RE: PDK-only for next Porsche 911 GT3?
Discussion
When I went with a friend of mine to buy a Ferrari 360 I had a long chat with the proprietor of the dealers while my friend decided which seats he preferred (Daytona's). The guy told me that there was quite a price differential between F1 boxed cars and manuals with F1 boxes being far more sort after. It seems that residuals were adversly affected by having a manual box. He also told me he considered the F1 boxed cars (with latest software!!!) to be far nicer than manuals (he was a real ferrari fan not just a dealer).
Personally I'd choose PDK (if I could shop at this end of the market) as I'd want the quickest car avaialble for the track, but I don't get why porsche don't offer both. I thought that the way 911s were built pretty much allowed porsche to knock out a million and one different combinations on the same production line (racers built on same production line as road cars).
Personally I'd choose PDK (if I could shop at this end of the market) as I'd want the quickest car avaialble for the track, but I don't get why porsche don't offer both. I thought that the way 911s were built pretty much allowed porsche to knock out a million and one different combinations on the same production line (racers built on same production line as road cars).
E38Ross said:
Mr Whippy said:
juansolo said:
sob.gt3 said:
Management of Change "Despite the potential positive outcomes, change is nearly always resisted"
Purest thinking belongs to the 'Classic Car' mind set
Being the fastest drives Porsche to stay ahead of the pack, hence they must always make progress
PDK = Faster Lap Times
Move on, get over it (or buy a Classic).
If it was all about lap times there wouldn't be a 911. So marketing under the guise of tradition still counts. There still may be hope...Purest thinking belongs to the 'Classic Car' mind set
Being the fastest drives Porsche to stay ahead of the pack, hence they must always make progress
PDK = Faster Lap Times
Move on, get over it (or buy a Classic).
As a product the GT3 is now just turning into another premium £££ product in the Porsche line up, sold under the idea it's something special in increasing numbers to people who don't have a clue.
It's interesting that robot manuals have been around, and faster on track, for over a decade, yet Porsche choose to move to PDK only now for their fastest track car? A clear sign they are doing it for cheapness more than anything, and no doubt the slightly lower co2 bulls
t rating will help lower their fleet average!Dave
t there IMOExplain why it's taken Porsche so long to fit a track-fast gearbox to the GT3, when the tech has been around for several generations of GT3?
Dave
One thing I've never understood (and perhaps someone can enlighten me here) is why the GT3 is thought of as a track day only car and folks are bothered about it being as fast as possible.
Surely, for track use (and the roads there) there's not much can best something like an Ultima or a Radical SR3-SL ?
For £100k's-worth of GT3 I'd think about buying a Range Rover, trailer and an old Formula Renault car. Even after a couple of years of rebuilds that'd be cheaper, and massively, massively faster.
e.g. Formula Renault 2011 quali pole lap: 1:19, GT3 RS Cup: 1:44
Surely, for track use (and the roads there) there's not much can best something like an Ultima or a Radical SR3-SL ?
For £100k's-worth of GT3 I'd think about buying a Range Rover, trailer and an old Formula Renault car. Even after a couple of years of rebuilds that'd be cheaper, and massively, massively faster.
e.g. Formula Renault 2011 quali pole lap: 1:19, GT3 RS Cup: 1:44
Gorbyrev said:
There is an air of inevitability about this. Perhaps the discrepancy between the majority of us who cannot afford a GT3 and those who are actually able to spend in that league are voting with their left feet. It will be interesting to see what happens to the values of the much rarer manual F430 as years go by. The last bastion of 3 pedal Ferraridom. As for buying a classic, fair enough, but these are just 10 years away from becoming classics themselves. The eagerness of people of more modest means to pick them up has a direct effect on residuals, and thus, their desirability as a purchase in the first place.
I have a hunch that the last of the manual Ferraris i.e the 430 will hold their value over the long term better than the F1 equipped cars.I note that manual 575's are already at a premium over their F1 equipped counterparts the last one I saw for sale was 75k a considerable margin over the F1.
Is it not just a case of Porsche deciding what they want the GT3 to be?
If it is meant to be as fast as possible then PDK is the clear winner, it makes for a faster car.
If it is meant to give the most driver enjoyment then it has to be a manual, even if it is slower.
Given that GT3s (or derivatives of) are raced it, seems logical that it should have the fastest option. If you would prefer the feel of a manual then maybe it just isn't the 911 for you. Don't worry though, I'm sure there'll be a model to fill that niche announced next week...
If it is meant to be as fast as possible then PDK is the clear winner, it makes for a faster car.
If it is meant to give the most driver enjoyment then it has to be a manual, even if it is slower.
Given that GT3s (or derivatives of) are raced it, seems logical that it should have the fastest option. If you would prefer the feel of a manual then maybe it just isn't the 911 for you. Don't worry though, I'm sure there'll be a model to fill that niche announced next week...
Wills2 said:
I have a hunch that the last of the manual Ferraris i.e the 430 will hold their value over the long term better than the F1 equipped cars.
I note that manual 575's are already at a premium over their F1 equipped counterparts the last one I saw for sale was 75k a considerable margin over the F1.
I doubt it dealers don't want manual cars, and the F430 F1 box is about as good as it gets for a single unit.I note that manual 575's are already at a premium over their F1 equipped counterparts the last one I saw for sale was 75k a considerable margin over the F1.
mrdemon said:
Wills2 said:
I have a hunch that the last of the manual Ferraris i.e the 430 will hold their value over the long term better than the F1 equipped cars.
I note that manual 575's are already at a premium over their F1 equipped counterparts the last one I saw for sale was 75k a considerable margin over the F1.
I doubt it dealers don't want manual cars, and the F430 F1 box is about as good as it gets for a single unit.I note that manual 575's are already at a premium over their F1 equipped counterparts the last one I saw for sale was 75k a considerable margin over the F1.
khooni said:
Actually I think this is bks. They will offer a manual GT3.
It has already been engineered in the 991 so it should be easy to introduce.
It is the pricing I suggest that will shock the lot of you.
If I were Porsche, by offering a manual Gt3 I would have cornered the market for quality, reliable, manual supercars. There are always buyers for that. Why would I throw that away? I would raise the price of the Gt3 such that in standard it is PDK with a no cost option for manual. Then they can make outsized profits for those that insist on wanting a manual....
Since that target will always be there why not charge them for it.....
and still be hailed for saving the manual. WIN WIN
awesome
The probably don't want to offer both because it costs so much much to develop the car with two different boxes. For example, the traction control systems needs to be tailored individually for PDK and manual boxes. Would save them a lot of money only having the one option on what is a limited production range.ks. They will offer a manual GT3.It has already been engineered in the 991 so it should be easy to introduce.
It is the pricing I suggest that will shock the lot of you.
If I were Porsche, by offering a manual Gt3 I would have cornered the market for quality, reliable, manual supercars. There are always buyers for that. Why would I throw that away? I would raise the price of the Gt3 such that in standard it is PDK with a no cost option for manual. Then they can make outsized profits for those that insist on wanting a manual....
Since that target will always be there why not charge them for it.....
and still be hailed for saving the manual. WIN WIN
awesome
slipstream 1985 said:
"When we launched the 911 Turbo S, we did not offer a manual, but we have not had a single complaint,"
erm maybe because those that wanted a manual wouldn't buy it and bought something else?
Agreed as a few others have said, also I'd have though the buyer of a Turbo S is rather different to that of a GT3 / GT3 RS. Will be a shame if the GT3 looses to 'progress'.erm maybe because those that wanted a manual wouldn't buy it and bought something else?
Pretty telling stuff, but it would be a brave move to risk the wrath of manual-loving Porsche purists for the sake of a more populist 'box. Especially as both the new GT3 and GT2 will get the 991's electromechanical power steering set-up, which has been criticised by some for offering less 'feel'.
Apostrophy before 'box' Riggers? I know you are hot on grammar after your last sarcastic reply. Keep up the good work fella!
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