RE: Blood Brothers: Mazda 3 MPS vs Ford Focus ST

[rb5er]

CrammyJay said:

rb5er said:

I averaged 26mpg in mine. Great car, and with a remap its better than the mps in every conceivable way. (obviously the remap irons out the mps's only advantage)

Please explain how it's better in every way or is that just your opinion. Have you actually driven both cars extensively?

I drove a mountune st for only a week and whilst it seemed ok I would say it definitely would not out drag or out handle a mk2 mps. The mpg was slightly worse in the st. Looks wise is down to personal taste, I would have preferred to get a mk1 mps over the mk2 but the wife put the blockers on it. I like the interior on the mps better, although that maybe down to me driving an orange st with those awful orange seats. And all the kit you get as standard is a big plus for the Mazda.o

I would have bought the new focus rs though if it had kept the looks of the st.

Yes driven both cars lots thanks. Owned a focus st for 2 years and a mate had an mps which i drove on many an occasion. Not just my opinion but that of every road test at the time of release by every motoring, journo in every motoring magazine.

Handles better, as per every review. (very playful rear end when you are in the mood)
Nicer interior, subjective so my opinion, but certainly some if the best seats in any car.(st3)
Better steering, much better.
Looks better, again subjective.
Sounds better, much better.
But yes its a bit slower as standard.

[CrammyJay]

You sound like all the other sheep who follow and quote everything the journos write. Vw is the king, fords are fantastic, everything else is rubbish

[Froomee]

Had a Mountune ST until 6 weeks ago, covered 20k miles in just under two years and it was a great car.

Lovely engine, comfortable, fast enough and you could fit a kingside mattress in with the seats folded down.

Only downsides were the front end was slightly heavy over speed humps and fuel consumption although sitting in boost probably didn't help

I paid £16.1k new and £999 for the Mountune upgrade through the owners club and for that money and 4.9% finance I could honestly not have found a better car. First service was free and two front tyres cost £180 which was the only cost I had during the two years.

Would definitely recommend one, I only sold as I want more power,rwd and a two seater as I need to break the cycle of owning hot hatches. Highly recommended especially with the mountune kit.

[rb5er]

CrammyJay said:

You sound like all the other sheep who follow and quote everything the journos write. Vw is the king, fords are fantastic, everything else is rubbish

Ok, everyone (it really was every one) who test drives cars for a living are wrong and you are right.

You asked me the question and i answered you fully. Then you resort to well yeh everyone are sheep, great reasoning.

I drove the ctr, golf gti, r26, vxr and a mates mps before opting for the focus which i preferred to all of them.

And for me most VW's are far from king.

Shattered your pathetic sheep argument enough yet?

Edited by rb5er on Thursday 5th April 09:31

[danneth]

rb5er said:

Yes driven both cars lots thanks. Owned a focus st for 2 years and a mate had an mps which i drove on many an occasion. Not just my opinion but that of every road test at the time of release by every motoring, journo in every motoring magazine.

Handles better, as per every review. (very playful rear end when you are in the mood)
Nicer interior, subjective so my opinion, but certainly some if the best seats in any car.(st3)
Better steering, much better.
Looks better, again subjective.
Sounds better, much better.
But yes its a bit slower as standard.

Abit slower? its alot slower.

Which reviews did you read of the mps/ms3 ?

[FWDRacer]

One has 5-cylinders and sounds like a baby Quattro. The other doesn't.

I know this may sound a bit pathetic to some - but irrespective of what the car does at 10/10th's (on the road??) I'd be enjoying the glorious warble a lot more at 7/10th's, ie most of the time.

Can't get on with the Mazda's looks either - I'm sure it is a great car. As for the Focus, well I can't get on with the Orange warpaint either - something much more toned down required - love Panther Black 3 doors.

[muppet42]

simundo777 said:

To be fair, its 100bhp down on the Mazda, its not even in the same league performance wise. Its a warm hatch at best where as the Ford (especially with the mountune map) and the Mazda are seriously hot hatches.

90hp down in standard trim but that's me being pedantic I think it's more the default anti-Fiat/Stilo sentiment that disappointed me, knocking something for the sake of knocking it. The Stilo in Schui GP form's a seriously underrated car and with a decent exhaust and a remap it'll have 200hp - for the cost I personally think it's still worthy of consideration albeit a left field one. Just don't go near a dealer for servicing if you get one...

[loomx]

Focus sounds better with 5 cylinders, and has less power, yes you could remap it, but then you could also remap the MPS so that’s a non argument.

Saying that not having a LSD makes no difference is just silly, especially when you just said it makes a difference on the higher power cars. If it works well in them, it certainly isn’t going to be a bad thing in a car with 225bhp, in fact it will still make a huge difference. Basically, can you make it wheel spin... Yes? (No? Try turning of traction control.) well then it'll make a difference.

It’s a tough decision, I would want the Focus simply because it’s got a 5 cylinder engine and sounds fantastic. But I would want the Mazda, because from the spec at least, it sound like it would be a better drivers car, with a stiffer chassis and LSD.

[oj121]

muppet42 said:

90hp down in standard trim but that's me being pedantic I think it's more the default anti-Fiat/Stilo sentiment that disappointed me, knocking something for the sake of knocking it. The Stilo in Schui GP form's a seriously underrated car and with a decent exhaust and a remap it'll have 200hp - for the cost I personally think it's still worthy of consideration albeit a left field one. Just don't go near a dealer for servicing if you get one...

Plus its right up there in the platform share arguement right?

[muppet42]

oj121 said:

Plus its right up there in the platform share arguement right?

I was sure it had Focus bits in it, right? And technically, the Stilo does share components with the 147 so in a roundabout way it's relevant to the subject matter of platform sharing alongside it being a cheap hot hatch alternative

[oj121]

But the question was MPS or ST as they are genetically so similar.
Pork Chop or Belly................Ill have an apple right?

[muppet42]

oj121 said:

But the question was MPS or ST as they are genetically so similar.
Pork Chop or Belly................Ill have an apple right?

I realise that, my previous post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek. My original argument was down to the chap who brought up the GP as an alternative and was immediately flamed on his choice of motor purely based on the fact it was a Stilo not that it wasn't relevant to the subject matter.

Anyway...

[tommy vercetti]

I like both cars, but I'd choose the Focus. Looks better and has a bigger repuatation. Would have it in blue or red though, orange is a bit too sensitive on the eyes.

[soad]

ST out of those two for me. Maybe in blue though.

[rb5er]

danneth said:

Abit slower? its alot slower.

Which reviews did you read of the mps/ms3 ?

Alot slower? Less than a second to 100mph, now try counting that one second....done?.....was that a long time? http://www.fastestlaps.com/comparisons/mazda_3_mps...

I read a lot of reviews, every single one had the focus ahead. There were so many it would be much easier if you could show me one or two that gave a contrary opinion.

Edited by rb5er on Thursday 5th April 14:47

[Grovsie26]

rb5er said:

Alot slower? Less than a second to 100mph, now try counting that one second....done?.....was that a long time? http://www.fastestlaps.com/comparisons/mazda_3_mps...

I read a lot of reviews, every single one had the focus ahead. There were so many it would be much easier if you could show me one or two that gave a contrary opinion.

Edited by rb5er on Thursday 5th April 14:47

You do realise who your talking to mate. I wouldn't even bother arguing any point against a mps with danneth. The guy has his, rammed so far up his ass, the st sound it makes comes out of his mouth.

[tommy vercetti]

Grovsie26 said:

rb5er said:

Alot slower? Less than a second to 100mph, now try counting that one second....done?.....was that a long time? http://www.fastestlaps.com/comparisons/mazda_3_mps...

I read a lot of reviews, every single one had the focus ahead. There were so many it would be much easier if you could show me one or two that gave a contrary opinion.

Edited by rb5er on Thursday 5th April 14:47

You do realise who your talking to mate. I wouldn't even bother arguing any point against a mps with danneth. The guy has his, rammed so far up his ass, the st sound it makes comes out of his mouth.

Lmfao

[danneth]

rb5er said:

Alot slower? Less than a second to 100mph, now try counting that one second....done?.....was that a long time? http://www.fastestlaps.com/comparisons/mazda_3_mps...

I read a lot of reviews, every single one had the focus ahead. There were so many it would be much easier if you could show me one or two that gave a contrary opinion.

Edited by rb5er on Thursday 5th April 14:47

I wouldn't go to much on what fastest laps says, as the picture i posted shows ive spent alot of time with both cars in the real world and there leagues apart, if you also read the ST mountune vs a standard mps can you remember the figures? weren't they about the same thats with the ST being mapped, so what would happen when it was standard?

but if we are posting sites - http://www.zeperfs.com/en/duel1328-1388.htm

I asked you what reviews you had read thats all? if you could post them wouldn't mind taking a look at them, you see so many reviews bout the MPS all contradict each other the best thing you can do is actually own one and get to know the car, if you look at the reviews for instance from the states where the MS3 is massive over there then the reviews are very different.

[danneth]

Grovsie26 said:

You do realise who your talking to mate. I wouldn't even bother arguing any point against a mps with danneth. The guy has his, rammed so far up his ass, the st sound it makes comes out of his mouth.

Are you still stalking me and the MPS threads, your strange.

Can you tell us Grov how many MPS's have you owned?

You can argue any point with me if its correct then i will say it is simple, you seem to think i make out the MPS is something else when i don't, feel free to back it up with some actual proof though ( as i always do ) until, surely you have better things to do?

[superman84]

356Speedster said:

superman84 said:

Keepin telling yourself that It's not just in the snow though. A well set up awd will have much better traction being a big benefit in the wet, on dodgy uk roads and means you can put all the power down without any fuss and are less understeer. Fwd can be ok but in bigger powered cars in awd is much better unless your only into rolling races in a straight line on a smooth dry road.

Sure awd adds weight but that wouldn't be a problem of the focus wasn't so lardy to start off with.

Yes in the worst conditions there will be an advantage, but as I've said, with a properly setup chassis, 4WD is not a must have at all. In the wet, if I get to the point with either wifey's ST or my RS are out of grip and needing 4WD, then I'd be going dangerously too fast for the road.

My point is only that 4WD is not the necessity that people think it is and that with modern engineering, there's a lot that can be done with chassis setup. A few PH'ers have asked for a run in my RS as they didn't believe it would "work" and all have left amazed at how it can put 360bhp to the road so effectively through "only" 2 wheels. Including 2 Audi RS4 owning friends who always wondered how the Focus has always remained toe-to-toe with them

Have owned cars with all manner of drivetrains (inc a very wayward 250bhp Golf G60), I never thought that the ST would work when I first drove it. Now, 60,000 miles and a remap later, it's the reason I rushed out to get the RS. The only weather that defeats the cars is ice / snow, but for the 3 days a yers that that's a problem, it's really not even worth a second thought.

If you've spent a good amount of time with an ST and don't like it, that's fine. If you prefer the feel of 4WD, again, that's fine, it's all personal choice. But to say that it needs all wheel drive is I'm afraid incorrect.

Fwd is perfectly capable for most things and I'm sure a 360bhp focus is very quick rolling on a perfect straight road but it'd be much better in the twisties if it had a proper awd system with an active diff which would be able to put all those horses down properly. You can do all sorts of fancy things with fwd to improve traction, under steer and torque steer but ultimately you can't change the laws of physics.