when Lotus (the genii version) were punching well above their weight, under him.
CraigyMc said:
mjb1 said:
The only thing I can see Mclaren winning this season is the most babies thrown out with the bath water. Is Boullier still there? Have to say that I don't rate him very highly.
On what?He's no PR guy, but talking to the TV people is approximately 0.1% of his job.
Nobody complained about him when Lotus (the genii version) were punching well above their weight, under him.
markcoznottz said:
CraigyMc said:
mjb1 said:
The only thing I can see Mclaren winning this season is the most babies thrown out with the bath water. Is Boullier still there? Have to say that I don't rate him very highly.
On what?He's no PR guy, but talking to the TV people is approximately 0.1% of his job.
Nobody complained about him when Lotus (the genii version) were punching well above their weight, under him.
Ekrem Sami has also now left, seems to be a complete sweep out of any senior leaders who were part of Ron's team.
http://www.mclaren.com/technologygroup/news/articl...
If I was Jonathan Neale I would be very nervous right now!!
http://www.mclaren.com/technologygroup/news/articl...
If I was Jonathan Neale I would be very nervous right now!!
CraigyMc said:
Schermerhorn said:
I really admire the way Ron built up that team - the road car side, commercially, engineering side, everything really. Without Ron, is Mclaren 'Mclaren'?
Without Ron, F1 would not be what it is today.Ron just took BE's ideas about neatness and tidy and amped it up to 1 million.
With Bernie, Ron wouldn't be worth over £100M
Bruce McLaren IS McLaren
Ron modified McLaren to his image and they were stunningly successful until the mid late 00's(I like that RD don't change the name either!)
Let hope the next guys can take the team back to nearer the front.
Rich_W said:
CraigyMc said:
Schermerhorn said:
I really admire the way Ron built up that team - the road car side, commercially, engineering side, everything really. Without Ron, is Mclaren 'Mclaren'?
Without Ron, F1 would not be what it is today.Ron just took BE's ideas about neatness and tidy and amped it up to 1 million.
With Bernie, Ron wouldn't be worth over £100M
Bruce McLaren IS McLaren
Ron modified McLaren to his image and they were stunningly successful until the mid late 00's(I like that RD don't change the name either!)
Let hope the next guys can take the team back to nearer the front.
Ron was successful before he was in F1 as a team owner, already wealthy with his F2 business and other racing interests.
Nobody can say what he'd be worth without Bernie's impact on all of F1 and the fortunes of all the team owners.
Poorer, probably.
Bernie got into F1 as an owner with Brabham about 1971. That's around the same time Ron left Brabham (where he was a mechanic under Ron Taunerac) and got the Rondel racing F1 team going.
Ron wasn't just obsessive about neatness.
It was under him that McLaren did the first F1 composite car (John Barnard) - which was also the first McLaren car under Ron.
That was 1981, before Bernie started making the TV-money machine spew dosh all over the place.
Ron's team (the Dennis-era McLaren as opposed to the prior Bruce McLaren-era to 1970 or Teddy Mayer-era) took professionalism in the sport to a higher level than had been seen before.
The only leap forward remotely comparable in were the 30's German Grand Prix teams, in terms of detail, engineering etc. McLaren set the benchmark, and now it's impossible to run a team without having that type of detail-obsessive focus.
I'm not denigrating Bernie, he did a lot for the sport. So did Ron.
CraigyMc said:
I dunno what I said to annoy you.
Ron was successful before he was in F1 as a team owner, already wealthy with his F2 business and other racing interests.
Nobody can say what he'd be worth without Bernie's impact on all of F1 and the fortunes of all the team owners.
Poorer, probably.
Bernie got into F1 as an owner with Brabham about 1971. That's around the same time Ron left Brabham (where he was a mechanic under Ron Taunerac) and got the Rondel racing F1 team going.
Ron wasn't just obsessive about neatness.
It was under him that McLaren did the first F1 composite car (John Barnard) - which was also the first McLaren car under Ron.
That was 1981, before Bernie started making the TV-money machine spew dosh all over the place.
Ron's team (the Dennis-era McLaren as opposed to the prior Bruce McLaren-era to 1970 or Teddy Mayer-era) took professionalism in the sport to a higher level than had been seen before.
The only leap forward remotely comparable in were the 30's German Grand Prix teams, in terms of detail, engineering etc. McLaren set the benchmark, and now it's impossible to run a team without having that type of detail-obsessive focus.
I'm not denigrating Bernie, he did a lot for the sport. So did Ron.
100% correct. Ron was successful before he was in F1 as a team owner, already wealthy with his F2 business and other racing interests.
Nobody can say what he'd be worth without Bernie's impact on all of F1 and the fortunes of all the team owners.
Poorer, probably.
Bernie got into F1 as an owner with Brabham about 1971. That's around the same time Ron left Brabham (where he was a mechanic under Ron Taunerac) and got the Rondel racing F1 team going.
Ron wasn't just obsessive about neatness.
It was under him that McLaren did the first F1 composite car (John Barnard) - which was also the first McLaren car under Ron.
That was 1981, before Bernie started making the TV-money machine spew dosh all over the place.
Ron's team (the Dennis-era McLaren as opposed to the prior Bruce McLaren-era to 1970 or Teddy Mayer-era) took professionalism in the sport to a higher level than had been seen before.
The only leap forward remotely comparable in were the 30's German Grand Prix teams, in terms of detail, engineering etc. McLaren set the benchmark, and now it's impossible to run a team without having that type of detail-obsessive focus.
I'm not denigrating Bernie, he did a lot for the sport. So did Ron.
CraigyMc said:
I dunno what I said to annoy you.
Ron was successful before he was in F1 as a team owner, already wealthy with his F2 business and other racing interests.
Nobody can say what he'd be worth without Bernie's impact on all of F1 and the fortunes of all the team owners.
Poorer, probably.
Bernie got into F1 as an owner with Brabham about 1971. That's around the same time Ron left Brabham (where he was a mechanic under Ron Taunerac) and got the Rondel racing F1 team going.
Ron wasn't just obsessive about neatness.
It was under him that McLaren did the first F1 composite car (John Barnard) - which was also the first McLaren car under Ron.
That was 1981, before Bernie started making the TV-money machine spew dosh all over the place.
Ron's team (the Dennis-era McLaren as opposed to the prior Bruce McLaren-era to 1970 or Teddy Mayer-era) took professionalism in the sport to a higher level than had been seen before.
The only leap forward remotely comparable in were the 30's German Grand Prix teams, in terms of detail, engineering etc. McLaren set the benchmark, and now it's impossible to run a team without having that type of detail-obsessive focus.
I'm not denigrating Bernie, he did a lot for the sport. So did Ron.
The tag line for McLaren was 'The Business of Winning'. It was apparent that, nerdish enthusiasm for the sport aside, Dennis was in it for money, probably as much as Williams.Ron was successful before he was in F1 as a team owner, already wealthy with his F2 business and other racing interests.
Nobody can say what he'd be worth without Bernie's impact on all of F1 and the fortunes of all the team owners.
Poorer, probably.
Bernie got into F1 as an owner with Brabham about 1971. That's around the same time Ron left Brabham (where he was a mechanic under Ron Taunerac) and got the Rondel racing F1 team going.
Ron wasn't just obsessive about neatness.
It was under him that McLaren did the first F1 composite car (John Barnard) - which was also the first McLaren car under Ron.
That was 1981, before Bernie started making the TV-money machine spew dosh all over the place.
Ron's team (the Dennis-era McLaren as opposed to the prior Bruce McLaren-era to 1970 or Teddy Mayer-era) took professionalism in the sport to a higher level than had been seen before.
The only leap forward remotely comparable in were the 30's German Grand Prix teams, in terms of detail, engineering etc. McLaren set the benchmark, and now it's impossible to run a team without having that type of detail-obsessive focus.
I'm not denigrating Bernie, he did a lot for the sport. So did Ron.
The teams make the sport. Without a product, Ecclestone would have nothing to work with. He didn't build it, he took it over.
What made F1 was TV coverage. It is a stretch of the imagination to suggest that Ecclestone made the sport by his methods of TV coverage. F1 has moved forward with TV coverage in the same way other sport has. Football, rugby, Olympics, even golf are as sophisticated in their coverage.
We'll never know if F1 would have been as quick to take up marketing itself as quickly without him. Or faster of course.
Dennis and Williams brought professionalism to the sport. So did Ecclestone in his time at Brabaham. Indeed, his cars were always presented immaculately. The BT54 is one of my favourite F1 cars. Whilst Ecclestone concentrated on the money, for Dennis and Williams, the sport was just as important as the money. It was these two who dragged Ferrari into competitiveness.
One thing we can say, though, is that there's little evidence of progression with Ecclestone. He turned his back on innovation, for instance social media. I'm certain we'll see how F1 should be presented in the near future.
In recent years we have seen the number of teams to dangerous levels. The fault for this lies with the organisers. It's a problem that has it roots going back to the 90s. There is no feeder series that prepares team managers for F1 and that seemed to be deliberate policy of the two in charge. Other motor sports were hit as well, slaughtered on the alter of the one that gave the money.
I'm not sure how Dennis would have reacted to the new owners. We'll never know. But one thing is certain; he has done much more for the sport of F1 than Ecclestone has.
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