The Car Salesman's Thread
Discussion
longblackcoat said:
He may or may not be.
That said, the point he makes about how car dealers are viewed by Phers is reasonably valid, and I'd agree with him that some of the contributors on this thread seem more empathetic and customer-focussed than others.
But it's ok to call us a bunch of con artists, liers and whatever, just because we happen to be in the motor trade, with no expectation of a reply? This isn't 'let's abuse the motor trade thread'.That said, the point he makes about how car dealers are viewed by Phers is reasonably valid, and I'd agree with him that some of the contributors on this thread seem more empathetic and customer-focussed than others.
Sometimes, customers are indeed wrong, totally unreasonable and beyond help. I will agree that shady/underhand things still go on but not with or from me. I think that most of 'the trade' posters on here are the same. That's sort of why we have lasted in this business. Ethics, a fair deal and looking after our customers as best we can.
oldnbold said:
What you guys have to remember is that car salesmen just like salesmen in any other industry have a job of work to do. If they sell the products that there boss wants selling, in the numbers he wants selling, they will earn good money. If they dont they will earn crap money and eventually be shown the door.
Some of the best car salesmen have no interest what so ever in cars. Its just a product to be sold.
If you don't want the product don't bulls
t just say no thank you.
Yup, I understand that completely. Hence my post saying I didn't want to come across as an 'idiot'. (Spelt with a W...)Some of the best car salesmen have no interest what so ever in cars. Its just a product to be sold.
If you don't want the product don't bulls
t just say no thank you.matc said:
I think it's only right that everyone who posts on here to specifically slag off sales people should tell us what their profession is....
I really do hope that's not aimed at me.
matc said:
I think it's only right that everyone who posts on here to specifically slag off sales people should tell us what their profession is....
I don't, because then it'll simply degenerate into a boring succession of ill-informed ad hominem attacks instead of providing the users of PH with a dedicated avenue to discuss aspects of the motor trade and possibly gain some insight to what the transaction is like from the other side of the desk.It makes no odds to me what any of the non motor trade folk in here do to earn a crust, it doesn't alter how I answer a given question and I'm not interested in telling them how they should do their job that I have only a limited or no experience of.
There's also no need to tell us to f
k off for doing our jobs either. We offer products and services, we explain the features, benefits and price. People then decide whether to buy them or not. No offers are made that people can't refuse, no horse's head in your bed if you don't take everything we offer at full price.
We're in commercial enterprise, therefore everything we do is intended to generate profit for our employers and their shareholders, why are people confused and why do they get angry about this?
Ever paid £3.50 for garlic bread with your £15 pizza? That's incremental profit too...
oldnbold said:
If you don't want the product don't bullst just say no thank you.
Thats fair enough and I understand why you say it but I know of 2 colleagues who, when specifically asking NOT to have paint protection were told if they want the car which is in stock they all have the protection so you have to pay for it. The alternative is to order one without which means a 3 month wait. Bit hard when said car is for your wife and the salesman didn't mention this when you looked at the car in the first place.t just say no thank you."Oh go on darling its only another £350!"
Deva Link said:
In my business it's pretty well known what the commission rates are and I tell anyone who asks. They're usually surprised how low they are and the problem that causes is a customer has to be able to spend a pretty chunky amount ($250K/yr) or it's just not worth talking to them and they sometimes get pissed off about that. It costs $1000 for me to go and visit someone.
However consumer sales are a different kettle of fish. It's not much of a stretch that the forthcoming Retail Distribution Review (RDR) commission ban could be applied to F&I products sold to retail customer by car dealers.
I will have a crack at this Deva. You may or may not wish to read but here goes. The RDR commission is indeed looking into all aspects of retail sales. There is no 'ban' in place at present. In fact, the majority of checks and safeguards they are considering recommending are already in place in our industry and have been since 2004. It could be said that the FSA has already covered that one. Just so you know, the RDR commission has specifically looked at the motor trade and considers it to be very adequately 'policed' in the form of authorisation to offer non investment insurance products. So, in summary, the RDR isn't looking at us, baby.However consumer sales are a different kettle of fish. It's not much of a stretch that the forthcoming Retail Distribution Review (RDR) commission ban could be applied to F&I products sold to retail customer by car dealers.
HTH
GreatGranny said:
Thats fair enough and I understand why you say it but I know of 2 colleagues who, when specifically asking NOT to have paint protection were told if they want the car which is in stock they all have the protection so you have to pay for it. The alternative is to order one without which means a 3 month wait. Bit hard when said car is for your wife and the salesman didn't mention this when you looked at the car in the first place.
"Oh go on darling its only another £350!"
That sort of thing is deplorable practice and needs to be eradicated. It doesn't exactly embody the core FSA principle of Treating Customers Fairly (deliberate capitalisation)."Oh go on darling its only another £350!"
It's utter, obvious tripe too. New cars don't sit in stock fully valeted, partly because mostly, we don't actually own them and they might get dealer transferred out.
Dealers do not incur any potentially non-recoverable costs and spunking £350 per new stock vehicle would be a loss-making exercise.
In such situations, my advice to anyone who asked would be to find another dealer. Very few new speculative stock vehicles are unique after all...
If nothing else, it's poor, weak salesmanship. If you want to give things away, fine. But it's certainly not selling.
Edited by Zwolf on Friday 12th October 21:08
GreatGranny said:
oldnbold said:
If you don't want the product don't bullst just say no thank you.
Thats fair enough and I understand why you say it but I know of 2 colleagues who, when specifically asking NOT to have paint protection were told if they want the car which is in stock they all have the protection so you have to pay for it. The alternative is to order one without which means a 3 month wait. Bit hard when said car is for your wife and the salesman didn't mention this when you looked at the car in the first place.t just say no thank you."Oh go on darling its only another £350!"
However, if faced with this situation my advice would be to get up and walk away.
One of two things will probably then happen. Either you will leave, find another dealer who will offer the same deal in another town. Or faced with a sale walking out the door the product will suddenly become FOC.
...or they'll miraculously "find" one that's due in/just come in and hasn't yet had the treatment applied.
I'd still walk at such an obviously transparent approach though, but I appreciate I have an insight that many don't as I'm an "insider".
The funny thing is that as such, I respect and respond well to genuinely competent and confident salesmanship and have certainly paid over the bare minimum for things as a result - I don't begrudge doing so if it has been deservedly earned.
I'd still walk at such an obviously transparent approach though, but I appreciate I have an insight that many don't as I'm an "insider".
The funny thing is that as such, I respect and respond well to genuinely competent and confident salesmanship and have certainly paid over the bare minimum for things as a result - I don't begrudge doing so if it has been deservedly earned.
Great thread!
I retired at the end of 2011, but being relatively 'young' [ 53 ] got incredibly bored. Had sold a few large screens to a local MINI dealership and approached the DP to see whether he had any vacancies.
So from March this year have been Progress Chaser! Enjoying every minute of the job, must walk 10-15 miles each day, but great fun
Do most other dealerships have such bods or do you sales guys handle all the SMART repairs,taxing, DVLA visits,refuelling,driving, and other assorted menial tasks yourself?
Also looking to improve the handover diary on the computer system. Current one is basically a word doc that is visible on the 6 sales bods computers. Are there any 'off the shelf' systems that anyone is aware of?
Great to read all the stories, and amazed at the relentless nature of this industry. I sold electronic chips for 20 years, and then AV systems, but have never experienced an industry, such as the motor trade, for the sheer non stop nature of each and every month!
I retired at the end of 2011, but being relatively 'young' [ 53 ] got incredibly bored. Had sold a few large screens to a local MINI dealership and approached the DP to see whether he had any vacancies.
So from March this year have been Progress Chaser! Enjoying every minute of the job, must walk 10-15 miles each day, but great fun
Do most other dealerships have such bods or do you sales guys handle all the SMART repairs,taxing, DVLA visits,refuelling,driving, and other assorted menial tasks yourself?
Also looking to improve the handover diary on the computer system. Current one is basically a word doc that is visible on the 6 sales bods computers. Are there any 'off the shelf' systems that anyone is aware of?
Great to read all the stories, and amazed at the relentless nature of this industry. I sold electronic chips for 20 years, and then AV systems, but have never experienced an industry, such as the motor trade, for the sheer non stop nature of each and every month!
E31Shrew said:
Great thread!
I retired at the end of 2011, but being relatively 'young' [ 53 ] got incredibly bored. Had sold a few large screens to a local MINI dealership and approached the DP to see whether he had any vacancies.
So from March this year have been Progress Chaser! Enjoying every minute of the job, must walk 10-15 miles each day, but great fun
Do most other dealerships have such bods or do you sales guys handle all the SMART repairs,taxing, DVLA visits,refuelling,driving, and other assorted menial tasks yourself?
Also looking to improve the handover diary on the computer system. Current one is basically a word doc that is visible on the 6 sales bods computers. Are there any 'off the shelf' systems that anyone is aware of?
Great to read all the stories, and amazed at the relentless nature of this industry. I sold electronic chips for 20 years, and then AV systems, but have never experienced an industry, such as the motor trade, for the sheer non stop nature of each and every month!
Funnily enough I came to selling cars from working in the AV industry! (Saville AV in York).I retired at the end of 2011, but being relatively 'young' [ 53 ] got incredibly bored. Had sold a few large screens to a local MINI dealership and approached the DP to see whether he had any vacancies.
So from March this year have been Progress Chaser! Enjoying every minute of the job, must walk 10-15 miles each day, but great fun
Do most other dealerships have such bods or do you sales guys handle all the SMART repairs,taxing, DVLA visits,refuelling,driving, and other assorted menial tasks yourself?
Also looking to improve the handover diary on the computer system. Current one is basically a word doc that is visible on the 6 sales bods computers. Are there any 'off the shelf' systems that anyone is aware of?
Great to read all the stories, and amazed at the relentless nature of this industry. I sold electronic chips for 20 years, and then AV systems, but have never experienced an industry, such as the motor trade, for the sheer non stop nature of each and every month!
I don't have a progress chaser but had one once when I worked at MG Rover, a really good lad who couldn't hack it as a salesman but was a good personable efficient chap, he was ideal for the job, knew how it was as a salesman and how we worked and slotted into the team very well, he saved lots of time running around which we could use to keep on selling. Interestingly enough that was the most profitable sales team I've worked in at franchised dealers.
markmullen said:
E31Shrew said:
Great thread!
I retired at the end of 2011, but being relatively 'young' [ 53 ] got incredibly bored. Had sold a few large screens to a local MINI dealership and approached the DP to see whether he had any vacancies.
So from March this year have been Progress Chaser! Enjoying every minute of the job, must walk 10-15 miles each day, but great fun
Do most other dealerships have such bods or do you sales guys handle all the SMART repairs,taxing, DVLA visits,refuelling,driving, and other assorted menial tasks yourself?
Also looking to improve the handover diary on the computer system. Current one is basically a word doc that is visible on the 6 sales bods computers. Are there any 'off the shelf' systems that anyone is aware of?
Great to read all the stories, and amazed at the relentless nature of this industry. I sold electronic chips for 20 years, and then AV systems, but have never experienced an industry, such as the motor trade, for the sheer non stop nature of each and every month!
Funnily enough I came to selling cars from working in the AV industry! (Saville AV in York).I retired at the end of 2011, but being relatively 'young' [ 53 ] got incredibly bored. Had sold a few large screens to a local MINI dealership and approached the DP to see whether he had any vacancies.
So from March this year have been Progress Chaser! Enjoying every minute of the job, must walk 10-15 miles each day, but great fun
Do most other dealerships have such bods or do you sales guys handle all the SMART repairs,taxing, DVLA visits,refuelling,driving, and other assorted menial tasks yourself?
Also looking to improve the handover diary on the computer system. Current one is basically a word doc that is visible on the 6 sales bods computers. Are there any 'off the shelf' systems that anyone is aware of?
Great to read all the stories, and amazed at the relentless nature of this industry. I sold electronic chips for 20 years, and then AV systems, but have never experienced an industry, such as the motor trade, for the sheer non stop nature of each and every month!
I don't have a progress chaser but had one once when I worked at MG Rover, a really good lad who couldn't hack it as a salesman but was a good personable efficient chap, he was ideal for the job, knew how it was as a salesman and how we worked and slotted into the team very well, he saved lots of time running around which we could use to keep on selling. Interestingly enough that was the most profitable sales team I've worked in at franchised dealers.
I am responsible for all the used cars we take in, that are going to go back out on to the pitch, from the initial cosmetic assessment, all the way through the process and the weekly inspections of all cars [ 80 ] that are on the forecourt. Also all new cars from delivery to handover.
I tend to consider the sales bods as my clients and really just try to take all of the crap out of their day, and as you say, just leave them to get on with what they should be doing.
All in all great fun and just glad to be in a vibrant, busy dealership!
E31Shrew said:
I dont think I could face the thought of going back in to sales again after 30 years of it! It's great just being a useful part of the overall team but also being able to avoid the daily 'sales meetings' and inevitable pressure that goes with it, coupled with the fact that it's 0830 to 1730 with no weekends.
I am responsible for all the used cars we take in, that are going to go back out on to the pitch, from the initial cosmetic assessment, all the way through the process and the weekly inspections of all cars [ 80 ] that are on the forecourt. Also all new cars from delivery to handover.
I tend to consider the sales bods as my clients and really just try to take all of the crap out of their day, and as you say, just leave them to get on with what they should be doing.
All in all great fun and just glad to be in a vibrant, busy dealership!
Brilliant, sounds ideal for you, and I'm sure your sales colleagues appreciate your work, even if they don't show it.I am responsible for all the used cars we take in, that are going to go back out on to the pitch, from the initial cosmetic assessment, all the way through the process and the weekly inspections of all cars [ 80 ] that are on the forecourt. Also all new cars from delivery to handover.
I tend to consider the sales bods as my clients and really just try to take all of the crap out of their day, and as you say, just leave them to get on with what they should be doing.
All in all great fun and just glad to be in a vibrant, busy dealership!
markmullen said:
E31Shrew said:
I dont think I could face the thought of going back in to sales again after 30 years of it! It's great just being a useful part of the overall team but also being able to avoid the daily 'sales meetings' and inevitable pressure that goes with it, coupled with the fact that it's 0830 to 1730 with no weekends.
I am responsible for all the used cars we take in, that are going to go back out on to the pitch, from the initial cosmetic assessment, all the way through the process and the weekly inspections of all cars [ 80 ] that are on the forecourt. Also all new cars from delivery to handover.
I tend to consider the sales bods as my clients and really just try to take all of the crap out of their day, and as you say, just leave them to get on with what they should be doing.
All in all great fun and just glad to be in a vibrant, busy dealership!
Brilliant, sounds ideal for you, and I'm sure your sales colleagues appreciate your work, even if they don't show it.I am responsible for all the used cars we take in, that are going to go back out on to the pitch, from the initial cosmetic assessment, all the way through the process and the weekly inspections of all cars [ 80 ] that are on the forecourt. Also all new cars from delivery to handover.
I tend to consider the sales bods as my clients and really just try to take all of the crap out of their day, and as you say, just leave them to get on with what they should be doing.
All in all great fun and just glad to be in a vibrant, busy dealership!
E31Shrew said:
Do most other dealerships have such bods or do you sales guys handle all the SMART repairs,taxing, DVLA visits,refuelling,driving, and other assorted menial tasks yourself?
Ten years or so ago, yes. I did a stint as one for BMW and enjoyed it immensely. With the recent downturn and GMs/DPs cutting all "unnecessary" expenses from their sales department budgets, many have fallen by the wayside with the salespeople each taking their share of the job in addition to that of actually selling some cars in among it all.
Most now run on a basis of "Well you lot all sell >extremely unlikely number of cars< this next year and we'll get someone...".
It's largely a thankless job, but I found it incredibly rewarding and every day did indeed present it's fresh challenges. Mostly along the lines of salespeople forgetting they had cars going out in a few hours that needed to go into workshop/have accessories fitted/needed bodywork/taxing and that had been sat there for a week or more since the order was taken.
Zwolf said:
E31Shrew said:
Do most other dealerships have such bods or do you sales guys handle all the SMART repairs,taxing, DVLA visits,refuelling,driving, and other assorted menial tasks yourself?
Ten years or so ago, yes. I did a stint as one for BMW and enjoyed it immensely. With the recent downturn and GMs/DPs cutting all "unnecessary" expenses from their sales department budgets, many have fallen by the wayside with the salespeople each taking their share of the job in addition to that of actually selling some cars in among it all.
Most now run on a basis of "Well you lot all sell >extremely unlikely number of cars< this next year and we'll get someone...".
It's largely a thankless job, but I found it incredibly rewarding and every day did indeed present it's fresh challenges. Mostly along the lines of salespeople forgetting they had cars going out in a few hours that needed to go into workshop/have accessories fitted/needed bodywork/taxing and that had been sat there for a week or more since the order was taken.
I do get a great deal of satisfaction seeing a well used example arrive and then a few days later it's gleaming on the pitch. Nice also to have a DP who has no qualms about spending money to ensure the cars are always perfect.
Anyone know of any decent Handover Diary software?
E31Shrew said:
Do most other dealerships have such bods or do you sales guys handle all the SMART repairs,taxing, DVLA visits,refuelling,driving, and other assorted menial tasks yourself?
We don't and even in busier times we didn't have such a person, I have worked at another garage who did have someone do all the running around for the sales dept, you would just put a handover date and time down on the sheet and an hour before hand the car would be sat out the front ready to go. However now and as I'm a bit older I am actually like organising it all myself and keeping on top of what's needed as I like to know its being or been done, I'm very well organised and I like to know where I am.
I have worked with some shocking sales guys who would struggle to remember to wipe their own arse, just a few examples:
1) Forgetting to book the car in for a valet to the point of the valeters refusing to clean it as once again they are being asked to clean it as the customer "is here".
2) Doing a handover with the car still on the ramps in the workshop.
3) Forgetting they have a handover until the customer turns up.
4) Popping out just before a handover leaving the customer sitting around waiting for them.
5) Even though a certain salesman has made his own deal file checklist as he is always forgetting to do certain paperwork he still forgets bits.
6) Fuelling the car at handover with the customer in the car.
However theses people are almost Teflon coated and manage to get away with it, they are also generally the best sellers too.
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