Ferrari 550, 1 owner, only 109,000 miles FSH.Well would you?
Discussion
and 
Many thanks OP 
So the car still works out at around 12k less than the cheapest low mileage ones out there. That's really quite interesting, I was expecting you to have spent rather more. I suppose the 3.5k that the vendor spent accounts for some if that however.
The car is always going to have a limited market with that mileage but you've proved that it can make sense to buy such a car. I'm now looking again at the rosso 52k mileage F430 on auto trader
So the car still works out at around 12k less than the cheapest low mileage ones out there. That's really quite interesting, I was expecting you to have spent rather more. I suppose the 3.5k that the vendor spent accounts for some if that however.
The car is always going to have a limited market with that mileage but you've proved that it can make sense to buy such a car. I'm now looking again at the rosso 52k mileage F430 on auto trader
Sounds a good price for a very well sorted car you clearly love.
Just remember you will only lose money on it if you ever sell it
O h and re your post in Sept regarding the coolant hoses splitting this happened on my fathers old 456 when I took it to Castle Combe to watch the racing. It split as I drove into the car park giving huge amounts of vapour pouring out of the bonnet.
One of my neighbours was racing there and he got a friend to look at it who used to be one of Nigel Mansell's mechanics to look at it. After much sucking of air through teeth he looked at me abnd said 'Yeah its f**ked mate' Car went home on an AA low loader.
From memory the cost of the replacement hose was about £12 and a franchised dealer quoted £900 plus VAt to fit it! The hose is only about 6 inches long but you have to take off the inlet manifolds to get at it.
Just remember you will only lose money on it if you ever sell it
O h and re your post in Sept regarding the coolant hoses splitting this happened on my fathers old 456 when I took it to Castle Combe to watch the racing. It split as I drove into the car park giving huge amounts of vapour pouring out of the bonnet.
One of my neighbours was racing there and he got a friend to look at it who used to be one of Nigel Mansell's mechanics to look at it. After much sucking of air through teeth he looked at me abnd said 'Yeah its f**ked mate' Car went home on an AA low loader.
From memory the cost of the replacement hose was about £12 and a franchised dealer quoted £900 plus VAt to fit it! The hose is only about 6 inches long but you have to take off the inlet manifolds to get at it.
You didn't have to, but i'm glad you went to the trouble of that last post, OP.
A very enlightening post indeed and as mentioned previously, i had a higher figure in mind based on your descriptions thus far.
At the end of the day, if you were to put a piece of tape over the odometer, you would never guess that the car was anything other than a low mileage minter and if you are happy with the car and it is running well then i suppose the mileage is immaterial.
Ferrari should thank you for making this stuff public knowledge because they have the reputation of being fragile things and yours proves that if well looked after, then that needn't be the case. your post goes some way to unravelling the unnecessary mystique that surrounds these cars.
At the end of the day, a car with such an unstressed engine SHOULD be reliable at that sort of mileage, noone would blink twice at a 1.6 focus on 100+k so why should a 5.5 v12 be more fragile?
A very enlightening post indeed and as mentioned previously, i had a higher figure in mind based on your descriptions thus far.
At the end of the day, if you were to put a piece of tape over the odometer, you would never guess that the car was anything other than a low mileage minter and if you are happy with the car and it is running well then i suppose the mileage is immaterial.
Ferrari should thank you for making this stuff public knowledge because they have the reputation of being fragile things and yours proves that if well looked after, then that needn't be the case. your post goes some way to unravelling the unnecessary mystique that surrounds these cars.
At the end of the day, a car with such an unstressed engine SHOULD be reliable at that sort of mileage, noone would blink twice at a 1.6 focus on 100+k so why should a 5.5 v12 be more fragile?
Thank you PHAB.
Giving the costs makes the thread like a LTT report in a glossy magazine.
This way we get hopefully a more realistic impression of ownership. Those of us with a tenth of that to spend on something interesting may not be able to hold out for, or find their ideal spec. and just go for the best example they can find that meets their taste or desired levels of standard. PHAB has his ideal spec.
The car was the subject of a thread like that leggy 200K RS4. This Ferrari got bought and improved, the RS4 just went to Birmingham and got clocked.
Giving the costs makes the thread like a LTT report in a glossy magazine.
This way we get hopefully a more realistic impression of ownership. Those of us with a tenth of that to spend on something interesting may not be able to hold out for, or find their ideal spec. and just go for the best example they can find that meets their taste or desired levels of standard. PHAB has his ideal spec.
The car was the subject of a thread like that leggy 200K RS4. This Ferrari got bought and improved, the RS4 just went to Birmingham and got clocked.
longblackcoat said:
PHAB, what figure do you have in mind as an annual servicing/refurbishment spend? Obviously it depends on the mileage you intend to cover, but my assumption is that you'll need to put aside £5k per annum to ensure you're covered as/when a really big bill pops up.
Hard to say really. I think average mileage will be about 3000-3500; the car was bought primarily to take to Europe each summer so that is where the miles will come from.As for servicing / refurbishment? Who knows....I think £5k is very generous. I dont flog or track the car and (touch wood) the drive train seems to be and is reportedly in fantastic condition, so hopefully it will boil down to consumables,wear and tear items and the odd bit of cosmetic fettling. The car is absolutely pristine at the moment so I would like think more like £2500 on average to keep it that way (and improve it bit by bit too). The big bills are the cambelt changes but independents save you a lot of money these days and they arent due year in year out anyway. Im not anticipating gearbox rebuilds/engine rebuilds etc etc.
I wont go into fuel....
Edited by PHAB on Wednesday 5th December 09:45
PHAB said:
Hard to say really. I think average mileage will be about 3000-3500; the car was bought primarily to take to Europe each summer so that is where the miles will come from.
As for servicing / refurbishment? Who knows....I think £5k is very generous. I dont flog or track the car and (touch wood) the drive train seems to be and is reportedly in fantastic condition, so hopefully it will boil down to consumables,wear and tear items and the odd bit of cosmetic fettling. The car is absolutely pristine at the moment so I would like think more like £2500 on average to keep it that way (and improve it bit by bit too). The big bills are the cambelt changes but independents save you a lot of money these days and they arent due year in year out anyway. Im not anticipating gearbox rebuilds/engine rebuilds etc etc.
I wont go into fuel....
Hi PHAB, only just caught this thread as I don't normally look at GG. Very interesting to read your write ups and see your costs As for servicing / refurbishment? Who knows....I think £5k is very generous. I dont flog or track the car and (touch wood) the drive train seems to be and is reportedly in fantastic condition, so hopefully it will boil down to consumables,wear and tear items and the odd bit of cosmetic fettling. The car is absolutely pristine at the moment so I would like think more like £2500 on average to keep it that way (and improve it bit by bit too). The big bills are the cambelt changes but independents save you a lot of money these days and they arent due year in year out anyway. Im not anticipating gearbox rebuilds/engine rebuilds etc etc.
I wont go into fuel....
Edited by PHAB on Wednesday 5th December 09:45
I bought a TDF/tan 550 about 6 weeks or so ago and kinda went the other way mine (having just got out of a 55k mile or so 355), spent a bit more than planned for a lower mileage one (it's all in my PH garage) as I just fell in love and had to have it. QV inspected and declared it lovely with only a couple of minor things to look at, so far so good. Echo all your thoughts on how they drive, they really are epic! Fuel consumption only seems to be bad in town though, out on the opener road I'm seeing 18mpg+, so as "frugal" or better than the 355 was!It just occurred to me that if you keep posting in this thread with all your updates and work, you'll have no problem selling it to a PHer further down the line if you wanted to. I managed to sell my 355 despite the "high" miles to a chap here for a price I was happy with without even having to put it up for sale
I'm pretty sure my running reports/info helped Even better, he's keeping me updated on her as well which is nice as it felt like I was letting a child go when he drove away!I do think keeping a record of what is spend on your car on here is very useful when you come to sell it. I had a TVR Tamora and for the duration I had it I kept a detailed log of its running costs here on my profile. When I came to sell it I would refer people to it and I think it gave them a realistic idea of what the actual runnig cost of cars like this really are.
Greg_D said:
noone would blink twice at a 1.6 focus on 100+k so why should a 5.5 v12 be more fragile?
People are worried because of the cost of the V12 Ferrari repair bills. The cost of keeping them on the road, the stratospheric repair bills and the reliability is in no way at all any where near comparable with a Focus 1.6 or any other normal car.
I did over 20k miles in one between 2000 - 2001 and because it was new it was quite reliable but a few things went pop and were fixed under warranty.
- The valve guide wore out prematurely; £5000
- The bonnet never closed square and somehow was not spotted at the factory. After much wrangling, it was replaced, under warranty. Parts, fitting and paint; £13,500.
- Worn steering rack; £3600
- Seat slider broken; £550
- Bushes worn, various; £1000's
- Assorted split water hoses, radiator problems, A/c problems; £100's
- + lots of other stuff including £1000's on routine servicing.
I did it in a newer car and loved it. I would find it hard to stomach the above bills in a car that I owned and loved to drive.
Is it more fragile than a Focus 1.6? In my experience armed with the knowledge I have about these cars; very much so. It also costs a hell of a lot more, many, many multiples of to fix.
OdramaSwimLaden said:
It also costs a hell of a lot more, many, many multiples of to fix.
That sums up the risk of buying these cars, all the threads that pop up, why by x y or z when you can have a 8-9year old DB9 or a 10year old 996 turbo or a 360 modena. Or why buy a fiesta when you can get a Maserati 3200 etc etcNo doubting some of these cars are perfectly fine and will run for many years like that, with the correct maintenance (which also costs alot) however the reality is many of these will break down at some and have a big repair bill which the owner might not be able to account for.
OdramaSwimLaden said:
People are worried because of the cost of the V12 Ferrari repair bills.
The cost of keeping them on the road, the stratospheric repair bills and the reliability is in no way at all any where near comparable with a Focus 1.6 or any other normal car.
I did over 20k miles in one between 2000 - 2001 and because it was new it was quite reliable but a few things went pop and were fixed under warranty.
- The valve guide wore out prematurely; £5000
- The bonnet never closed square and somehow was not spotted at the factory. After much wrangling, it was replaced, under warranty. Parts, fitting and paint; £13,500.
- Worn steering rack; £3600
- Seat slider broken; £550
- Bushes worn, various; £1000's
- Assorted split water hoses, radiator problems, A/c problems; £100's
- + lots of other stuff including £1000's on routine servicing.
I did it in a newer car and loved it. I would find it hard to stomach the above bills in a car that I owned and loved to drive.
Is it more fragile than a Focus 1.6? In my experience armed with the knowledge I have about these cars; very much so. It also costs a hell of a lot more, many, many multiples of to fix.
I partially agree, but to be fair, I think your case is unusual. A couple of thoughts: those would have been main dealer prices, independents charge about half to two-thirds of main dealers for labour rate. Parts prices would be cheaper as well as people like Hill Engineering etc make replacement parts for known issues (which much of the above seems to cover in hindsight 12 years later!) for half the cost (or sometimes less) than the Ferrari original part. You're also more likely to get a garage repairing a part and fixing the initial defect at the same time rather than just replacing it (I'm thinking 355 manifolds here which are virtually a consumable if you keep fitting Ferrari ones). Costs as a proportion of purchase price I woud say are lower for highly regarded supercars. For instance, I just spent 20% of the initial purchase price (from a month or 2 ago) of my 10 year old mini having repairs done. Equivalent would have been £11k on my 550 which I also bought only a month or so ago. £11k goes a looooooong way in Fcar servicing/maintenance/repairs if you go to the right people.The cost of keeping them on the road, the stratospheric repair bills and the reliability is in no way at all any where near comparable with a Focus 1.6 or any other normal car.
I did over 20k miles in one between 2000 - 2001 and because it was new it was quite reliable but a few things went pop and were fixed under warranty.
- The valve guide wore out prematurely; £5000
- The bonnet never closed square and somehow was not spotted at the factory. After much wrangling, it was replaced, under warranty. Parts, fitting and paint; £13,500.
- Worn steering rack; £3600
- Seat slider broken; £550
- Bushes worn, various; £1000's
- Assorted split water hoses, radiator problems, A/c problems; £100's
- + lots of other stuff including £1000's on routine servicing.
I did it in a newer car and loved it. I would find it hard to stomach the above bills in a car that I owned and loved to drive.
Is it more fragile than a Focus 1.6? In my experience armed with the knowledge I have about these cars; very much so. It also costs a hell of a lot more, many, many multiples of to fix.
Another way to look at it is: imagine you owned a 1st gen Ford Focus from 1998 and compare it to a 1998 550. The 550 is always going to cost far more to run in terms of servicing/maintenance etc, but in terms of reliability, I suspect the average 15 year old focus will have more reliability issues than the average 15 year old 550. And even if it didn't, even if it was slightly more reliable, that's still not pretty bad going for an 18 year old *hand built* supercar IMO
Mario149 said:
OdramaSwimLaden said:
People are worried because of the cost of the V12 Ferrari repair bills.
The cost of keeping them on the road, the stratospheric repair bills and the reliability is in no way at all any where near comparable with a Focus 1.6 or any other normal car.
I did over 20k miles in one between 2000 - 2001 and because it was new it was quite reliable but a few things went pop and were fixed under warranty.
- The valve guide wore out prematurely; £5000
- The bonnet never closed square and somehow was not spotted at the factory. After much wrangling, it was replaced, under warranty. Parts, fitting and paint; £13,500.
- Worn steering rack; £3600
- Seat slider broken; £550
- Bushes worn, various; £1000's
- Assorted split water hoses, radiator problems, A/c problems; £100's
- + lots of other stuff including £1000's on routine servicing.
I did it in a newer car and loved it. I would find it hard to stomach the above bills in a car that I owned and loved to drive.
Is it more fragile than a Focus 1.6? In my experience armed with the knowledge I have about these cars; very much so. It also costs a hell of a lot more, many, many multiples of to fix.
Another way to look at it is: imagine you owned a 1st gen Ford Focus from 1998 and compare it to a 1998 550. The 550 is always going to cost far more to run in terms of servicing/maintenance etc, but in terms of reliability, I suspect the average 15 year old focus will have more reliability issues than the average 15 year old 550. And even if it didn't, even if it was slightly more reliable, that's still not pretty bad going for an 18 year old *hand built* supercar IMO The cost of keeping them on the road, the stratospheric repair bills and the reliability is in no way at all any where near comparable with a Focus 1.6 or any other normal car.
I did over 20k miles in one between 2000 - 2001 and because it was new it was quite reliable but a few things went pop and were fixed under warranty.
- The valve guide wore out prematurely; £5000
- The bonnet never closed square and somehow was not spotted at the factory. After much wrangling, it was replaced, under warranty. Parts, fitting and paint; £13,500.
- Worn steering rack; £3600
- Seat slider broken; £550
- Bushes worn, various; £1000's
- Assorted split water hoses, radiator problems, A/c problems; £100's
- + lots of other stuff including £1000's on routine servicing.
I did it in a newer car and loved it. I would find it hard to stomach the above bills in a car that I owned and loved to drive.
Is it more fragile than a Focus 1.6? In my experience armed with the knowledge I have about these cars; very much so. It also costs a hell of a lot more, many, many multiples of to fix.
I do remember travelling to a friends place in Normandy along a sweeping tree lined a-road thinking it gets no better.....
Enjoy.
Ps......If you want the best guy out there to look after it Google "Aldo Riti".
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