RE: Detroit show: Porsche 911 Cabriolet
Discussion
There appears to be two distinct schools of thought over the 911.
1. Those who are sick and tired of hearing about a " new" 911 being brought to market, when it looks practically identical to the last many dozens of "new" 911 models. Porsche 911 styling department must consist of one man and his dog, with the workload shared on an equal basis.
2. Those who own a 911, or have aspired to do so for years, and who have an emotional attachment to the 911 which cannot be shaken, even if they know that the announcement of a new 911 will produce a car which looks pretty much like the last one, and the one before that etc etc.
One mans meat is another mans poison, so, buy what you like.
I can't help thinking though, if the 911 didn't exist, and the car was introduced now by, say, Daihatsu, would the 911 lovers still think it was wonderful?
1. Those who are sick and tired of hearing about a " new" 911 being brought to market, when it looks practically identical to the last many dozens of "new" 911 models. Porsche 911 styling department must consist of one man and his dog, with the workload shared on an equal basis.
2. Those who own a 911, or have aspired to do so for years, and who have an emotional attachment to the 911 which cannot be shaken, even if they know that the announcement of a new 911 will produce a car which looks pretty much like the last one, and the one before that etc etc.
One mans meat is another mans poison, so, buy what you like.
I can't help thinking though, if the 911 didn't exist, and the car was introduced now by, say, Daihatsu, would the 911 lovers still think it was wonderful?
Its a nice looking vehicle and no mistake, but do I yearn to own one?
No.
Although the 2 latest updates (this and the 997) are both pleasing enough to the eye, and are- as you would expect- improved versions of the previous model, for me they are simply too far away from the original model.
The latest 911 i would consider would be a 993.
As one of the more drug addled members of the beach boys said- 'dont f*ck with the formula'. Porsche have neither chosen, or indeed needed to.
Obviously, there will be a huge number of people on here- and lets be straight- everyone is entitled to their own opinion- that will knock it for being too similar, or more accurately- not radical enough in design, but Porshce really dont need to, do they? they will still sell as many as they can build, there will be the more extreme versions coming along soon too, and of course the track only editions to update (and no doubt swell the company coffers)the numerous race series that take place worldwide.
Granted, im sure that in a stroke, they oould proudce something so sparkly and amazing that the world would stop and take notice (918?), but they dont need to- they are massaging the design of a car that has been in continual manufacture for 50 years. The bottom line is that if its been made for that long, it isnt because it is no good.
I would like to read a long term test about quality, and indeed, cast an eye over the new model to have a look for myself, but prior to the 996, the car was always held in high esteem for solid construction, good reliability, and strong resales. These count to a lot of users of course (or rather, those that dont simply say 'they are sh*it, boring' and all of the other usual commments.
Also, factor in that as a single model, it has won in most branches of motorsport, is still strongly represented by one make series, and in various forms has won le mans, the paris- dakar rally, and countless others inbetween.
Whilst its easy to knock the car as a design, and a great deal of people take FAR too much notice of one man on the television, it should be noted that the porsche will always be near or at the top of any road test. Its been going for long enough for the creases to be ironed out of its dynamics, and it still drives in a way that is unique.
I guess, overall, that you either buy into it and admire it for what it is, or simply knock it.
Either way, i would doubt that porsche cares too much as the sales books fill up- with the adtional benefit of a flood of 2nd hand, more affordable vehicles reaches the market- and hopefully, the enthusiast.
Me? A 964- often viewed as the weakest link of them all, and very much a rushed model to fill a void until cash was available for a new one. Do i adore the way it looks? Yes. The way it sounds/drives/steers/stops/is practical/usable daily and a host of others? yes. Yes i do.
To anyone that hasnt driven one, i would implore you to try one- just for a short time- before spouting off the general comments- anyone that claims to be a car enthusiast must have (one would hope) the tiniest bit of admiration for a design that has been produced for so long, and accomplished so much, but maybe im worng.
Either way, great looking, sure it will drive well, but i will stick with an older one, and revel in its character.
No.
Although the 2 latest updates (this and the 997) are both pleasing enough to the eye, and are- as you would expect- improved versions of the previous model, for me they are simply too far away from the original model.
The latest 911 i would consider would be a 993.
As one of the more drug addled members of the beach boys said- 'dont f*ck with the formula'. Porsche have neither chosen, or indeed needed to.
Obviously, there will be a huge number of people on here- and lets be straight- everyone is entitled to their own opinion- that will knock it for being too similar, or more accurately- not radical enough in design, but Porshce really dont need to, do they? they will still sell as many as they can build, there will be the more extreme versions coming along soon too, and of course the track only editions to update (and no doubt swell the company coffers)the numerous race series that take place worldwide.
Granted, im sure that in a stroke, they oould proudce something so sparkly and amazing that the world would stop and take notice (918?), but they dont need to- they are massaging the design of a car that has been in continual manufacture for 50 years. The bottom line is that if its been made for that long, it isnt because it is no good.
I would like to read a long term test about quality, and indeed, cast an eye over the new model to have a look for myself, but prior to the 996, the car was always held in high esteem for solid construction, good reliability, and strong resales. These count to a lot of users of course (or rather, those that dont simply say 'they are sh*it, boring' and all of the other usual commments.
Also, factor in that as a single model, it has won in most branches of motorsport, is still strongly represented by one make series, and in various forms has won le mans, the paris- dakar rally, and countless others inbetween.
Whilst its easy to knock the car as a design, and a great deal of people take FAR too much notice of one man on the television, it should be noted that the porsche will always be near or at the top of any road test. Its been going for long enough for the creases to be ironed out of its dynamics, and it still drives in a way that is unique.
I guess, overall, that you either buy into it and admire it for what it is, or simply knock it.
Either way, i would doubt that porsche cares too much as the sales books fill up- with the adtional benefit of a flood of 2nd hand, more affordable vehicles reaches the market- and hopefully, the enthusiast.
Me? A 964- often viewed as the weakest link of them all, and very much a rushed model to fill a void until cash was available for a new one. Do i adore the way it looks? Yes. The way it sounds/drives/steers/stops/is practical/usable daily and a host of others? yes. Yes i do.
To anyone that hasnt driven one, i would implore you to try one- just for a short time- before spouting off the general comments- anyone that claims to be a car enthusiast must have (one would hope) the tiniest bit of admiration for a design that has been produced for so long, and accomplished so much, but maybe im worng.
Either way, great looking, sure it will drive well, but i will stick with an older one, and revel in its character.
needham said:
There appears to be two distinct schools of thought over the 911.
1. Those who are sick and tired of hearing about a " new" 911 being brought to market, when it looks practically identical to the last many dozens of "new" 911 models. Porsche 911 styling department must consist of one man and his dog, with the workload shared on an equal basis.
2. Those who own a 911, or have aspired to do so for years, and who have an emotional attachment to the 911 which cannot be shaken, even if they know that the announcement of a new 911 will produce a car which looks pretty much like the last one, and the one before that etc etc.
3) People who understand business and the fact that when you have a product that is instantly recognisable, has loyal owners, sell's by the boatload and is regarded as probably the best product in it's area then you would be a fool to make wholesale changes to it.1. Those who are sick and tired of hearing about a " new" 911 being brought to market, when it looks practically identical to the last many dozens of "new" 911 models. Porsche 911 styling department must consist of one man and his dog, with the workload shared on an equal basis.
2. Those who own a 911, or have aspired to do so for years, and who have an emotional attachment to the 911 which cannot be shaken, even if they know that the announcement of a new 911 will produce a car which looks pretty much like the last one, and the one before that etc etc.
needham said:
I can't help thinking though, if the 911 didn't exist, and the car was introduced now by, say, Daihatsu, would the 911 lovers still think it was wonderful?
Your point is moot because the heritage and motorsport pedigree of Porsche understandably play a part in its success.needham said:
There appears to be two distinct schools of thought over the 911.
1. Those who are sick and tired of hearing about a " new" 911 being brought to market, when it looks practically identical to the last many dozens of "new" 911 models. Porsche 911 styling department must consist of one man and his dog, with the workload shared on an equal basis.
2. Those who own a 911, or have aspired to do so for years, and who have an emotional attachment to the 911 which cannot be shaken, even if they know that the announcement of a new 911 will produce a car which looks pretty much like the last one, and the one before that etc etc.
One mans meat is another mans poison, so, buy what you like.
I can't help thinking though, if the 911 didn't exist, and the car was introduced now by, say, Daihatsu, would the 911 lovers still think it was wonderful?
Three schools I think.1. Those who are sick and tired of hearing about a " new" 911 being brought to market, when it looks practically identical to the last many dozens of "new" 911 models. Porsche 911 styling department must consist of one man and his dog, with the workload shared on an equal basis.
2. Those who own a 911, or have aspired to do so for years, and who have an emotional attachment to the 911 which cannot be shaken, even if they know that the announcement of a new 911 will produce a car which looks pretty much like the last one, and the one before that etc etc.
One mans meat is another mans poison, so, buy what you like.
I can't help thinking though, if the 911 didn't exist, and the car was introduced now by, say, Daihatsu, would the 911 lovers still think it was wonderful?
3. The 'Independent'. Someone who loves cars, has no Marque loyalty and buys which ever one he feels will be blinding to drive at a given point in time - assuming he likes the look of it too and feels it's worth the money. Hence I had several 997s but wouldn't have entertained a 996 (didn't like the looks.). I'll tell people all my 997s were brilliant - not that ALL Porsches are brilliant. Complete car tart me. Happy with what I've got until someone waves the next exciting thing under my nose. Don't care who manufactures it. Life's too short for blinkers!
I have a bit of a thing for 911's, but when it comes to the cabrio versions, well all i can say is noooooo!!! they just seem wrong. Look a bit silly imo.
It's the fat arse that i don't like, i know there's an engine in there so they can't help it but really not feeling it.
It's the fat arse that i don't like, i know there's an engine in there so they can't help it but really not feeling it.
Edited by ludicrous speed on Wednesday 11th January 10:51
Pugsey said:
Three schools I think.
3. The 'Independent'. Someone who loves cars, has no Marque loyalty and buys which ever one he feels will be blinding to drive at a given point in time - assuming he likes the look of it too and feels it's worth the money. Hence I had several 997s but wouldn't have entertained a 996 (didn't like the looks.). I'll tell people all my 997s were brilliant - not that ALL Porsches are brilliant. Complete car tart me. Happy with what I've got until someone waves the next exciting thing under my nose. Don't care who manufactures it. Life's too short for blinkers!
Whoa there pugsey, I'd already provided option '3'. Please edit your post as option '4'. 3. The 'Independent'. Someone who loves cars, has no Marque loyalty and buys which ever one he feels will be blinding to drive at a given point in time - assuming he likes the look of it too and feels it's worth the money. Hence I had several 997s but wouldn't have entertained a 996 (didn't like the looks.). I'll tell people all my 997s were brilliant - not that ALL Porsches are brilliant. Complete car tart me. Happy with what I've got until someone waves the next exciting thing under my nose. Don't care who manufactures it. Life's too short for blinkers!
SWoll said:
Pugsey said:
Three schools I think.
3. The 'Independent'. Someone who loves cars, has no Marque loyalty and buys which ever one he feels will be blinding to drive at a given point in time - assuming he likes the look of it too and feels it's worth the money. Hence I had several 997s but wouldn't have entertained a 996 (didn't like the looks.). I'll tell people all my 997s were brilliant - not that ALL Porsches are brilliant. Complete car tart me. Happy with what I've got until someone waves the next exciting thing under my nose. Don't care who manufactures it. Life's too short for blinkers!
Whoa there pugsey, I'd already provided option '3'. Please edit your post as option '4'. 3. The 'Independent'. Someone who loves cars, has no Marque loyalty and buys which ever one he feels will be blinding to drive at a given point in time - assuming he likes the look of it too and feels it's worth the money. Hence I had several 997s but wouldn't have entertained a 996 (didn't like the looks.). I'll tell people all my 997s were brilliant - not that ALL Porsches are brilliant. Complete car tart me. Happy with what I've got until someone waves the next exciting thing under my nose. Don't care who manufactures it. Life's too short for blinkers!
ludicrous speed said:
I have a bit of a thing for 911's, but when it comes to the cabrio versions, well all i can say is noooooo!!! they just seem wrong. Look a bit silly imo.
It's the fat arse that i don't like, i know there's an engine in there so they can't help it but really not feeling it.
Agreed. If only they could get the rear deck lower. Oh, hang on, that'd be a Boxster!It's the fat arse that i don't like, i know there's an engine in there so they can't help it but really not feeling it.
Edited by ludicrous speed on Wednesday 11th January 10:51
It's a 911, more than that it's a variant of the CURRENT 911. What did you all expect it too look like? The thing I love about the 911 is its iconic shape, the fact it isn't as wide as a bus (yes I'm looking at you Ferrari) and its usable. Yes, it looks much the same as the last one. So what? Porsche only has a small range and taking chances with its best selling (probably, most profitable, definitely) model is the last thing they would consider.
It's lovely BUT, I'd still prefer a Cayman though.
It's lovely BUT, I'd still prefer a Cayman though.
I've never liked the shape of 911 convertibles and I too would rather the boxster spyder. As the car goes the 993 was better looking than the 996 and the 997 was imo better looking than this latest model. No idea how the new car drives but on looks I don't think new is always better.
disco1 said:
Skater12 said:
BREAKING NEWS !!!
Porsche in complete new car shocker!
ooops, no, that hasnt happened.
Come on Porsche, Iknow it's a tried and tested style, but well into the 21st century now. Isnt it time you thought a bit outside of your clinically styled box?
BREAKING NEWSPorsche in complete new car shocker!
ooops, no, that hasnt happened.
Come on Porsche, Iknow it's a tried and tested style, but well into the 21st century now. Isnt it time you thought a bit outside of your clinically styled box?
Porsche hater PH'er in Porsche design critique shocker!
It wouldn't be a 911 unless it actually looked like a 911 now would it????
Pugsey said:
ludicrous speed said:
I have a bit of a thing for 911's, but when it comes to the cabrio versions, well all i can say is noooooo!!! they just seem wrong. Look a bit silly imo.
It's the fat arse that i don't like, i know there's an engine in there so they can't help it but really not feeling it.
Agreed. It's the fat arse that i don't like, i know there's an engine in there so they can't help it but really not feeling it.
Edited by ludicrous speed on Wednesday 11th January 10:51
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff