Airbag light - MOT failure?

Airbag light - MOT failure?

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Discussion

Deva Link

26,934 posts

244 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
Zwolf said:
snuffle said:
Just get it MOTd before may.
And then the MoT after that?
I think the cut-off is end of March.

Maybe by the time the next one comes up there will be other solutions available? wink

snuffle

1,587 posts

181 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
Zwolf said:
snuffle said:
Just get it MOTd before may.
And then the MoT after that?
It's a rover it wont last that long.

Well yes it probably will, but because of legislative fucensoredkwittery it wont frown

MG CHRIS

9,077 posts

166 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
But aren't these changes to the mot to bring us into line with europe. Im sure out in spain everything on the car has to work even if it's not that important but they get a test every 2 years. Im sure the government want to change the mot to first test after 3 years as now then a test every 2 years similar too most of europe no.

Anyway im not that bothered about the changes as i own a car without ecu, airbags, abs etc so no great change for me.

Welshbeef

49,633 posts

197 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
Isn't the airbag a service item though?

matthias73

2,883 posts

149 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
I only read the first two pages, but if you took all the airbags out, including all the wiring and the light, could the car then pass its MOT?

Its not like an airbag is a mandatory safety accesory, otherwise classic car drivers would be fudged

jimxms

1,633 posts

159 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
matthias73 said:
I only read the first two pages, but if you took all the airbags out, including all the wiring and the light, could the car then pass its MOT?

Its not like an airbag is a mandatory safety accesory, otherwise classic car drivers would be fudged
I'd imagine that if the car were designed with airbags then they would be expecting to see them when MOT'ing? Bit like a cat converter.

Welshbeef

49,633 posts

197 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
matthias73 said:
I only read the first two pages, but if you took all the airbags out, including all the wiring and the light, could the car then pass its MOT?

Its not like an airbag is a mandatory safety accesory, otherwise classic car drivers would be fudged
If that's how it left the factory.

Airbags really are service items

LuS1fer

41,085 posts

244 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
It's another reason never to buy a new car. I can see the price of classics going up.

Welshbeef

49,633 posts

197 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
LuS1fer said:
It's another reason never to buy a new car. I can see the price of classics going up.
Name me a classic car which I can do 30-40k a year in comfort modern reliability economic and lots of power.... Short stopping distance too and with the poor state of roads and poor driving standards I want as big a crumple zone as possible to survive a crash should the worst happen.

Chicharito

1,017 posts

150 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
Welshbeef said:
Name me a classic car which I can do 30-40k a year in comfort modern reliability economic and lots of power.... Short stopping distance too and with the poor state of roads and poor driving standards I want as big a crumple zone as possible to survive a crash should the worst happen.
I can see the prices of 'retro' cars rising on the back of this kind of nonsense.

Stuff like MkIII Cavaliers, Volvo 700-series, Audi 80 / 100 etc - which can be had pre-cat legislation, but come with all the comfort and equipment you'd need.

I'm going to have to look at wiring the airbag light to the ABS light in the wife's car.

LuS1fer

41,085 posts

244 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
Welshbeef said:
Name me a classic car which I can do 30-40k a year in comfort modern reliability economic and lots of power.... Short stopping distance too and with the poor state of roads and poor driving standards I want as big a crumple zone as possible to survive a crash should the worst happen.
I don't know - Porsche 911/928? Mercedes S-Class? Not everyone does 30-40k a year nor need suffer £10k a year depreciation.
Personally, having done probably around half a million miles in various cars of varying yet dubious safety standards, I'd still not swop them for the same distance in a modern blob.
Sometimes a Honda Fireblade and all it's inherent ability to splinter your body into a million parts is vastly prefereable to an anodyne 5 star NCAP hatch.
Other times a set of aftermarket Recaros will do the trick - just try and avois multiple pile-ups and don't drive tired or whilst texting or talking on the hands-free...

johnpeat

5,326 posts

264 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
kambites said:
In fact looking on Ebay, these days you can even get bluetooth ones which will talk to an Android phone.
Just a general heads-up, be VERY CAUTIOUS what you plug into your car because you could end-up with a much bigger bill than you might expect.

If communication is established with the ECU and then broken without warning/at the wrong time - it can leave the ECU in a state only a dealer can fix - this is particularly easy to do with

a - poor-quality bluetooth dongles
b - poor-quality data-collecting dongles (the type you leave in whilst driving to check for moving faults)
c - if you pull the device/cable out whilst the engine is still running
d - if your laptop battery fails (don't ask about that one).

I'd advise people to steer WELL clear of cheap dongles/cables and software - having to have your car recovered to a dealer and it's ECU reset will cost at least a few hundred quid so don't cut corners on this stuff...

ESPECIALLY not just so you can put some silly graphs on your mobile phone...

matthias73

2,883 posts

149 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
Very silly set of rules.


But still, on the topic of usuable classics, I'm pretty sure you could pick up a nice merc or beemer, maybe even a volvo, pug 405, ect, for decent money, and you wouldn't have to worry about MOTs. You could spend the money you didn't spend on financing a Kia fridge on restoring it a bit.


Chicharito

1,017 posts

150 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
johnpeat said:
Just a general heads-up, be VERY CAUTIOUS what you plug into your car because you could end-up with a much bigger bill than you might expect.

If communication is established with the ECU and then broken without warning/at the wrong time - it can leave the ECU in a state only a dealer can fix - this is particularly easy to do with

a - poor-quality bluetooth dongles
b - poor-quality data-collecting dongles (the type you leave in whilst driving to check for moving faults)
c - if you pull the device/cable out whilst the engine is still running
d - if your laptop battery fails (don't ask about that one).

I'd advise people to steer WELL clear of cheap dongles/cables and software - having to have your car recovered to a dealer and it's ECU reset will cost at least a few hundred quid so don't cut corners on this stuff...

ESPECIALLY not just so you can put some silly graphs on your mobile phone...
Sorry, but as someone who has been into OBDII tinkering since it first started to come within reach of the average Joe... that's a load of rubbish.

There are a couple of caveats - you have to watch the K-Line on VAGs and to read Alfa Airbag / ABS and Selespeed ECUs you need to bridge a couple of pins - but I've never heard of anyone doing permanent damage with an OBDII kit.

The only real risk is if you start trying to 'chip' your car with dodgy EPROM files.

johnpeat

5,326 posts

264 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
Chicharito said:
The only real risk is if you start trying to 'chip' your car with dodgy EPROM files.
A mechanic I know has been tinkering with this stuff for years and he's seen his fair share of problems - esp when it comes to trying to reset codes (reading them is obviously far less risky).

There's a lot of stuff people want to do nowadays tho - from resetting service indicators and persistant warning lights to disabling DPFs and allsorts of other stuff - and there's a barrage of ways of doing it (some of which work - some of which aren't so wise - tinker at your peril).

He's also getting more and more people calling-up saying they were trying to read fault codes with their laptop/phone (or they've even built tablets into their dash to give them GTR-style displays) when the software crashed and now their car is stuck in limp-mode or worse - again it's sometimes fixable and sometimes dealer time.

If you check the websites behind the more popular diag. apps (Torque for Android, for example) they also advise caution in choosing dongles/cables but I honestly think the best advice is

"Unless you know what you're doing AND have decent kit to do it with - don't bother because it could easily backfire".

Jimmyarm

1,962 posts

177 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
+1 to the above.

Most airbag issues are an easy fix, even if temporary for an mot.

The new regs wont make a huge difference.

They should gave made service indicators an advisory.

johnpeat

5,326 posts

264 months

Friday 16th December 2011
quotequote all
I tend to equate faffing around with ECUs/OBD kit to faffing around trying to unlock/debrand mobile phones - both are fine IF you know what you're doing and have the proper kit.

I worked with someone last year who's previous job had been in a (very busy) mobile phone and laptop repair shop. He said the owner was the sort who'd "have a go" at anything, but always with dodgy software and cheap cables/dongles and as a result, his failure rate was terrifying.

Around 4/10 mobiles brought to him to be debranded or unlocked ended-up either bricked or at least 'not fixed'. His policy was to still charge customers anyway (or refuse to return the phone). In the end, Trading Standards had driven him out of business after dozens of complaints were made about his ridiculous approach to 'business'.

As with all things, there's a right way (usually costing some money/requiring the right hardware and software) and there's the short-cut/cheapo option (in this case, a bit of kit from eBay China and some software from MegaUpload/Rapidshare).

Do you feel lucky? smile

warch

2,941 posts

153 months

Saturday 17th December 2011
quotequote all
Jimmyarm said:
They should gave made service indicators an advisory.
They're not including service indicators are they? Surely they're not relevant to roadworthiness? Actually you don't need any special tools to turn the one off in my Mini.

I'm worried by the increasing complexity of modern cars too, its already putting me off diesels (too complex). I've just reinsured my 60's land rover which has a complete lack of testable features, no seat belts let alone airbags, a visible smoke test instead of emissions test and a wiring diagram that you could draw on the back of a fag packet.

Fox-

13,228 posts

245 months

Sunday 22nd April 2012
quotequote all
Deva Link said:
Zwolf said:
snuffle said:
Just get it MOTd before may.
And then the MoT after that?
I think the cut-off is end of March.
Can anyone confirm what the situation with this is now?

Is an airbag light now an MOT failure, or is not until May? My understanding - and indeed the VOSA website - seem to state that it is an advisory from January 2012 until a 'Bedding In Period' is complete. But I can find nothing which states when this period ends and it becomes an actual failure. Some people say March, some say April and some say May.

Does anyone know for sure?