RE: Tell me I'm wrong: Aston Martin V12 Vantage

[Dan Trent]

Pugsey said:

Dan. Sorry if I appear to be 'Dan bashing' by the way. I'm not. Just expressing my views on this one article you've written.

Not at all! Clue's in the heading for the piece after all!

And for those wanting a little more on the circumstances of the off it was just one of those weird collisions of circumstance on the way home from a day of, cough, spirited driving in a number of cars. And if I was due an off there'd been plenty of opportunities for Karma to come a knocking earlier in the day so the fact it happened when bimbling home was even more weird.

Yes, the stability control did go on the blink. No idea why but lots of colourful lights on the dash and a more measured pace because of it. There was a little bridge and an evil, violent little compression just after and my sense is that the lack of suspension travel, stiff springs and the tyres all conspired together and even though it was on a trailing throttle and at around 30-40mph tops off I went.

Sorry to disappoint those hoping for a hack trying to do a big skid and ending up in the rough scenario but there it is! Boringly mundane, very slow and disturbingly quiet and I faced a long, wet walk back to the road wondering what the hell had just happened. There was no warning, no chance for a dab of oppo - one minute I was on the road, the next I wasn't and the chap following who saw it all unfold was as perplexed as me. One of those events that 99% of the time would be a twitch and flash of a yellow light on the dash and you'd think nothing of it. But because, for whatever reason, the stability control was on the blink it became rather more.

Very, very lucky though. Any number of rather more expensive and painful scenarios could have resulted.

Like I say, I was coming round to this opinion anyway. But this did kind of seal the deal and have me in mind that, stripped of the electronic safety nets and in a situation where I was tired, minding my own business and just bimbling along it bit me hard.

Like I say, I didn't actually need to include the going off the road anecdote to make the point of the story but I thought you'd all enjoy having a bit of a chuckle at my ineptitude! I love the idea that everyone in the business is a driving god 24-7, 365 too. If only!

Edited by Dan Trent on Friday 27th April 16:32

[Wills2]

Vantagefan said:

Sitting in any Aston you see the stitch line down the dashboard isn't 100% straight, why?, because a person guided that join through a sewing machine.

Yes I noticed that too, but Porsche manage to get the stitching straight in the 911 and they do it by hand as well, their ESP also works and doesn't just shut down mid bend.

Things like that put me off Astons, it's not characterful it's just plain shoddy.

I still love to look at and listen to them, but would never buy one as I too haven't got the balls.

[Zod]

Dave Hedgehog said:

E38Ross said:

I'd rather it without the bonnet vents, other than that I love it.

likewise, its a beautiful car with a stunning V12, it does not need the vents

Feel the air coming out of the vents after even a relatively short drive. It definitely needs them.

[Chris Harris]

Pugsey said:

Yep. Hated then so much it nearly stopped us buying our car in fact. Dealer found some alternatives, fortunately.

So you have a V12V on dignified wheels? I'd love to see a pic of that.

[Pugsey]

Chris Harris said:

Pugsey said:

Yep. Hated then so much it nearly stopped us buying our car in fact. Dealer found some alternatives, fortunately.

So you have a V12V on dignified wheels? I'd love to see a pic of that.

Techno numpty here - you'll see in a squillion or so posts I've only ever posted one pic I think (of my 1M) and that was handled by a nephew (!) who happened to be around when someone else posted a pic of my car on the motorway which we felt deserved a response. However, will try to remember to take pic and attempt to join 21st century! I'll try to dig out make/type of wheel too.

Edited by Pugsey on Friday 27th April 16:54

[MartyAM]

No, your not wrong. I've owned this car and 2 DBS manual coupes (and a few more modern AMs). Managed to conclude nice cars to look at, sit in, and listen to. Not great cars to drive. A basic Carerra 2 is far better to drive, and that's before we get to things like R8s. Of course it's not 100% about the drive - but it certainly cost me a few pounds to reach this expensive conclusion.

Still admire them when they drive past though.

[Caractacus]

Dan - nice article Good on you for being so self deprecating, also

I've not had the pleasure of either the V8 or V12 from the drivers seat. You jammy sod.

Anyway, where did your 'off' occur? I live in the middle of nowhere in Wales and would love to go pop a marker post beside your tracks in the bog/heather say "Dan did this"

Cheers,

C.

[magic_marker]

Dear Dan,

The V12 Vantage is that - ever rarer - outrageous car whose function it is to rip your face off; and THAT, after all, is the original Aston Vantage spirit and I'll applaud Aston for building it until my arms are red, bloody stumps.

Not for some the coddling world of nanny electronics where ever-greater numbers are squeezed out and then clinically straight-jacketed onto the road (new M5, Mclaren MP4-CDEFG), no! They'd rather something they're grateful has chosen not to kill them on every safe arrival.

This is why one would pick a Merc C63 (/ insert favourite) over an undeniably more accomplished rival BMW M3 (/ insert favourite); because it'll put a bloody great big grin on your face every time you step into it - and likely a bloody nose too; a car with hair on its balls, not shaved and polished for that extra nanosecond gained by aerodynamic smoothness

And why this masochism, you might ask? The answer is simple; for when one has truly learnt the measure of a Beast, in terms of sheer and unadulterated driving pleasure there are few equals.

Edited by magic_marker on Friday 27th April 17:14

[Vantagefan]

Wills2 said:

Yes I noticed that too, but Porsche manage to get the stitching straight in the 911 and they do it by hand as well, their ESP also works and doesn't just shut down mid bend.

Things like that put me off Astons, it's not characterful it's just plain shoddy.

I still love to look at and listen to them, but would never buy one as I too haven't got the balls.

I've never had ESP shut off on me mid bend, but I have had a Mercedes SLS's dashboard lights cut out briefly.I also remember being in an SLK and having the roll bars deploy (like a gun shot going off behind my head!) when I took a hill too quickly. However, I don't assume that all SLS's/SLK's have electrical problems because of it.

The stitching not being straight isn't a lack of skill, more a reminder of the personal touch. Some will want everything to be perfectly in line with no deviance from the straight and narrow, others want their car to be different to the next one off the line in the areas that do not affect reliability. Saying that though nothing is built perfectly, not even Porsches,

[BusaMK]

Having driven the V8 vantage I couldnt disagree more, sorry.

I was really shocked by its lack of pace and handling compared to a V8 BMW M3, or even a 550 maranello. It just didn't feel quick or focused enough, which is just what the V12 vantage I hope should be, I'd love to drive one.

Maybe the V8 vantage just didn't suit me, but let's face it, anyone who says the V8 vantage is a quick car needs
to get out more and see what they're missing. Were you really being serious Dan!?

[Dagnut]

So many motoring journalist haven't had an off?

Got to part of the territory...can't compare to the average owner as the average owner probably spends 5% of their driving time in the car anywhere near the limit..someone testing the car is obviously pushing it for a higher percentage of that time is less familiar ..situations don't compare...
You buy a new car you will slowly build up your report with it..get used to how it behaves blah blah blah state the bleeding obvious..but the point is apart from a racer who spends more time at the limit?

[UH-Matt]

NAIL ON HEAD.

After test driving one of these last year I was left with exactly the same feeling as this review.

Went back to a F430, much much much much much better for the same money. Yes please.

[DLovett]

Odd how the lead in to your criticism is pointing out that Clarkson enjoys the car.

He might be a silly entertainment show presenter milking a cashcow these days, but he began his rather impressive career as a hack writer, much like your self.

He has a huge reference frame and is clearly an sbove average driver.

What exactly makes his opinion worthless, or worse, contradicted by default?

[DLovett]

Dagnut said:

So many motoring journalist haven't had an off?

I agree. I spun a new shape 118i when I hit a patch of grass. Ayrton Senna once reversed his 911 in to a wall.

Everyone makes mistakes, that's not the point.

[digitalrurouni]

I don't think there is anything wrong with the article. It is his opinion and he can express it. I think people in the forum are overreacting a little bit. I definitely believe there is a sweet spot for cars. I think driving a Zonda 760 PS would be too much as a daily driver. If it was raining and if it was cold, there is no way I would take a Zonda if I had one out in that weather because that is just inviting trouble. Now my daily driver is an E9x M3. I have had some scares in that thing in the wet but always somehow managed it. But do I believe it could bite me in the ass one day when I least expect it? Sure do. I agree with the spirit of the article. Sometimes 420 hp is more than 517 hp

[ghibbett]

Up until recently I worked at AM and had the pleasure over the course of 9 years of driving most of their line up from DB7 to Rapide, including V12V.

I and my colleagues all 100% believe that the V12V is the best car AML makes (ok maybe not from a quality standpoint, but that's another story). To anyone who thinks it's just a V8V with a DBS engine, I suggest you try one. It's by far the most focused and differentiated (barring the Piglet, sorry Cygnet) vehicle of the line up. It is also the one AML I would buy if I won the lottery.

[CraigV12V]

Your wrong. In reality most owners of exotic cars over £100k simply do not take them out in the wet and pile on the power if they can help it. Why not try test driving it in London?

Best car by far I have ever owned. Looks great, sounds great, over 9 degrees in the dry it sticks to the road like super glue. Use the other car when wet very cold or raining, as pretty much all super car owners do. Easy clutch, easy gearbox and did I mention how good it looks from inside as well as out? Go look at a proper driver's opinion of the car; http://tinyurl.com/cdc6cuh

[Vladimir]

CraigV12V said:

Your wrong. In reality most owners of exotic cars over £100k simply do not take them out in the wet and pile on the power if they can help it. Why not try test driving it in London?

Best car by far I have ever owned. Looks great, sounds great, over 9 degrees in the dry it sticks to the road like super glue. Use the other car when wet very cold or raining, as pretty much all super car owners do. Easy clutch, easy gearbox and did I mention how good it looks from inside as well as out? Go look at a proper driver's opinion of the car; http://tinyurl.com/cdc6cuh

Lucky lucky g1t!!

I really like the relatively compact dimensions of the Vantage and I LOVE cars that squeeze a whacking great engine into a small space. So the V12 Vantage is just epic IMO. It is one car I will drive at some stage.

Ignore the green eyed goons with no clue, too many copies of Top Gear and usually an old Focus on Mum and Dad's driveway.

[Guycord]

"So, tell me I'm wrong. And a wuss. You probably can't contain it any longer."

OK. Your wrong and a wuss. I would even say you are a big girls blouse.

Having had all three engine variants, the V12 is superior in every possible way. The car is significantly easier to drive - mainly because the difference that huge amount of torque available from the block but also the handling as well.

Much nicer car to drive at slow speed, much nicer exhaust note, much more planted on country lanes (above 7deg C for the corsas) and an accleration which is far more urgent than the simply inferior V8 Variant.

Probably the cheapest high performance V12 sportscars on the road today (new) and the most underrated.


G

[ChrisW.]

Sorry, yes you are.

Even if the Corsas were cold, it was your call.