The cost of runing a Diesel.
Discussion
sider said:
As it's been said - i think it comes down to personal preference.
If i had the choice between paying £18k for a diesel Mondeo or £18k for a same-spec petrol Mondeo, I'd definately go for the diesel.
Sounds like others on here wouldn't and each to their own.
The only thing that would get me in a petrol car, particularly of that size was if, as commonly is the case, the petrol car was £15k against the diesel's £17-18k.
A diesel does everything i need it to at the moment and the diesel Insignia i had IMHO was more fun that the petrol Insignia - the petrol was absolutely gutless and was no fun to drive - painfully slow. Not that the diesel was great fun mind - it just went when i asked it to and did so using far less fuel that it's petrol powered equivalent.
For me, that was one of the reasons why I bought a petrol Ford S-Max as our new family bus. I paid nearly £5K less for a 1 year old 240bhp 2.0t model than the same age /spec / mileage 200bhp 2.2 diesel version. I also get a company fuel card so fuel costs aren't a factor. Come trade in time I might regret the decision but I’ve never been one to worry about what a car is worth a few years down the line. If i had the choice between paying £18k for a diesel Mondeo or £18k for a same-spec petrol Mondeo, I'd definately go for the diesel.
Sounds like others on here wouldn't and each to their own.
The only thing that would get me in a petrol car, particularly of that size was if, as commonly is the case, the petrol car was £15k against the diesel's £17-18k.
A diesel does everything i need it to at the moment and the diesel Insignia i had IMHO was more fun that the petrol Insignia - the petrol was absolutely gutless and was no fun to drive - painfully slow. Not that the diesel was great fun mind - it just went when i asked it to and did so using far less fuel that it's petrol powered equivalent.
You are not comparing like for like in the insignia. The diesel is a 2.o litre turbo- they make a 2.0 litre petrol turbo which produces an extra 50bhp and is quicker.
Back on topic in the past few months I have replaced the dmf,clutch+release bearing,slave cylinder on the mrs' TDI Golf the parts cost in excess of £500 (a bugger of a job with the car being a 4wd). Replaced the turbo on my Dads' diesel merc van (on its 3rd turbo now, first one went at 30000 miles- changed under warranty). Recon turbo cost £600. Did the labour myself otherwise the cost of these jobs would have beein in the thousands
Back on topic in the past few months I have replaced the dmf,clutch+release bearing,slave cylinder on the mrs' TDI Golf the parts cost in excess of £500 (a bugger of a job with the car being a 4wd). Replaced the turbo on my Dads' diesel merc van (on its 3rd turbo now, first one went at 30000 miles- changed under warranty). Recon turbo cost £600. Did the labour myself otherwise the cost of these jobs would have beein in the thousands
I'm running my first diesel, got a Golf GT TDI 150 about a year ago. I bought it for the commute, I do about 15k miles a year. I have to say it's been a very good car, I get high forties mpg (the book says 52mpg combined so not too far off) I've never had less than 45 out of a tank, and the only thing I've had to replace on it thus far is a tyre. I've DIY'ed the servicing which is easy, I like the way the oil filter is at the front and top of the engine bay.
The 150 is badged as a "GTI" (with a red "I") but I wouldn't call it sporty, though it's quick enough for general driving duties as a commuter. It suffers from quite a bit of turbo lag and the narrow power band took getting used to, just as well it's a six speed. The suspension is compliant for a supposed GTI, it rolls a fair bit when pressing on in corners though hangs on pretty well.
Based on my experiences with this I'd definately have another diesel as a daily. I find petrol engines nicer to drive but do quite enjoy hustling the diesel along.
The 150 is badged as a "GTI" (with a red "I") but I wouldn't call it sporty, though it's quick enough for general driving duties as a commuter. It suffers from quite a bit of turbo lag and the narrow power band took getting used to, just as well it's a six speed. The suspension is compliant for a supposed GTI, it rolls a fair bit when pressing on in corners though hangs on pretty well.
Based on my experiences with this I'd definately have another diesel as a daily. I find petrol engines nicer to drive but do quite enjoy hustling the diesel along.
dhariwab said:
You are not comparing like for like in the insignia. The diesel is a 2.o litre turbo- they make a 2.0 litre petrol turbo which produces an extra 50bhp and is quicker.
I had a 1.8 petrol insignia as a courtesy car and to be fair I have no idea what vauxhall were thinking. The car is way way too heavy for that engine and the wheels are far too big for the limited torque. Seriously it did 23mpg! no word of a lie and really poor acceleration. Getting back into the 1.8 petrol civic felt like a hot hatch in comparison and it does 30mpg urban cycle.stargazer30 said:
dhariwab said:
You are not comparing like for like in the insignia. The diesel is a 2.o litre turbo- they make a 2.0 litre petrol turbo which produces an extra 50bhp and is quicker.
I had a 1.8 petrol insignia as a courtesy car and to be fair I have no idea what vauxhall were thinking. The car is way way too heavy for that engine and the wheels are far too big for the limited torque. Seriously it did 23mpg! no word of a lie and really poor acceleration. Getting back into the 1.8 petrol civic felt like a hot hatch in comparison and it does 30mpg urban cycle.dhariwab said:
You are not comparing like for like in the insignia. The diesel is a 2.o litre turbo- they make a 2.0 litre petrol turbo which produces an extra 50bhp and is quicker.
But surely a 130 bhp 2.0 diesel SRI compared with a 120 bhp petrol SRI 1.8 is more a comparison than a 2.0 diesel against a 2.0T 'warm' saloon?When the Insignia petrol was dropped off at work, i had a quick look on the internet at specs etc and noted that all i knew about 'my' car was that it was petrol. Quick look online and i seem to remember all Insignia petrols are turbos apart from 1 model - which was the one i ended up with. Just had a look again but Vauxhall website doesnt appear to be working properly.
stargazer30 said:
I had a 1.8 petrol insignia as a courtesy car and to be fair I have no idea what vauxhall were thinking. The car is way way too heavy for that engine and the wheels are far too big for the limited torque. Seriously it did 23mpg! no word of a lie and really poor acceleration. Getting back into the 1.8 petrol civic felt like a hot hatch in comparison and it does 30mpg urban cycle.
I feel your pain. I found the same. I didn't want to as i liked the Insignia as a car and only got rid because the local milkman crashed into it and the hire company took it back to fix it. I really thought it was going to be a flying machine too.I drove from the Warrington area where i work, to Hinckley in Leicestershire, and back, then up to Kirkham near Preston, and back. All in all, cost me nearly £85 in re-filling before i returned it? Probably talking no more than 320 miles there.
Day before hire company swapped it - work to home and back, twice, because they delayed it a couple of days, 52 miles, cost me nearly £12 to replenish the fuel id used.
irish boy said:
Our md is completely anti diesel. Even our ford transits are petrol as are the 4x4's used by the mechanics for the heavy trailer work (patrol 4.2 and landcruiser 4.5 etc)
As a 21 yr old 'lad' I think its brilliant, but surely thats got to be a stupid business decision? Are they all LPG?R12HCO said:
As a 21 yr old 'lad' I think its brilliant, but surely thats got to be a stupid business decision? Are they all LPG?
Yep all LPG. The trannies come converted from the factory and the 4x4's and cars get done upon purchase. One of the reps insisted on a diesel, since it was him only driving he was allowed...it's the only one on the fleet which is always in the garage for something (passat...out of warranty now). Current problem is diesel pouring out of the filter housing. Don't think anyone will be allowed diesel again even if it is them only driving.
Vladimir said:
I'd also choose the petrol as the diesel is a bit average and prone to killing clutches.
They have a faulty pressure plate self adjuster which can fail and cause the clutch to slip but my dealer told me this part has now been upgraded. I had mine replaced and it's been fine since. Many others on Civinfo have had the same experience.
But apart from that, the 2.2 is a reliable motor. Much more reliable than the Ford TDCi and Volkswagen TDi company cars we have anyway.
1bhp said:
I have a 120d 177bhp/350nm does 40mpg no matter how hard i drive it and 45-50mpg on a run....Show me some 177bhp petrol engines that will do that and ill consider changing my daily car.
True enough there.Mine is originally the 163 without a map now it's more like 198bhp and the torque about 400 or something.This morning and because since changing jobs my mileage has dropped dramatically* I do long runs home once or twice a week and once the engine is warmed up nicely hit the twisty bits.
I reset the MPG comp from leaving work,warmed up through town,few miles at 80 ish on the dual and then nailed it in the twisty bits.Got close to where I live and then wind it down to a more sedate pace.
Still managed 38mpg
- It will be my last diesel,it's been fun and has always felt pretty quick when I spent some 5 and a bit years using a 300tdi 90 as my toy and daily drive.It will only be my last diesel because with my mileage dropping since changing jobs I will kill a DPF.No doubt about it.
1bhp said:
I have a 120d 177bhp/350nm does 40mpg no matter how hard i drive it and 45-50mpg on a run....Show me some 177bhp petrol engines that will do that and ill consider changing my daily car.
I can't show you a petrol engine that does that because it doesn't exist. I can show you a 220bhp petrol engine with the same displacement as your diesel, that sounds infinitely nicer, runs more smoothly, is still pulling hard at 7000 RPM, has almost as much torque as the 120D and still delivers 30mpg with ease. However if you are fixated only on economy none of these things will matter to you.Mr2Mike said:
I can't show you a petrol engine that does that because it doesn't exist. I can show you a 220bhp petrol engine with the same displacement as your diesel, that sounds infinitely nicer, runs more smoothly, is still pulling hard at 7000 RPM, has almost as much torque as the 120D and still delivers 30mpg with ease. However if you are fixated only on economy none of these things will matter to you.
show me then? As i said in my previous post i also have a saab 9-5 aero which returns 23mpg the way i drive it so im not just fixated on mpg. the 120d will do double that i do 30k a year without touching a motorway.Also the 120d in the real world is just as quick as the saab.The saab only comes into its own when you are WELL above legal speed limits, 95% if my driving is on roads limited to 30-40mph while sticking to the speed limit the extra power from the saab is simply not used, frosted said:
My 08 vw passat is on 100k and on original DMF ,DPF and till a month ago original injectors, car lives in london with short journeys only . Vw did tell me they will change the injectors for free and I took em up on that offer .
Anyone else spot the problem with this post?Mr2Mike said:
I can't show you a petrol engine that does that because it doesn't exist. I can show you a 220bhp petrol engine with the same displacement as your diesel, that sounds infinitely nicer, runs more smoothly, is still pulling hard at 7000 RPM, has almost as much torque as the 120D and still delivers 30mpg with ease. However if you are fixated only on economy none of these things will matter to you.
Ahh yes - the Fiat Coupe; giant killer of all time. Aren't Fiat silly for not continuing with this engine? It sounds like the perfect two litre to me...The reality - it sounds rough, it's unreliable, driving it with any gusto returns low 20s, the car torque steers so badly it's funny and if that doesn't fling you into a hedge, the bits that fall off will. The 120d is RWD, balanced, as quick/quicker with a simple remap, well made and a far far better ownership proposition.
However if you are fixated on a car that's good to drive, none of this will matter to you...
A mate had three Fiat Coupes and I thought they were grim. Took him a long time to realise the same.
Vladimir said:
Mr2Mike said:
I can't show you a petrol engine that does that because it doesn't exist. I can show you a 220bhp petrol engine with the same displacement as your diesel, that sounds infinitely nicer, runs more smoothly, is still pulling hard at 7000 RPM, has almost as much torque as the 120D and still delivers 30mpg with ease. However if you are fixated only on economy none of these things will matter to you.
Ahh yes - the Fiat Coupe; giant killer of all time. Aren't Fiat silly for not continuing with this engine? It sounds like the perfect two litre to me...The reality - it sounds rough, it's unreliable, driving it with any gusto returns low 20s, the car torque steers so badly it's funny and if that doesn't fling you into a hedge, the bits that fall off will. The 120d is RWD, balanced, as quick/quicker with a simple remap, well made and a far far better ownership proposition.
Actually, it doesn't, it weighs a ton and a half. For the smallest car in the BMW range. Insanity.
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