RE: BMW M3 CRT: Munich's Lightweight Saloon

[S3000]

way too overpriced... Z06 or ZR-1 for that price is the real deal.. or GTR.

[MattDell]

JumpinJack said:

Why would they do it on the saloon body? Shirely... if you want to use it for track days etc. you're not going to want to put the kids/your mates in the back?
Or would tha be too much like the GTS?

I absolutely love the fact it's a sedan/saloon!

I cannot stand the look of the current 3 series in coupe body. In fact, any sedan with coupe doors just doesn't look right to me (see also Audi A5, 6 series). Basically, if your car has a back seat, it should probably have four doors (some hatchbacks excluded). I also find it annoying opening one of the doors on a car like this and it flying out into the distance several feet.

-Matt

[ikky85]

RudeDog said:

Who said the Germans havn't got sense of humor?

[Munich]

Mermaid said:

marcosgt said:

Is there some homologation rule for the DTM?

Could the reason it's 4 door be because it's solely built to get some parts legalised for the DTM racer?

M.

Probably
Can't see the commercial sense in selling just 65 cars, no matter how inflated the price. Who do BMW think they are - Porsche?

I'm not so sure. Have there been any special Audi A4s or MB C-Class' built due to their involvement in the DTM?

[ikky85]

kambites said:

So they've made a 1.6 tonne car a whole 50kg lighter?

and assuming you need the extra seats for mates etc which would negate the -50 kg advantage.

Easy this engineering lark...

[Munich]

Zod said:

Beardy10 said:

Sure in China and the Middle East. Doesn't mean they aren't the wrong price.....

They sell in the US and Europe. All the M3 GTSs sold and quickly too.

They are not selling the GTS in the US. To much effect and expense to homologate it. Apparently it has annoyed a good number of customers because they also didn't get the any of the special E30 M3s or the E46 CSL.

[Zwoelf]

Munich said:

They are not selling the GTS in the US. To much effect and expense to homologate it. Apparently it has annoyed a good number of customers because they also didn't get the any of the special E30 M3s or the E46 CSL.

At least they got a 240bhp, automatic E36 M3! We never did - where's the justice eh?

They also got the option of a manual E60 M5. Swings and roundabouts really.

[Mermaid]

Zwoelf said:

They also got the option of a manual E60 M5. Swings and roundabouts really.

Never did understand why they got stick shift.

[Zwoelf]

Mermaid said:

Zwoelf said:

They also got the option of a manual E60 M5. Swings and roundabouts really.

Never did understand why they got stick shift.

I don't know, but if the same trend as E39 was followed, the US market counted for as many M5 sales as all European market cars added together, so when they moaned about the lack of a manual E60, they got one. Which failed to receive glowing reports IIRC, somewhat vindicating BMW M's decision not to engineer one from the outset. The S85 was only ever conceived to be appended to the seven speed SMG transmission from the outset, rather than hastily cobbled to an adapted E39 manual transmission with ratios optimised for the S62 engine that delivered its power in a markedly different style.

[LHD]

Zwoelf said:

Mermaid said:

Zwoelf said:

They also got the option of a manual E60 M5. Swings and roundabouts really.

Never did understand why they got stick shift.

I don't know, but if the same trend as E39 was followed, the US market counted for as many M5 sales as all European market cars added together, so when they moaned about the lack of a manual E60, they got one. Which failed to receive glowing reports IIRC, somewhat vindicating BMW M's decision not to engineer one from the outset. The S85 was only ever conceived to be appended to the seven speed SMG transmission from the outset, rather than hastily cobbled to an adapted E39 manual transmission with ratios optimised for the S62 engine that delivered its power in a markedly different style.

It was, by all concerned, st.

But offer a manual box in the market no fker will buy it. Then you only have to build 3-4 press cars.

Very shrewd.

[Munich]

LHD said:

It was, by all concerned, st.

But offer a manual box in the market no fker will buy it. Then you only have to build 3-4 press cars.

Very shrewd.

I also heard that the manual gearbox was st. However, although we have the impression that customers in the US only like to drive cars with 2 peddles, for BMW it seems really important to offer a "stick shift". It is a image thing - there is quite a large group of hardcore M drivers that feel Manual Transmission is the only way to go. If you don't offer a MT then you are not a sports car brand.

On the BMW USA website, you can see that for the F10 and E90, AT is offered as a no-cost option. I assume that the base price of the car already includes the cost of the AT, meaning that a US MT customer wants a MT so badly they are prepared to pay the AT surcharge without opting for it.... That is dedication!

[Zod]

The manual box was, I think, the same box as used in the E39 and E46, so not st. The drivers probably were though.

[kainedog]

well if i had a 115k to spend on an m3 id rather have this....and prob 50k change
V10 CSL

Edited by kainedog on Sunday 26th June 13:16

[bobberz]

yinujim said:

Johnboy Mac said:

Around €105k in Germany I understand plus options, another €10k?

£73K in the UK.

So this new M3 saloon is WAAAY more than the new, 550+bhp M5? So much for model hierarchy!

It may be more exclusive, but I think I'd feel like a bit of a knob if I paid that much for a 3 series, when I could've had an M5 for 40 grand less!

[Zwoelf]

bobberz said:

It may be more exclusive, but I think I'd feel like a bit of a knob if I paid that much for a 3 series, when I could've had an M5 for 40 grand less!

I wouldn't if a decade hence, the M5 will be worth around 10-15% of that £75k but this extremely low volume M3 will be worth around (very conservatively) 40% of that £115k...

[RAPID66]

There is definitely a market opportunity here: take a standard M3, change seats and exhaust for lighter ones, re-map, nice light wheels, and sell for £90k.
This seems to be the trend overall now (Porsche, BMW, Audi, Merc): special limited editions overpriced but selling like pancakes because of the new huge market created by the new wealth in the "emerging" economies. We should get used to it....

[anonymous-user]

We are on Pistonheads right?

If BMW can sell them then good luck to them, if you can afford to buy one then good luck to you.

I'm just happy that cars like this keep getting built in an ever increasing PC world.

[El Guapo]

1. Thou shall not kill
2. Thou shall not covet thy neighbour's wife
3. An M3 shall have no more than 2 doors

etc.

[Munich]

Zod said:

The manual box was, I think, the same box as used in the E39 and E46, so not st. The drivers probably were though.

I'm sure the MT itself wasn't st, but the issue was that it doesn't really fit to the car and engine. Personally, I feel the SMG wasn't very good either, but when you drive the car in the manner it was engineered (i.e. hard) everything seems to fit together and creates a great package. However, from what I have heard and read (because I haven't actually driven an E60 M5 with MT...) when driving hard in the MT car it doesn't gel in the same way.

[d9lon]

The new BMW M3 Carbon Racing Technology (CRT).
Please be advised that BMW AG have today announced the introduction of a new BMW M3. Please be aware that BMW UK will not be taking any allocation of the BMW M3 CRT. It is a very niche model which currently doesn’t fit within the current product line-up and positioning within the UK market. The UK has always focused on the M3 Coupé as the sportiest model, equipping it with a standard carbon fibre roof as testament to this. For this reason the M3 CRT will not be sold in the UK.