Nasty Ring accident today at Bergwerk

[LukeSi]

They would of been had someone taken out a worker after losing control due to poor placement of the sign.

[HON2A]

Accident itself at 9min50 on video below, I don't think this has been posted yet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXTXGY1sUeA&fea...

[fatboy18]

HON2A said:

Accident itself at 9min50 on video below, I don't think this has been posted yet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXTXGY1sUeA&fea...

yes it has

[Sloppy]

Sad to see such an easily avoidable accident occur at somewhere like the ring where you would have thought safety would have been paramount. Hard to pass proper judgement without being there but it's quite obvious that there was either insufficient warnings about the slow zone given or people were just slowing down last minute. Either scenario was a recipe for disaster.

[Tonsko]

Mentioned earlier about the Nurburgring being in financial trouble, as I'd thought I'd read something about it - and another person posted the same.

30 seconds with google seems to show that it, as a going concern is in deep st. As part of the on-going development, it seems that they were naive enough to get caught in a scam resembling the Nigerian 419s...in the a Swiss businessman promised shedloads of investment from Dubai and the US, except that he required money to acquire more investment. Sound familiar?

It seems that the whole project was very poorly conceived form the start, and ended up with very little from private investment and up to ¢330 million of taxpayer's money being wasted.

http://der-nordschleife.blogspot.com/2010/12/nurbu...

http://amadeusphotography.com/http://amadeusphotog...

While this clearly isn't news to anyone who knows anything about the 'ring, I guess sadly it means that they are trying to get as much cash in as possible as quickly as possible to stave off financial disaster, so TF days are unlikely to get less frequent, and marshalling may well be kept to a minimum leading to a repeat of this accident.

Edited by Tonsko on Thursday 6th October 14:20

[Fastra]

agtlaw said:

silver grey BMW e30. jump 1 minute into this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEygx_dzOoI

That is really quite epic!
Irresponsible, juvenile but truly epic!

[davemac250]

Tonsko said:

Mentioned earlier about the Nurburgring being in financial trouble, as I'd thought I'd read something about it - and another person posted the same.

30 seconds with google seems to show that it, as a going concern is in deep st. As part of the on-going development, it seems that they were naive enough to get caught in a scam resembling the Nigerian 419s...in the a Swiss businessman promised shedloads of investment from Dubai and the US, except that he required money to acquire more investment. Sound familiar?

It seems that the whole project was very poorly conceived form the start, and ended up with very little from private investment and up to ¢330 million of taxpayer's money being wasted.

http://der-nordschleife.blogspot.com/2010/12/nurbu...

http://amadeusphotography.com/http://amadeusphotog...

While this clearly isn't news to anyone who knows anything about the 'ring, I guess sadly it means that they are trying to get as much cash in as possible as quickly as possible to stave off financial disaster, so TF days are unlikely to get less frequent, and marshalling may well be kept to a minimum leading to a repeat of this accident.

Edited by Tonsko on Thursday 6th October 14:20

Go and have another look at historic calenders if any are listed.

TF are a lot less regular than when I moved over here 6 years ago.

Back then I would make the 45 min drive a couple of times a week in summer for an afternoon/evening session. This year they have been very limited in comparison and (importantly for me) shorter duration, mostly opening at 5pm whereas it used to be 3pm.

The 'ring makes far more from manufacturer test days/dedicated track days than TF.

Since the redevelopment there have been some high profile companies that have withdrawn from the 'ring on the basis of a massive hike in prices, and an expectation that the in-house accommodation would be used, again at stupid prices given what is available locally.

I agree that they are shafted on the cash front, but constant price hikes etc will not get them out of the brown smelly IMO.

[Rude-boy]

Fastra said:

agtlaw said:

silver grey BMW e30. jump 1 minute into this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEygx_dzOoI

That is really quite epic!
Irresponsible, juvenile but truly epic!

I really know that we shouldn't but that's what I call playing to the camera!

[Sir_Dave]

Rude-boy said:

I really know that we shouldn't but that's what I call playing to the camera!

Thats the car that filmed the pile up in the other thread iirc.

[Tonsko]

davemac250 said:

Go and have another look at historic calenders if any are listed.

TF are a lot less regular than when I moved over here 6 years ago.

Back then I would make the 45 min drive a couple of times a week in summer for an afternoon/evening session. This year they have been very limited in comparison and (importantly for me) shorter duration, mostly opening at 5pm whereas it used to be 3pm.

The 'ring makes far more from manufacturer test days/dedicated track days than TF.

Since the redevelopment there have been some high profile companies that have withdrawn from the 'ring on the basis of a massive hike in prices, and an expectation that the in-house accommodation would be used, again at stupid prices given what is available locally.

I agree that they are shafted on the cash front, but constant price hikes etc will not get them out of the brown smelly IMO.

Yeh, I'd seen from places that manufacturers price hikes were getting silly - I just assumed that because of everyone on here saying things were getting more dangerous, that the TF days were more common and more busy. What is the reason for it being 'not as good as it used to be on TF days' as stated by some old hands?

[DonkeyApple]

Sir_Dave said:

Rude-boy said:

I really know that we shouldn't but that's what I call playing to the camera!

Thats the car that filmed the pile up in the other thread iirc.

Looks like it. Plus, the white 3 series with black bonnet looks like the BMW that arrived at the back of the crash and avoided some carnage.

[Campbell]

Fastra said:

agtlaw said:

silver grey BMW e30. jump 1 minute into this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEygx_dzOoI

That is really quite epic!
Irresponsible, juvenile but truly epic!

Totaly biliant.... love it....
Slow speed High fun factor...

[C8PPO]

sim16v said:

There is too much doom and gloom about how busy the place is now.

This vid was taken 2 or 3 weeks earlier, around Sunday lunch time and look how quiet it was!


If you pick your days and times, you can still have fun out there.

I guess that the much-quoted problems *generally* tend to occur when you have a full weekend of TF. People with further to drive will want a weekend of it and not a couple of hours. The only times I've been there recently have been openings like this - and, wonderment, you can actually park in the car park, just like 10 years ago, rather than 1/4 miles down the road!

If you only have a short period over a weekend, eg evenings only, or a weekday, the attendance tends to be much lower, hence it becomes a nicer place to be and as an added bonus, there are far less "issues".

[davemac250]

Tonsko said:

Yeh, I'd seen from places that manufacturers price hikes were getting silly - I just assumed that because of everyone on here saying things were getting more dangerous, that the TF days were more common and more busy. What is the reason for it being 'not as good as it used to be on TF days' as stated by some old hands?

Simply put, it is more crowded.

The same - or more people want to go.

There is less opportunity.

Last time I went I waited 2 hours just to get in the car park. Nothing special about the day, although it was a weekend. There hadn't been a closure when I asked, it was just packed.

A few years back I would turn up, grab a coffee, pay and drive. (And they didn't measure the noise levels)

[DonkeyApple]

davemac250 said:

Tonsko said:

Yeh, I'd seen from places that manufacturers price hikes were getting silly - I just assumed that because of everyone on here saying things were getting more dangerous, that the TF days were more common and more busy. What is the reason for it being 'not as good as it used to be on TF days' as stated by some old hands?

Simply put, it is more crowded.

The same - or more people want to go.

There is less opportunity.

Last time I went I waited 2 hours just to get in the car park. Nothing special about the day, although it was a weekend. There hadn't been a closure when I asked, it was just packed.

A few years back I would turn up, grab a coffee, pay and drive. (And they didn't measure the noise levels)

A simple solution is to raise the ticket cost.

Find the right level to raise it to and you will reduce numbers while maintaining revenue.

I still think that education is the solution and that anyone wanting to take a car on the Ring should, at least 48hrs beforehand sit an online 'tutorial'. This would be done for anyone wanting to go on the Ring, whether they are driving the car or just a passenger. The 'tutorial' lasts 12 months and then has to be done again.

The arguement is that it would avoid nannying but ensure that everyone who goes onto the Ring is operating at a bare minimum level of understanding of all facets.

I think that may help greatly. I would certainly prefer to educate than to moderate.

[davemac250]

They do this and more.

It is unfortunately called 'The Driving Test'!

With added regulation the 'ring gets further and further from a road.

At the point it becomes a track those locals who hate it suddenly get more fuel for their fire?

Have seen the prices for a TF steadily rise, and certainly way faster than inflation!

Agreed you could price some of the users out of the equation, however in my experience the most dangerous vehicles there are those driven by people blessed with more money than sense. And I doubt this would stop that!

I still love going there and have a couple of trips planned, weather permitting, between now and winter (Although we have snow forecast for the end of this month). But lately i have enjoyed a trip to a normal track day more. If only for the greater protection from the R-sole brigade.

[LukeBird]

agtlaw said:

silver grey BMW e30. jump 1 minute into this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEygx_dzOoI

Hmmm... many reasons why TF days are becoming less and less interesting to me.

[Fastra]

Sir_Dave said:

Rude-boy said:

I really know that we shouldn't but that's what I call playing to the camera!

Thats the car that filmed the pile up in the other thread iirc.

Yep, that strut in the back window blocked most of the crucial bits.

[HereBeMonsters]

LukeBird said:

agtlaw said:

silver grey BMW e30. jump 1 minute into this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEygx_dzOoI

Hmmm... many reasons why TF days are becoming less and less interesting to me.

It's why I spend a lot of my time there watching, rather than participating.

[C8PPO]

davemac250 said:

Have seen the prices for a TF steadily rise, and certainly way faster than inflation!

I think it was €7 a lap when I first went - and that was for bikes, iirc cars were €1 cheaper as they were less likely to crash and damage, or close, the circuit!