RE: You Know You Want To... Citroen SM
Discussion
cookie1600 said:
As if this wasn't enough to mess with your wallet, mind and your fantasy garage, how about one of the development models that used a Maser V8?
The production V6 is basically a V8 with two cylinders removed, isn't it? The angle isn't quite right for a V6, is it...90 degrees instead of 60?Urquattro: I don't think it was ever offered with a 1.8 was it?
Octane had a really nice write up of these a few months back. Really nice pictures.
ETA: http://www.classicandperformancecar.com/features/o...
any more brochure scans would be appreciated, I would buy one for my small collection but not at £50!
Edited by varsas on Tuesday 24th May 14:19
varsas said:
The production V6 is basically a V8 with two cylinders removed, isn't it? The angle isn't quite right for a V6, is it...90 degrees instead of 60?
Wiki says:The SM was sold with a small, lightweight engine in various forms, designed from scratch by Giulio Alfieri but capable of being assembled on existing V8 tooling. Because of this, the engine sported an unusual 90° angle between cylinder banks — a trait shared with the later PRV V6. It was a very compact and innovative design that allowed the use of just one pattern for the cylinder heads and an intermediate shaft extended out to drive the auxiliaries.
The engines - always mounted behind the front axle were:
2.7 L V6 with Weber 42 DCNF carburettors, "C114-1" (170 bhp) (1970–1972)
2.7 L V6 with Bosch D-Jetronic injection, "C114-03" (178 bhp) (1973-1976 - Not available in the U.S.)
3.0 L V6 with Weber 42 DCNF carburetors, "C114-11" (180 bhp) (1971-1975 - U.S. only in1971, rest of the world, automatic only in 1974 & 1975)
The size of the 2.7 L engine was limited by French puissance fiscale taxation, which effectively banned large displacement vehicles. The engine was also used in the Maserati Merak from 1973 to 1982 (later versions for the Merak SS had much larger valves and a reputed 220BHP) and the Ligier JS2 sports car. The final SMs were produced in the Ligier factory in Vichy.
Interestingly, Wiki also reveals the SM was way ahead of its time:
The SM combines many unusual and innovative features, some of which are only just becoming commonplace on cars of today. It borrows heavily from the innovations introduced on the DS, by including hydro-pneumatic (oleopneumatic) self-leveling suspension, and self-leveling lights that swiveled with the steering (except in the USA where these were illegal at the time).
The steering is self-centering and fully powered (as opposed to hydraulically assisted). This feature allows the front wheels to run near-zero caster, and means that there is no camber change as lock is applied, and also ensures that the maximum amount of tyre area is in contact with the road at all times. The system also adjusts the hydraulic pressure on the steering centering cam according to vehicle speed so that the amount of steering feel remained almost constant at any speed, counteracting the tendency of manual and ordinary power assisted steering to feel light at high speed. Thus the car turns easily at low speed, emphasized by high gearing given two turns lock-lock, and relatively more effort is required at higher speed. Many contemporary reviewers remarked that this system would take at least 50 mi (80 km) of driving to become familiar, but once the driver is accustomed to the system traditional steering feels old-fashioned.
The wiper mechanism is 'sensitive' to rain, by measuring the current needed to drive the wiper motor, while the steering column is adjustable in both height and reach.
The braking system, adapted from the DS, employs disk brakes at all four corners (the DS has drums at the rear), with the front brakes being inboard, and cooled via large ducts on the front underside of the car. The hydraulic braking pressure front to rear balance is self-adjusting according to the weight in the rear of the car.
Standard wheels are steel with stainless trims, but a factory option was available for lightweight wheels made of composites. These wheels weigh less than half the standard weight and are possibly a unique application of composites on a production vehicle.
I can't beieve anyone could compare this to an ugly tank like the XJS and think it looks clumsy but eye of the beholder and all that.
I am also of the view that the SM represents one of the pinnacles of motoring design though the back bumper and lights were always the weak point (as they were on the DS) and the rear of the CX was arguably prettier. I saw one of these on the road around 1974 and it was like a spaceship had just wafted into view.
I have the original brochure too and it was to die for. It always had the V6 though and of course the Maserati Khamsin suffered with the Citroen hydraulics and steering in the motoring press and I think was just too complicated for the market. I'm not sure but I think the Merak and Bora were simpler though always recall Motor testing the Bora and calling the speedo the biggest liar they had encountered.
I am also of the view that the SM represents one of the pinnacles of motoring design though the back bumper and lights were always the weak point (as they were on the DS) and the rear of the CX was arguably prettier. I saw one of these on the road around 1974 and it was like a spaceship had just wafted into view.
I have the original brochure too and it was to die for. It always had the V6 though and of course the Maserati Khamsin suffered with the Citroen hydraulics and steering in the motoring press and I think was just too complicated for the market. I'm not sure but I think the Merak and Bora were simpler though always recall Motor testing the Bora and calling the speedo the biggest liar they had encountered.
red_rover said:
The SM is the BX development hack if you ask me.
The BX had a considerable additional set of interesting technologies not seen in the SM.There's not really anything in the SM that hadn't been proven in the DS.
...if only William Lyons hadn't p
ssed on Rover and Triumph's chips.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_C3E5iSvewpA/Tdk...
An epic car, but then I would say that, this one is mine.
An epic car, but then I would say that, this one is mine.
SManiac said:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_C3E5iSvewpA/Tdk...
An epic car, but then I would say that, this one is mine.
Brilliant first post. Yes, sir you have style! An epic car, but then I would say that, this one is mine.
SManiac said:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_C3E5iSvewpA/Tdk...
An epic car, but then I would say that, this one is mine.
I call BS - need to see more photos of that, you know, just to be sure An epic car, but then I would say that, this one is mine.
vixen1700 said:
LuS1fer said:
I can't beieve anyone could compare this to an ugly tank like the XJS and think it looks clumsy but eye of the beholder and all that.
Ugly tank?
But as I say, eye of the beholder and all that. I also think the 928 is a bloater.
Fabuleux.
It's not about the deestination; it's how you arrive. The Casino in Monte Carlo is heaving with top-level supercars. Turn up in this and you're far cooler than any of them.
And how could you not love a car that has the service history comment "...replace secondary primary chains, upgrade oil pump quill shaft..."
Secondary primary chains. I don't even know what a primary chain is.
It's not about the deestination; it's how you arrive. The Casino in Monte Carlo is heaving with top-level supercars. Turn up in this and you're far cooler than any of them.
And how could you not love a car that has the service history comment "...replace secondary primary chains, upgrade oil pump quill shaft..."
Secondary primary chains. I don't even know what a primary chain is.
LuS1fer said:
Single most disappointing design ever penned in my view. I was 16 when it was launched and there was plenty of "bigging it up" weeks in advance "New Jag to replace E-Type" and there it was, on the cover of "Motor", a horrendous aberration. never liked it, never will.
The shape really grew on me, and when I owned one and saw the shape from the front room window, it grew on me even more. Really want another one.
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