Liberty changes relationships and possibly the CEO
Discussion
HardtopManual said:
Pachydermus said:
What I want to see and hear is fast and loud.
I love the sound of a V12 as much as anyone and love the to hear the historics when they're at F1 meets, but if all you want is noise and speed, drag racing will satisfy you more than F1 ever will, no matter what the engine spec is.KevinCamaroSS said:
The reason we have DRS, high deg tyres and enforced pit stops in F1 is that overtakes at the pointy end had become so rare (and always have been, really). The faster cars qualify further up the grid. Everything is simulated and analysed to the nth degree before the lights have even gone out. Reliability is orders of magnitude better than it used to be. No wonder "proper" overtakes for the lead (which is what people really mean when they say they want more overtaking) are rare.
going back to simpler cars might help. Flappy paddles and steering wheels that could run a space mission offer nothing for the spectator or the spectacle*- might upset the anoraks who like to compare diff settings though
Pachydermus said:
going back to simpler cars might help. Flappy paddles and steering wheels that could run a space mission offer nothing for the spectator or the spectacle*
What you seek is available and is called GP2. They do have some buttons on their steering wheels though (even my daily s- might upset the anoraks who like to compare diff settings though
tbox has flappy paddles), which I understand may upset those who wear rose tinted glasses.Going back to the original topic, interesting that the news is being reported as Ecclestone being "removed". Oh to have been a fly on the wall.
From Benson, "Ross Brawn has been appointed to lead the sporting and technical side." - I shall reserve judgement until we actually know what his remit is.
Derek Smith said:
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ecclestone-confi...
Brawn as sporting director? What does he know about being sporting?
Let's hope it is not too late.
Brawn as sporting director? What does he know about being sporting?
Let's hope it is not too late.
bernie said:
I still have many friends in Formula 1, and I still have enough money to afford to attend a race.
One of the very few then Bernie huh?rdjohn said:
suffolk009 said:
I'd be a lot happier paying my Sky fees if there was some proper technical analysis, rather than the usual driver centric tosh that Croft spills out. They have Mark Hughes there in the commentary box - why not use him more?
I think you will find that Mark Hughes is just yet another journalistt. Like Ted Kravitz, neither have an engineering qualification, let alone one based in motor racing.Garry Anderson was the nearest we ever got to an engineer with credentials. I think that either Mike Gascogne or Pat Symonds would be good at explaining the tech basics to the average enthusiast.
I'd rather hoped that that fella, Rob Smedley, Massa's engineer/baby-sitter would have moved over to commentary.
Petrolhe4d said:
Ok so I tend to agree Bernie probably had to go (wish it was before he sold out to sky)but I have to take my hat off and thank him for turning what was a race series fraught with danger for very little financial reward into the juggernaut it is now.
I'm not sure Ecclestone had much to do with improving safety.Safety measures were introduced over a period from the 70s, and not pushed by the organisers in the first instance. We owe much of the improvements recently to the threat of legal action.
Jackie Stewart, the multiple WDC derided by Mosely, started the improvements in safety that drivers, other staff, volunteers and spectators enjoy today way back in the middle 60s. There was a singular reluctance on behalf of the both the organisers and the media to do anything.
Whether F1 is the better now than it was when Ecclestone started to gain his power in the late 70s is open to argument. However, I think there's little for any suggestion that Ecclestone made the sport safer.
[quote=Derek Smith]
I'm not sure Ecclestone had much to do with improving safety.
quote]
Agreed that Jackie Stewart was campaigning for safety (at a time where he was told to leave the sport if he thought it was too dangerous) but Bernie did support safety improvements in terms of deferring to Sid Watkins to improve the medical facilities at the tracks, including threatening to cancel a GP if Sid didn't get his way.
Max Mosley did more to improve the safety of the cars though.
But we digress, it will be interesting to see what Liberty will do now that Bernie is 'out of the way'. Improving the distribution of the money would be a step in the right direction, but it's had to see how all the deals could be unpicked before 2020
I'm not sure Ecclestone had much to do with improving safety.
quote]
Agreed that Jackie Stewart was campaigning for safety (at a time where he was told to leave the sport if he thought it was too dangerous) but Bernie did support safety improvements in terms of deferring to Sid Watkins to improve the medical facilities at the tracks, including threatening to cancel a GP if Sid didn't get his way.
Max Mosley did more to improve the safety of the cars though.
But we digress, it will be interesting to see what Liberty will do now that Bernie is 'out of the way'. Improving the distribution of the money would be a step in the right direction, but it's had to see how all the deals could be unpicked before 2020
Enjoy your retirement, Bernie. You stayed at least a decade too long.
F1's new owners have a lot of work to do :
They need to change the technical and sporting regulations to allow the drivers to actually race one another. If they can do that, the 'show' will take care of itself.
They need to secure the futures of the historic 'core' European races plus Suzuka, Singapore, Brazil Canada and the USA.
They need to put in place a financial model which allows independent teams to both stay in business and compete with the big boys.
They need to start taking online and social media seriously, to engage new generations of fans. One of F1's biggest problems is that its core fan base is old, nerdy, male and obsessed with the past rather than the future.
F1's new owners have a lot of work to do :
They need to change the technical and sporting regulations to allow the drivers to actually race one another. If they can do that, the 'show' will take care of itself.
They need to secure the futures of the historic 'core' European races plus Suzuka, Singapore, Brazil Canada and the USA.
They need to put in place a financial model which allows independent teams to both stay in business and compete with the big boys.
They need to start taking online and social media seriously, to engage new generations of fans. One of F1's biggest problems is that its core fan base is old, nerdy, male and obsessed with the past rather than the future.
Bradgate said:
They need to start taking online and social media seriously, to engage new generations of fans. One of F1's biggest problems is that its core fan base is old, nerdy, male and obsessed with the past rather than the future.
Agree with most of what you say but I must disagree with the last comment. I've been attending F1 races for over 25 years and the amount of females at races is probably at 30% which I think is the effect of younger pretty racers. F1 has never been very good at engaging the fans unlike MoroGP, I think this was a "give a little and the fans will want more" tactic which has back fired. Lewis is much melined for his behaviour but he is doing the job of getting the younger generation involved on his own.
The new owners need to put Ferrari in their place and treat all teams the same with an added payments to a teams for the first three years or if they achieve a certain position in the table this is reduced. Perhaps they could look at how American Football is run as this is a sport where teams do not dominate for years at a time.
Presumably regardless of what they are hoping to do, existing contracts etc will seriously limit them for some time.
TV rights are quite lengthy in many territories, so the social media side will probably be limited until they can renegotiate or see out the existing contracts.
Likewise for redistribution of funds within the sport, not an overnight process but badly needed asap.
They can, hopefully, put something in place soon to sort out the farce with circuit fees. If they want to expand the calendar having several races struggling to make ends meet isn't going help.
TV rights are quite lengthy in many territories, so the social media side will probably be limited until they can renegotiate or see out the existing contracts.
Likewise for redistribution of funds within the sport, not an overnight process but badly needed asap.
They can, hopefully, put something in place soon to sort out the farce with circuit fees. If they want to expand the calendar having several races struggling to make ends meet isn't going help.
This might sound a bit superficial, but I think one of the big reasons why F1 isn't as big a draw these days are the cars are so damn ugly. All the aero addenda, weird nosecones and odd proportions. While it's difficult to create a regulation which encourages beautiful racecars, surely it should be possible to remove the need for designers to make them so ugly? Like set a maximum level of downforce the car is allowed to generate across the speed range (ideally way less than at present), so that there is no incentive for designers to try to find creative (and generally pug ugly) ways of generating more.
The lower popularity of F1 must be related to the fact that something like 50% of people under 30 now don't/can't drive.
Increasingly, driving is irrelevant to the majority of the population, and those that do, do so with a cloud of guilt and a threat of fines over their heads. It used to be that you got a car and it was a ticket to freedom, driving where (and how) you liked. F1 was full of the heroes that were more than just sportsmen, they were role models and celebrities. These days, driving is a chore and for most of the people in big cities, best avoided.
Instead of being actively involved with your car, fixing it and tweaking it by getting parts from Halfords, now it's a white box with an engine hidden under an impenetrable plastic cover. So all the details and the involvement in F1 is theoretical. They might as well be flying space ships.
F1 isn't accessible, it's hardly relate-able and with a year long season effectively pitting the same small handful of people against each other, it develops at a glacial pace. There's no reason for it to have any more attraction than horse racing without the betting.
Increasingly, driving is irrelevant to the majority of the population, and those that do, do so with a cloud of guilt and a threat of fines over their heads. It used to be that you got a car and it was a ticket to freedom, driving where (and how) you liked. F1 was full of the heroes that were more than just sportsmen, they were role models and celebrities. These days, driving is a chore and for most of the people in big cities, best avoided.
Instead of being actively involved with your car, fixing it and tweaking it by getting parts from Halfords, now it's a white box with an engine hidden under an impenetrable plastic cover. So all the details and the involvement in F1 is theoretical. They might as well be flying space ships.
F1 isn't accessible, it's hardly relate-able and with a year long season effectively pitting the same small handful of people against each other, it develops at a glacial pace. There's no reason for it to have any more attraction than horse racing without the betting.
Bradgate said:
They need to start taking online and social media seriously, to engage new generations of fans. One of F1's biggest problems is that its core fan base is old, nerdy, male and obsessed with the past rather than the future.
I'm not obsesses with the past. I enjoy the history of F1, motorsport in general in fact, but I think my posting history will show that it is the future, and the long term health of the sport, that I concentrate on, hence my resentment of Ecclestone's influence.I'll have old, nerdy and male though.
But you are right that the sport needs to grab the young, especially in Europe. Much as I have enjoyed F1 throughout the years I've been following it and do not look forward to Americanisation, or do I mean Americanization, of the way the sport is run, I might, begrudgingly, admit that it could be just the thing to get youngsters to take an interest.
F1 has been under threat before, and often collapse has seemed imminent. F1 as we know it now might not survive 2020.
Bradgate said:
Enjoy your retirement, Bernie. You stayed at least a decade too long.
F1's new owners have a lot of work to do :
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They need to put in place a financial model which allows independent teams to both stay in business and compete with the big boys.
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BBC is reporting Chase Carey as saying ""We'd like owning a team to be good business, running a track to be good business".F1's new owners have a lot of work to do :
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They need to put in place a financial model which allows independent teams to both stay in business and compete with the big boys.
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That's a good start. Without those two you don't have much of a business.
Sit back and watch as the whole F1 show becomes America centric over the next decade. Corey was talking about F1 in terms of the Super Bowl event earlier today and I feel I can confidently predict the USA will have more than 1 F1 race each year very shortly, possibly even as many as 3 as Liberty go big for the US market.
This could truly turn into a case of 'the devil you don't know'.
This could truly turn into a case of 'the devil you don't know'.
gadgetmac said:
Sit back and watch as the whole F1 show becomes America centric over the next decade. Corey was talking about F1 in terms of the Super Bowl event earlier today and I feel I can confidently predict the USA will have more than 1 F1 race each year very shortly, possibly even as many as 3 as Liberty go big for the US market.
This could truly turn into a case of 'the devil you don't know'.
I don't mind USA having three if it gets rid of some of the crap ones we have now.This could truly turn into a case of 'the devil you don't know'.
I've always thought that what F1 needs is to shift the balance from aero grip to mechanical grip, so that drivers have to slow down more for corners and work bloody hard to get round them. If it were me I would ban wings (and winglets) completely, and force teams to make the body of the car do all the work. Add some decent tyres so that drivers can wring the car's neck, and make them thinner so that a driver cannot effectively block the whole track. Remove all the DRS and Kers and all that artificial crap.
Then really promote the races. Nascar is an all day party. F1 should be similar.
Then really promote the races. Nascar is an all day party. F1 should be similar.
jbudgie said:
gadgetmac said:
Sit back and watch as the whole F1 show becomes America centric over the next decade. Corey was talking about F1 in terms of the Super Bowl event earlier today and I feel I can confidently predict the USA will have more than 1 F1 race each year very shortly, possibly even as many as 3 as Liberty go big for the US market.
This could truly turn into a case of 'the devil you don't know'.
I don't mind USA having three if it gets rid of some of the crap ones we have now.This could truly turn into a case of 'the devil you don't know'.
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