RE: SOTW: Seat Leon 20VT

[trackerjack]

Welshbeef said:

Good job you don't drive an Audi else you'd be a wker who likes to be really close up behind..... Mmm

Yes indeed you have a point the Seat owner lives in a street and the Audi owner lives in a road. An Audi is what the Seat owner would get when it gets enough money. (same animal different wallet size)
They both are often the road hog though.

[KM666]

only1ian said:

redgriff500 said:

MORE power was required not less !

Also the 180 can be remapped to 210bhp for £200ish.

Why have a cupra over a rover... Audi interior... VW engine. Q-car looks rather than halfords parts bin ram raid special!

Why have a Rover over a Cupra.... Its not based on a mk4 golf. I'm sure the interior is very 'soft touch' and doesnt make much noise, they look subtle yes, but then mk4 golf underpinnings are hardly anything to shout about... They half polished the turd, but never got the final shine just so.

Edited by KM666 on Saturday 14th April 18:39

[Emeye]

KM666 said:

Why have a Rover over a Cupra.... Its not based on a mk4 golf. I'm sure the interior is very 'soft touch' and doesnt make much noise, they look subtle yes, but then mk4 golf underpinnings are hardly anything to shout about... They half polished the turd, but never got the final shine just so.

Edited by KM666 on Saturday 14th April 18:39

Which Rover are you comparing this to? Most Rover/MGs, apart from the ZT were old Hondas badly put together.

[KM666]

Emeye said:

KM666 said:

Why have a Rover over a Cupra.... Its not based on a mk4 golf. I'm sure the interior is very 'soft touch' and doesnt make much noise, they look subtle yes, but then mk4 golf underpinnings are hardly anything to shout about... They half polished the turd, but never got the final shine just so.

Edited by KM666 on Saturday 14th April 18:39

Which Rover are you comparing this to? Most Rover/MGs, apart from the ZT were old Hondas badly put together.

2nd comment on page 4 suggests the MG ZS 180, which is what only1ian and redgriff500 were discussing. IIRC they are based heavily on the 6th gen Honda Civic. I dont think build quality should be a primary argument when discussing anything mk4 golf based. As previously stated by owners they leak like french cars with sunroofs used to.

[jetskiadam]

Miss mine a lot, it was the fully loaded earliest cupra special edition with memory leather seats, power fold mirrors etc. List price IIRC was just over 18k new and not a lot else at that time was specced so highly for the money, certainly not the mk4 golf. The only car I've owned that I would happily have again, despite it's air flow meter eating habbits. I had the REVO software trial fitted to take it to 210bhp for a day and it transformed it to a different animal completely, but scared my wife stupid...as previously mentioned I hated the 16" standard wheels, if only because they were a bugger to keep clean.

[Emeye]

jetskiadam said:

Miss mine a lot, it was the fully loaded earliest cupra special edition with memory leather seats, power fold mirrors etc. List price IIRC was just over 18k new and not a lot else at that time was specced so highly for the money, certainly not the mk4 golf. The only car I've owned that I would happily have again, despite it's air flow meter eating habbits. I had the REVO software trial fitted to take it to 210bhp for a day and it transformed it to a different animal completely, but scared my wife stupid...as previously mentioned I hated the 16" standard wheels, if only because they were a bugger to keep clean.

That has got to be the ultimate Q-car.

[morgrp]

Nice car but that one clearly needs at least a few hundred quid spent on it - the door leaks are a nightmare and quite a lot of time consuming work to put right.

Interesting the mk4 golf is continually slagged off for not being a good hot hatch. 1.8t version was and still is a good car. Nearly every review in the day made it group test winner or put it in the top 3. People forget what makes a good hot hatch, decent performance plus everyday subtlety and usability. If its a tinny st box ala Renault Clio 182 it becomes very wearing to own in everyday use. Sure the Renault would be more fun round a track, but for the other 99% of the time where you just want a decent, well made, quick, practical car - the mk4 gti is a good choice

I think Clarkson sums it up well in this test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHW9yqdlKhg&fea...

[NGK210]

morgrp said:

Nice car but that one clearly needs at least a few hundred quid spent on it - the door leaks are a nightmare and quite a lot of time consuming work to put right.

Interesting the mk4 golf is continually slagged off for not being a good hot hatch. 1.8t version was and still is a good car. Nearly every review in the day made it group test winner or put it in the top 3. People forget what makes a good hot hatch, decent performance plus everyday subtlety and usability. If its a tinny st box ala Renault Clio 182 it becomes very wearing to own in everyday use. Sure the Renault would be more fun round a track, but for the other 99% of the time where you just want a decent, well made, quick, practical car - the mk4 gti is a good choice

I think Clarkson sums it up well in this test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHW9yqdlKhg&fea...

Apart from the Golf 4's higher grade cabin materials, the Leon matches the VW's build quality. And the Leon is quicker (+30bhp) and has better handling/grip, and it's a more civilised motorway cruiser because it has a 6-speed 'box (90 = 3500rpm in 6th) while the Golf had a 5-speeder (90 = 3900rpm in 5th, IIRC).

And the "nightmare" door leaks are common to both cars, because they share the same doors and dumb drainage 'design'.

Edited by NGK210 on Sunday 15th April 13:20

Edited by NGK210 on Sunday 15th April 13:20

[morgrp]

NGK210 said:

Apart from the Golf 4's higher grade cabin materials, the Leon matches the VW's build quality. And the Leon is quicker (+30bhp) and has better handling/grip, and it's a more civilised motorway cruiser because it has a 6-speed 'box (90 = 3500rpm in 6th) while the Golf had a 5-speeder (90 = 3900rpm in 5th, IIRC).

And the "nightmare" door leaks are common to both cars, because they share the same doors and dumb drainage 'design'.

Edited by NGK210 on Sunday 15th April 13:20

Edited by NGK210 on Sunday 15th April 13:20

I'm not saying the golf is better and to be honest if I were buying I'd have a Leon vt or octavia VRS - I was trying to make the point that the VAG group mk4 golf based cars are all written off as "too soft" to be a true gti - really my point is I think they are a good choice because they are softer set up and more liveable day to day -
Infact, at the moment, Mrs Morgrp is currently considering an 05 plate mk1 Leon FR tdi to replace her T5 now that she has rejected the offer of a cOmpany car but still needs an oil burner.
Certainly the interior on the mk1 Leon is much nicer than the current model

[KM666]

morgrp said:

I think Clarkson sums it up well in this test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHW9yqdlKhg&fea...

On the subject of Clarkson, here he describes a mk5 Ford Escort as being limousine like...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eB9ei46O1Ok

[Matt_N]

VWAUDI said:

I personally don't think that a boost leak means the engine is unreliable. If you ensure that all pipework is secured properly with clips that are strong enough it's not an issue.

Toruble is, the boost and vacuum leaks do make the engine unreliable as it always goes into limp mode or doesn't deliver the full goods.

The problems I had were split hoses, sensors failing, brittle plastics etc.

[NGK210]

morgrp said:

NGK210 said:

Apart from the Golf 4's higher grade cabin materials, the Leon matches the VW's build quality. And the Leon is quicker (+30bhp) and has better handling/grip, and it's a more civilised motorway cruiser because it has a 6-speed 'box (90 = 3500rpm in 6th) while the Golf had a 5-speeder (90 = 3900rpm in 5th, IIRC).

And the "nightmare" door leaks are common to both cars, because they share the same doors and dumb drainage 'design'.

Edited by NGK210 on Sunday 15th April 13:20

Edited by NGK210 on Sunday 15th April 13:20

I'm not saying the golf is better and to be honest if I were buying I'd have a Leon vt or octavia VRS - I was trying to make the point that the VAG group mk4 golf based cars are all written off as "too soft" to be a true gti - really my point is I think they are a good choice because they are softer set up and more liveable day to day -
Infact, at the moment, Mrs Morgrp is currently considering an 05 plate mk1 Leon FR tdi to replace her T5 now that she has rejected the offer of a cOmpany car but still needs an oil burner.
Certainly the interior on the mk1 Leon is much nicer than the current model

Ah... see what you mean, now... fair enough...

[LocoBlade]

I had two including a facelift model from new in 2003 which I chose over a Mk1 Civic Type R because it was a lot more useable day to day, and then I got another off a mate as a cheap runaround a few years back almost exactly like the one in the OP, which I got rid of about 3 years ago. Overall they're a cracking car for the money although like any VAG of that era, are almost guaranteed to suffer the annoying "they all do that" faults like window winder mechanisms breaking, MAFs failing and the door leaks.

If you buy a yellow one though carefully check the paint on the upper surfaces (that get direct sunlight) as the lacquer has a tendancy to start lifting then peeling in some cases. Mine was only a few flecks when I first got it but got so bad in the end that I bit the bullet and stripped the lacquer off of the entire bonnet, roof and most of the flanks with a hosepipe (not even a pressure washer) just so it didnt look like it had Dermatitis!

Here's the vid of the lacquer falling off! http://youtu.be/e3U9Ss35atQ

Edited by LocoBlade on Monday 16th April 10:21

[VolvoT5]

morgrp said:

Nice car but that one clearly needs at least a few hundred quid spent on it - the door leaks are a nightmare and quite a lot of time consuming work to put right.

Interesting the mk4 golf is continually slagged off for not being a good hot hatch. 1.8t version was and still is a good car.

Having driven both a Leon and a Golf I feel the Leon is the nice drive; steering actually feels connected to the car and it doens't corner like a bowl of jelly.

Door leaks are common across the platform and not difficult to fix. Any leaks in the passenger footwell would also most likely be coming from the pollen filter, not the door seals.

[Skii]

Had a 20VT and ran it for 3 years, no complaints, as previously said the wheels are a bugger to wash so I replaced them with a bargain set of facelift wheels.



Traded it in for the Tdi version a few years ago

[Limpet]

These engines go on forever. My missus was running around in a 1999 Golf GTI 1.8T until last year. 150,000 miles and still smooth, sweet and oil tight. We'd had it 3 years. Just needed a throttle body clean and adapt (via VAG-COM) to cure a slightly lumpy idle, and I put a cam belt and water pump on it as a precaution as it was just slightly overdue when I bought it. The only other thing was a vague gearchange, which some tinkering with the linkage adjustment cured. Never let us down or failed to start, did 40 mpg on the motorway as long as you stayed under 85 leptons, and although no ball of fire, was a lot more fun to drive than the reports ever gave it credit for.