RE: Airbag poisons driver
Discussion
This story's science doesn't add up. Sodium azide is highly toxic... to bacteria as well as humans, hence its use as a preservative.
Inhaling sodium azide would likely have killed any bacteria in the lungs, thus likely preventing a bacterial infection rather than instigating it. I doubt a viral infection would be affected either way.
Add the extended timeframe between exposure and death and I cannot see how a correlation could be drawn between the airbag deployment and the chaps unfortunate death.
Without any further information on the case, it does seem like ropey work from the coroner.
Inhaling sodium azide would likely have killed any bacteria in the lungs, thus likely preventing a bacterial infection rather than instigating it. I doubt a viral infection would be affected either way.
Add the extended timeframe between exposure and death and I cannot see how a correlation could be drawn between the airbag deployment and the chaps unfortunate death.
Without any further information on the case, it does seem like ropey work from the coroner.
otolith said:
I don't think the coroner attributed the death to sodium azide. I don't think he was specific about it. It does look as if the pneumonia may have been caused by inhaling the powder used to keep the airbag from sticking. This is a known risk of inhaling talc.
Sorry - you're right in that the coroner didn't attribute it to sodium azide specifically.However, I would still expect a one off exposure to talc to act rather more quickly than the 2 months stated and it doesn't explain the signs of infection the pathologist reported.
It would be interesting to read the full coroners report if such a thing exists and is publicly available.
DJ_AS said:
Sorry - you're right in that the coroner didn't attribute it to sodium azide specifically.
However, I would still expect a one off exposure to talc to act rather more quickly than the 2 months stated and it doesn't explain the signs of infection the pathologist reported.
It would be interesting to read the full coroners report if such a thing exists and is publicly available.
if you read the actual news report rather than the abridged PH version here - it says he had breathing difficulty from straight after the crash up until he died two months later - most of which time was spent on a ventilator - so sounds like he got a lung full of talc and was allergic to it, or asthmatic or something.However, I would still expect a one off exposure to talc to act rather more quickly than the 2 months stated and it doesn't explain the signs of infection the pathologist reported.
It would be interesting to read the full coroners report if such a thing exists and is publicly available.
ETA linky
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/20...
again it refers to "noxious fumes" rather than the talc / cornflour whatever was used - plus this thing about the airbag being punctured which I can't see happening how would he know, the inflation / deflation is so quick.
Edited by filski666 on Wednesday 30th May 23:28
Toffer said:
At TVR, Peter Wheeler's philosophy was " “If someone crashes one of my cars and it’s their fault then I can live with myself. If we were to put an airbag in one of our cars and it ended up killing someone, I couldn’t live with that ”.
I understand that he believed that in the event of a "roll-over" accident in a convertible, the driver's head would be pushed into danger by the air bag?
Unfortunately, PW was a master of macho spin and tales to excuse all sorts of modern functions which they could not afford to fit to the cars. I understand that he believed that in the event of a "roll-over" accident in a convertible, the driver's head would be pushed into danger by the air bag?
filski666 said:
DJ_AS said:
Sorry - you're right in that the coroner didn't attribute it to sodium azide specifically.
However, I would still expect a one off exposure to talc to act rather more quickly than the 2 months stated and it doesn't explain the signs of infection the pathologist reported.
It would be interesting to read the full coroners report if such a thing exists and is publicly available.
if you read the actual news report rather than the abridged PH version here - it says he had breathing difficulty from straight after the crash up until he died two months later - most of which time was spent on a ventilator - so sounds like he got a lung full of talc and was allergic to it, or asthmatic or something.However, I would still expect a one off exposure to talc to act rather more quickly than the 2 months stated and it doesn't explain the signs of infection the pathologist reported.
It would be interesting to read the full coroners report if such a thing exists and is publicly available.
ETA linky
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/20...
again it refers to "noxious fumes" rather than the talc / cornflour whatever was used - plus this thing about the airbag being punctured which I can't see happening how would he know, the inflation / deflation is so quick.
DJ_AS said:
This story's science doesn't add up. Sodium azide is highly toxic... to bacteria as well as humans, hence its use as a preservative.
Inhaling sodium azide would likely have killed any bacteria in the lungs, thus likely preventing a bacterial infection rather than instigating it. I doubt a viral infection would be affected either way.
Did you do well at science in school?Inhaling sodium azide would likely have killed any bacteria in the lungs, thus likely preventing a bacterial infection rather than instigating it. I doubt a viral infection would be affected either way.
DJ_AS said:
This story's science doesn't add up. Sodium azide is highly toxic... to bacteria as well as humans, hence its use as a preservative.
Inhaling sodium azide would likely have killed any bacteria in the lungs, thus likely preventing a bacterial infection rather than instigating it. I doubt a viral infection would be affected either way.
Add the extended timeframe between exposure and death and I cannot see how a correlation could be drawn between the airbag deployment and the chaps unfortunate death.
Without any further information on the case, it does seem like ropey work from the coroner.
You would have to mix it with Yakult to stop it killing the 'good bacteria' though.Inhaling sodium azide would likely have killed any bacteria in the lungs, thus likely preventing a bacterial infection rather than instigating it. I doubt a viral infection would be affected either way.
Add the extended timeframe between exposure and death and I cannot see how a correlation could be drawn between the airbag deployment and the chaps unfortunate death.
Without any further information on the case, it does seem like ropey work from the coroner.
filski666 said:
why do you hope the widow sues? what possible good will that do? I can't stand this blame blame blame society that we seem to be descending into....her husband crashed his car in a big way it would seem - if it wasn't for the efforts of the safety engineers he wouldn't have had those last 2 months at all - so he was better off - why blame them because there isn't an alternative technology out yet?
idiot.
Typical asshat PHer response.idiot.
DJ_AS said:
Prof Prolapse said:
Did you do well at science in school?
Why do you ask?Equally feel free to mock me. I called bulls
t on the article but it would appear it just ommitted details which I easily could had googled if I weren't such an arrogant bd.Prof Prolapse said:
DJ_AS said:
Prof Prolapse said:
Did you do well at science in school?
Why do you ask?Equally feel free to mock me. I called bulls
t on the article but it would appear it just ommitted details which I easily could had googled if I weren't such an arrogant bd. I did do well at science in school... and at univeristy... and in my career... 
I'm not a toxicology specialist though and I was just speculating based upon the scant details as presented in the article. I really would be interested in reading the coroners report on this unfortunate incident for the full facts of the case.
Sadly, science reporting in the media is, in general, very poor. But that's a whole new discussion!
DJ_AS said:
Fair enough I did do well at science in school... and at univeristy... and in my career...
I'm not a toxicology specialist though and I was just speculating based upon the scant details as presented in the article. I really would be interested in reading the coroners report on this unfortunate incident for the full facts of the case.
Sadly, science reporting in the media is, in general, very poor. But that's a whole new discussion!
Respiratory toxicology was what the cool kids studied. I did do well at science in school... and at univeristy... and in my career... I'm not a toxicology specialist though and I was just speculating based upon the scant details as presented in the article. I really would be interested in reading the coroners report on this unfortunate incident for the full facts of the case.
Sadly, science reporting in the media is, in general, very poor. But that's a whole new discussion!
You jumped the gun a bit was all. Just because it is anti-microbial doesn't mean it will be in vivo. That and any affect will be transient. Unlike the associated damage to the lungs which presumably resulted in fibrosis, poor lung clearance etc. then all it takes is a bit of fluid build up (a known effect of Sodium Azide) then bacteria infestation is pretty much a certainty. You even don't even need outside infection, just an inbalance in the "floral" bacteria already in your lungs. Then it's game over.
Speculated a little. But you catch my drift I'm sure.
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