Re: New Audi RS4 Avant: see it at Geneva
Discussion
Cupramax said:
SD1992 said:
Sounds great, I just hope they give it a proper manual gearbox with a clutch pedal!
Dave Hedgehog said:
1930's that way =======>
you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
I tend to agree with SD1992. Nothing wrong with a manual gearbox, at least YOU have control of what is going on and not the car.you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
E38Ross said:
how do you mean? i'm curious. what do you mean by ultimately the gearbox is in control? what can you do with the manual that you can't do (but would actually want/need to do) in the DCT/DSG boxes?
Well for one thing, personally I like to be able to choose how fast the clutch engages.I can't see myself ever buying a car without a manual gearbox. I just don't like automatics (or "automated manuals" if you prefer that term).
Cupramax said:
I think its more to do with emissions, they can make the DSG boxes change up vry early and hence lower the dreaded Carbon .
in this instance i tend to think its purely marketing, a manual 4 door RS4 would tread on the feat of the RS5, a DSG Avant would be bought by somebody after a completely different kind of cargood dsg boxes do allow you to be fully in control as anyone who has driven the latest pdk will tell you and anyone that hasn't wont.
all it is is personal preference at the end of the day.
all it is is personal preference at the end of the day.
E38Ross said:
.....but i fail to see how the double clutch boxes don't allow YOU to be in control of what's going on?? they can be fully manual, ya know????
Johnspex said:
Dave Hedgehog said:
1930's that way =======>
you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
It's not just me who thinks like that then. Well said Mr Hedgehog.you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
I really hope they have a manual option, but S-Tronic (aka DSG) would be OK I guess. It wouldn't put me off the car entirely.
Worse case scenario though, as mentioned above, is that it turns out to be an RS5 with more load space!
As it seems the drivetrain will be the same lets hope they kept the RS5 chassis engineers away and gave the job to the same guys who set up the B7 RS4 ...
Worse case scenario though, as mentioned above, is that it turns out to be an RS5 with more load space!
As it seems the drivetrain will be the same lets hope they kept the RS5 chassis engineers away and gave the job to the same guys who set up the B7 RS4 ...
If you are buying a DSG type gearboxed car as an everyday car then fine but if you are wanting a fun car that you want to engage with and drive just for the sake of driving not getting from A to B then manual is better imo!
P.S I have had auto ,automated manuals and DSG and have gone back to manual and loving every gear change!
P.S I have had auto ,automated manuals and DSG and have gone back to manual and loving every gear change!
Dave Hedgehog said:
1930's that way =======>
you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
Well vinyl is actually superior to digital so while it has been sacrificed to "practical convenience" of smaller more durable CDs and players and inferior MP3 downloads,it doesn't make it better. People who assume newer = better often miss the point and are easily fooled into believing the hype to generate sales and corner a market.you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
Digital photography is plainly superior to film, I'll give you that and that is why 99.9% of people use digital cameras but I don't know any journalist who has claimed DSG is better than manual.
Dave Hedgehog said:
1930's that way =======>
you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
Oh I do apologise for having an opinion you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
I woul much prefer a manual gearbox in a performance car - automatic have their place, no doubt about it, but the RS4 is a rival for the M3 (which comes with a manual) and I find manuals more engaging than autos, which is what you want in a performance car, no?
If some people want an auto, fair enough, but if you are spending that much money on a performance car ou should at least be offered the option of a manual gearbox.
I wonder how many of these manual fans have actually driven a proper DSG/DCT car?
My old DCT equipped M3 was a great pleasure to drive, it did exactly what i wanted it to do when i wanted it, this is all nonsense about not being in control
Auto when you stuck in traffic or motorway and then manual control for when your on a B-Road, whats not to like?
My old DCT equipped M3 was a great pleasure to drive, it did exactly what i wanted it to do when i wanted it, this is all nonsense about not being in control
Auto when you stuck in traffic or motorway and then manual control for when your on a B-Road, whats not to like?
SD1992 said:
Dave Hedgehog said:
1930's that way =======>
you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
Oh I do apologise for having an opinion you will find vinyl records and 35mm film along the way
I woul much prefer a manual gearbox in a performance car - automatic have their place, no doubt about it, but the RS4 is a rival for the M3 (which comes with a manual) and I find manuals more engaging than autos, which is what you want in a performance car, no?
If some people want an auto, fair enough, but if you are spending that much money on a performance car ou should at least be offered the option of a manual gearbox.
Good News. The 'under the radar' approach of the B7 RS4 when compared to the M3 and AMG alternatives led me to writing a rather large cheque to Mr Audi last time round - even if the standard exhaust system was naff (sorted with a un-resonated Milltek which still makes my spine tingle thinking about it to this day).
In my (opinion) the B7 RS4 is one of the best performance cars of the last 10 years, but it pains me as to why Audi seem so inconsistent with their 'S' and 'RS' models. For starters, the new RS4 has the right engine up front (anything less would have been a wasted exercise). I am hoping that it will live up to the last RS4 (and hopefully be a bit better under heavy braking), but you never can tell with Audi. Fingers crossed - even if it will never be as handsome as the B7 variant.
Damm it, started looking at B7 RS4 Avant's in the classifieds........
In my (opinion) the B7 RS4 is one of the best performance cars of the last 10 years, but it pains me as to why Audi seem so inconsistent with their 'S' and 'RS' models. For starters, the new RS4 has the right engine up front (anything less would have been a wasted exercise). I am hoping that it will live up to the last RS4 (and hopefully be a bit better under heavy braking), but you never can tell with Audi. Fingers crossed - even if it will never be as handsome as the B7 variant.
Damm it, started looking at B7 RS4 Avant's in the classifieds........
topjay said:
Anyone else thinking it should have had a more modern engine with more power.
the german power war is over, i suspect. be glad it has a V8, at least. i think Audi's problem, however, is that it doesn't give it enough power to be much, if at all, faster than the M3 in a line, and judging by the RS5, they've got some work to do to make it drive better than the M3.they can't make it more powerful than the more expensive RS5 though really, can they?
edit....any excuse for a piccy - now with circa 80k on the clock. what's also interesting is the RS4 seems to have higher servicing costs than the M3. extended warranty is around £2k per year, the M3 is under £1k, replacement parts (e.g. discs + pads) seem more expensive too
Edited by E38Ross on Friday 3rd February 07:17
E38Ross said:
in fairness SD1992, i suspect you've not driven a car with a double clutch box. don't knock it 'til you've tried it. they are a far cry from old school autos. you do get to choose what gear you want to be in at any given point in time so you are in control. as engaging....well, that's personal preference but again, wait until you've tried one.
I did actually manage to swing a go in a newish Golf GTI with the DSG gearbox in it. It was very good - like you said did exactly what I told it, when I told it to do it. I am not disputing for a minute that they are good gearboxes, that is just wrong. I just feel like a manual with a clutch pedal gives a more engaging drive, maybe not as quick because an autobox can change gear faster than you can, but certainly a lot more fun in my opinion. As you may know from the barge thread, I am looking at buying an automatic car myself. I am not a member of the "all slushboxes are crap" brigade - I do see the appeal. However I don't think it is much to ask for Audi to at least give us the option. The last RS4 came in manual only, as so many sports cars and supercars (or at least as an option).
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