Wafting: Do modern, comfortable superminis exist?
Discussion
I certainly don't do anything like waft in my Picanto but it's comfortable ENOUGH for me and I do quite a few miles - the new model is a definite improvement in quality so it might be worth a look (I haven't driven one) - and comes with plenty of options (my local dealer has a high spec one sitting outside the showroom, I balked at £10,490 for an ex demo however I think it was top of the range)
I had serious comfort problems with my previous Astra H, and this is definitely more comfortable than that. Done a couple of 300 mile motorway journeys in it without any back/neck pain which I get in certain cars (mostly Astras)
Note that I am not suggesting it'll be wafty in any way, shape or form before anyone flames me
I had serious comfort problems with my previous Astra H, and this is definitely more comfortable than that. Done a couple of 300 mile motorway journeys in it without any back/neck pain which I get in certain cars (mostly Astras)
Note that I am not suggesting it'll be wafty in any way, shape or form before anyone flames me
Volvo C30?
A little larger than a supermini (although possibly less so on the inside). But plenty of room in the front seats. Plus on the top spec SE Lux you can deselect the 17" wheels to 16", with a 55 aspect ratio. Seems to work quite well on my V50, if the C30 boot had been more useful, I would have chose one instead.
A little larger than a supermini (although possibly less so on the inside). But plenty of room in the front seats. Plus on the top spec SE Lux you can deselect the 17" wheels to 16", with a 55 aspect ratio. Seems to work quite well on my V50, if the C30 boot had been more useful, I would have chose one instead.
A lot of people are confusing 'wafting' and 'comfort' with 'having lots of expensive options', non of which do anything to improve ride, reduce NVH etc. A stiffly sprung car will ride badly regardless of wether the seats are trimmed in leather or polyester.
I can't think of any modern small car that ticks the waft boxes. They all seem to be set up for teenagers. The best riding small cars I can thing of is a non sporty Peugeot 306 or 205 but they are getting long in the tooth now.
Perhaps try a Citroen C3? Never driven one, but historically Citroen have managed waft better in small cars than anyone else.
I like the idea of doing up an old 2cv too!
I can't think of any modern small car that ticks the waft boxes. They all seem to be set up for teenagers. The best riding small cars I can thing of is a non sporty Peugeot 306 or 205 but they are getting long in the tooth now.
Perhaps try a Citroen C3? Never driven one, but historically Citroen have managed waft better in small cars than anyone else.
I like the idea of doing up an old 2cv too!
Citroen C3 Picasso?
Hired one of these last year in France and did 1200k in a week including a 4 up Vmax thrash over the Pyrenees througn Andorra and down to Spain and back in a day.
Ride comfort almost as good as my XJ8, loads of grip and grunt and really great to drive. Averaged nearly 50MPG too
Hired one of these last year in France and did 1200k in a week including a 4 up Vmax thrash over the Pyrenees througn Andorra and down to Spain and back in a day.
Ride comfort almost as good as my XJ8, loads of grip and grunt and really great to drive. Averaged nearly 50MPG too
roscozs said:
My vote would be a Fiesta Titanium. Second hand bargain if you ask me, get a well kitted one and you get Sony DAB digital radio, heated full leather, climate control, voice controls, bluetooth, USB, automatic lights and wipers, heated front windscreen and tarty ambient lighting.
You can't waft in a Ford Fiesta!roscozs said:
My vote would be a Fiesta Titanium. Second hand bargain if you ask me, get a well kitted one and you get Sony DAB digital radio, heated full leather, climate control, voice controls, bluetooth, USB, automatic lights and wipers, heated front windscreen and tarty ambient lighting.
NOT the 1.4 TDCI though, and definitely drive one first. Work have 14 of them (albeit the REALLY REALLY base models) and I can't stand driving them.
zb said:
I don't know if it fits exactly your requirements (it's a small car but supermini?) but I've always felt the Mk1 Fabia vRS felt (drove) like a bigger car on the motorway. Indeed, the reason I opted for it over the equivalent Ibiza was that if I went over a discarded coin in the Fabia I couldn't tell if it was head or tails up. I think ultimately the reason some people don't get on with the Fabia's ride is due to the seats, I find them supportive and perfectly comfortable for my build, others not so much.
Anyway, 2p added to sum.
+1 saved me typing it.Anyway, 2p added to sum.
roscozs said:
My vote would be a Fiesta Titanium. Second hand bargain if you ask me, get a well kitted one and you get Sony DAB digital radio, heated full leather, climate control, voice controls, bluetooth, USB, automatic lights and wipers, heated front windscreen and tarty ambient lighting.
That is exactly what I have! They aren't comfortable to drive and only come with 16" alloys with elastic bands for tyres.Lots of people seem to be misinterpreting the question, I'm only asking for something that is comfortable, I'm not asking which car I can add the most options too
Edited by PumpkinSteve on Sunday 4th December 10:30
I have never driven a small modern car that delivers anything near 'wafting'.
I think part of the trouble, apart from what others have mentioned relating to wheelbase length etc, is that modern cars tend to:-
- have harder seats than years ago, especially makes like Ford, Vauxhall etc.
- have much smaller tyrewalls meaning less 'play' in the tyres to soak up bumps in a non-jarring manner
- suspension setups that provide good handling, but not such great comfort
Even my daily car, an E34 540 with small 15 inch wheels, a large car compared to average, is still not in the true wafting league, compared to an S-Class etc. It is very comfortable though, way more than modern mid size cars.
Even my bosses old Jag XF 2.7D didn't feel waftish in the slightest. Though I imagine the older Jags are much better for wafting/magic carpet ride.
I think part of the trouble, apart from what others have mentioned relating to wheelbase length etc, is that modern cars tend to:-
- have harder seats than years ago, especially makes like Ford, Vauxhall etc.
- have much smaller tyrewalls meaning less 'play' in the tyres to soak up bumps in a non-jarring manner
- suspension setups that provide good handling, but not such great comfort
Even my daily car, an E34 540 with small 15 inch wheels, a large car compared to average, is still not in the true wafting league, compared to an S-Class etc. It is very comfortable though, way more than modern mid size cars.
Even my bosses old Jag XF 2.7D didn't feel waftish in the slightest. Though I imagine the older Jags are much better for wafting/magic carpet ride.
A supermini is always going to find it hard to waft due to short wheelbase and the inevitably rolly rolly handing if it was fitted with soft springs/dampers.
I was in a 5/6 year old Skoda Fabia a few years ago and was impressed with the ride quality for such a small car. Something to consider?....
I was in a 5/6 year old Skoda Fabia a few years ago and was impressed with the ride quality for such a small car. Something to consider?....
strangehighways said:
I have never driven a small modern car that delivers anything near 'wafting'.
I think part of the trouble, apart from what others have mentioned relating to wheelbase length etc, is that modern cars tend to:-
- have harder seats than years ago, especially makes like Ford, Vauxhall etc.
It's not very often I go in a car made after the '70's but whenever I do I always find the seats hard. Put t down to being used to worn out seat foams!I think part of the trouble, apart from what others have mentioned relating to wheelbase length etc, is that modern cars tend to:-
- have harder seats than years ago, especially makes like Ford, Vauxhall etc.
strangehighways said:
- have much smaller tyrewalls meaning less 'play' in the tyres to soak up bumps in a non-jarring manner
I don't get the point of having "rubber band tyres" they look stupid.strangehighways said:
- suspension setups that provide good handling, but not such great comfort
Even my daily car, an E34 540 with small 15 inch wheels, a large car compared to average, is still not in the true wafting league, compared to an S-Class etc. It is very comfortable though, way more than modern mid size cars.
Even my bosses old Jag XF 2.7D didn't feel waftish in the slightest. Though I imagine the older Jags are much better for wafting/magic carpet ride.
Old Jaguars are absolutely great wafters Even my daily car, an E34 540 with small 15 inch wheels, a large car compared to average, is still not in the true wafting league, compared to an S-Class etc. It is very comfortable though, way more than modern mid size cars.
Even my bosses old Jag XF 2.7D didn't feel waftish in the slightest. Though I imagine the older Jags are much better for wafting/magic carpet ride.
Even my Triumph Stag has more waft about it than a new XF!PumpkinSteve said:
roscozs said:
My vote would be a Fiesta Titanium. Second hand bargain if you ask me, get a well kitted one and you get Sony DAB digital radio, heated full leather, climate control, voice controls, bluetooth, USB, automatic lights and wipers, heated front windscreen and tarty ambient lighting.
That is exactly what I have! They aren't comfortable to drive and only come with 16" alloys with elastic bands for tyres.Lots of people seem to be misinterpreting the question, I'm only asking for something that is comfortable, I'm not asking which car I can add the most options too
Edited by PumpkinSteve on Sunday 4th December 10:30
Or I am sure if you look on forums and ebay you would find some teenager that has put big wheels on their Fiesta and is looking trying to sell the standard smaller wheels.
Some wheel and tyre places just take the old rims when people go in for some bling, worth calling a few to see what they have. I have picked up wheels really cheap this way in the past.
deviant said:
Can you not get on a Fiesta owners forum and swap the 16in rims with someone that has a lower model and is looking for bigger rims?
Or I am sure if you look on forums and ebay you would find some teenager that has put big wheels on their Fiesta and is looking trying to sell the standard smaller wheels.
Some wheel and tyre places just take the old rims when people go in for some bling, worth calling a few to see what they have. I have picked up wheels really cheap this way in the past.
The wheels aren't really the problem - our boggo Fiestas have 14" steelies on and they're rubbish too.Or I am sure if you look on forums and ebay you would find some teenager that has put big wheels on their Fiesta and is looking trying to sell the standard smaller wheels.
Some wheel and tyre places just take the old rims when people go in for some bling, worth calling a few to see what they have. I have picked up wheels really cheap this way in the past.
I've got a MINI cooper r50 (first gen modern one) which I know is a hated vehicle on PH for it's sacrilege but hear me out. I swapped the runflats out for some nice plump 195/55/16 toyo proxes, which are lovely and complient, and have transformed the car, Ok the ride is never what i'd call cosseting but it is very refined for a small car, has leather, nice switch gear, nice ambient lighting a good driving position, and enough power to waft along without thrashing it, the stereo is good and it is generally a nice place to sit.
I've done a lot of motorway miles in it and I'm always amazed at It's ability to cruise at higher speeds without drama, up to a 100mph down the autobahns it is still composed which I think is impressive for a none performance orientated small car.
I've not driven one of the more recent models, r56, but they are a little more luxurious again from sitting in one. If you got some standard tyres and one with a diesel engine I reckon that's as close as you could get to a wafting super mini.
Or...
I've done a lot of motorway miles in it and I'm always amazed at It's ability to cruise at higher speeds without drama, up to a 100mph down the autobahns it is still composed which I think is impressive for a none performance orientated small car.
I've not driven one of the more recent models, r56, but they are a little more luxurious again from sitting in one. If you got some standard tyres and one with a diesel engine I reckon that's as close as you could get to a wafting super mini.
Or...
cptsideways said:
I parked my Landcruiser (a big one) next to one of those new "inflated" Mini's the other day, it made the Landcruiser look small! I also saw a picture on the net the other day of a the same mini dwarfing a BL Landcrab.
This one? They are almost exactly the same width (Landcrab 170cm, BMW Landcrab 169cm).
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