RE: Driven: Audi RS4
Discussion
Housey said:
Scuffers said:
have you ever encountered under-steer on the B7 RS4?
Hell yes, up to 95% its solid, get it on track or really stir it and it pushes and pushes big. Housey, 100K miles in his B7 RS4
way I see it, RS4 is not a trackday car, neither is an M3/M5/C63 etc etc. you don't buy them to do trackdays, they are road cars.
I have had Audi's for quite a few years now, and whilst I agree the old one (B5 etc) would understeer when pushes, the B8 I have now you would have to do something quite extreme to get it to push on, yes the front end is not as sharp as an M3 (I wish Audi would do something with their steering racks), but they don't plough on any more.
drpep said:
Doesn't this photo just sum it up?
Big fat car, for big fat dad-types. Sod that, give me a lightweight screamer anyday. Must admit, the engine is pretty wonderful though; especially in this age of the turbocharger.
I've heard it all now..... Discussing whether you should buy a car based on your weight?Big fat car, for big fat dad-types. Sod that, give me a lightweight screamer anyday. Must admit, the engine is pretty wonderful though; especially in this age of the turbocharger.
Is this mumsnet?!
B.J.W said:
flatline84 said:
B.J.W said:
The B7 RS4 Point to point, I still maintain that it was more than a match for all but the best pedalled GTR
Im sure it felt that way, but by the first corner you would not have seen where the GTR went. Not only leagues, but continents apart in terms of outright pace. B7 RS4 is still a lovely car though.Guffy said:
B.J.W said:
flatline84 said:
B.J.W said:
The B7 RS4 Point to point, I still maintain that it was more than a match for all but the best pedalled GTR
Im sure it felt that way, but by the first corner you would not have seen where the GTR went. Not only leagues, but continents apart in terms of outright pace. B7 RS4 is still a lovely car though.I've driven a GTR in comparison to my RS4 and the GTR is quite a bit quicker in all circumstances
Not my type of car, but certainly a different level when it comes to outright performance
Guffy said:
B.J.W said:
flatline84 said:
B.J.W said:
The B7 RS4 Point to point, I still maintain that it was more than a match for all but the best pedalled GTR
Im sure it felt that way, but by the first corner you would not have seen where the GTR went. Not only leagues, but continents apart in terms of outright pace. B7 RS4 is still a lovely car though.both the RS4 and GTR are way too heavy to be truly fast unless you propose giving them Veyron levels of power (and yet more weight).
djdestiny said:
I've heard it all now..... Discussing whether you should buy a car based on your weight?
Is this mumsnet?!
I had to laugh at this one - and yes, sometimes, I do think my bum looks big in my RS4. Is this mumsnet?!
BTW - you could option the refrigerated glove box for the RS4, which I'm relaiably told keeps your Ginsters nice and fresh when travelling.... ;-)
drpep said:
Doesn't this photo just sum it up?
Big fat car, for big fat dad-types. Sod that, give me a lightweight screamer anyday. Must admit, the engine is pretty wonderful though; especially in this age of the turbocharger.
You sir, have missed the point of the rs4. I don't think people in the market for a fast, decent, comfortable and refined estate car would suddenly veer off and get a "lightweight screamer". Oh, do tell, what lightweight screamer you would have to do the job of the rs4? Big fat car, for big fat dad-types. Sod that, give me a lightweight screamer anyday. Must admit, the engine is pretty wonderful though; especially in this age of the turbocharger.
Muppet.
54Kab said:
Dagnut said:
So what is Harris on about?
"It's not a drift king, but this car doesn't feel front-driven - and that's the biggest advantage it holds over the B7 RS4."
I dont think this has been clarified yet ?? The B7 puts 60% to the rear, so what does the B8 do differently to justify this comment? Chris ??"It's not a drift king, but this car doesn't feel front-driven - and that's the biggest advantage it holds over the B7 RS4."
Scuffers said:
to be blunt, if you want a really fast car, you don't start with a 1,700+Kg's one.
both the RS4 and GTR are way too heavy to be truly fast unless you propose giving them Veyron levels of power (and yet more weight).
I'd agree but there's no denying the "out of the box" pace of the GTR that defies it's raw numbers. Original ones at sub 500bhp and 1700kgs+ but can lap (if only one before everything overheats) with more dedicated lighter machinery. Not my thing though.both the RS4 and GTR are way too heavy to be truly fast unless you propose giving them Veyron levels of power (and yet more weight).
Its seems to be the way things are going - if the new S6 Car and Driver review is anything to go by, it's got less power than the RS4 but launches in 3.7 to 60. not bad for a barge!
Dagnut said:
54Kab said:
Dagnut said:
So what is Harris on about?
"It's not a drift king, but this car doesn't feel front-driven - and that's the biggest advantage it holds over the B7 RS4."
I dont think this has been clarified yet ?? The B7 puts 60% to the rear, so what does the B8 do differently to justify this comment? Chris ??"It's not a drift king, but this car doesn't feel front-driven - and that's the biggest advantage it holds over the B7 RS4."
Seems like a no win situation for the RS4. Bolt on big turbo's and it'a all too easy, too remote, not one for the enthusiast. Make a high revving n/a V8 and it needs to be worked too hard....
The reality is this is all nit-picking at the fringes. For anybody not paid to drive and review cars 5 days a week this RS4 will not disappoint.
One a wet road it will leave any AMG or M series for dust.
Dagnut said:
Thanks, at least I'm not the only one
Audi used to trot-out the 'rear-biased' line with every successive 4wd performance variant - the B7 RS4 was the same as the others. It always felt like the rear axle was there to assist in proceedings, not actively contribute to the overall feel and behaviour of the car. That's an important distinction.In a B7 RS4, you delight in the un-Audi control weights, the un-Audi damping, and the powertrain. But its default chassis behaviour is understeer - regardless of what Audi claims the ff/r torque-split might be.
The new car has a different 4wd system which is a decelopment of the S4's chassis, and uses the Sport Differential at the rear axle. This is basically a fancy-pants locking diff that allows the car to behave much more like a RWD car from apex to exit than a B7. The rear axle will move, much like a GT-R. This is a new and welcome change from Audi.
As for torque - you have to rev the B8 very hard to make it move the way the badge suggests it should. As I said, some people will like that; others won't. Jump out of a C63 into an RS4 and it lacks the type of instant urge that makes for a great road car. There was no C63 when the B7 car was launched, but now there is, so we have to compare the two.
You'll see the results next week.
Chris Harris said:
Audi used to trot-out the 'rear-biased' line with every successive 4wd performance variant - the B7 RS4 was the same as the others. It always felt like the rear axle was there to assist in proceedings, not actively contribute to the overall feel and behaviour of the car. That's an important distinction.
In a B7 RS4, you delight in the un-Audi control weights, the un-Audi damping, and the powertrain. But its default chassis behaviour is understeer - regardless of what Audi claims the ff/r torque-split might be.
The new car has a different 4wd system which is a decelopment of the S4's chassis, and uses the Sport Differential at the rear axle. This is basically a fancy-pants locking diff that allows the car to behave much more like a RWD car from apex to exit than a B7. The rear axle will move, much like a GT-R. This is a new and welcome change from Audi.
As for torque - you have to rev the B8 very hard to make it move the way the badge suggests it should. As I said, some people will like that; others won't. Jump out of a C63 into an RS4 and it lacks the type of instant urge that makes for a great road car. There was no C63 when the B7 car was launched, but now there is, so we have to compare the two.
You'll see the results next week.
Great response cheers.In a B7 RS4, you delight in the un-Audi control weights, the un-Audi damping, and the powertrain. But its default chassis behaviour is understeer - regardless of what Audi claims the ff/r torque-split might be.
The new car has a different 4wd system which is a decelopment of the S4's chassis, and uses the Sport Differential at the rear axle. This is basically a fancy-pants locking diff that allows the car to behave much more like a RWD car from apex to exit than a B7. The rear axle will move, much like a GT-R. This is a new and welcome change from Audi.
As for torque - you have to rev the B8 very hard to make it move the way the badge suggests it should. As I said, some people will like that; others won't. Jump out of a C63 into an RS4 and it lacks the type of instant urge that makes for a great road car. There was no C63 when the B7 car was launched, but now there is, so we have to compare the two.
You'll see the results next week.
DutchSi said:
djdestiny said:
I've heard it all now..... Discussing whether you should buy a car based on your weight?
Is this mumsnet?!
I had to laugh at this one - and yes, sometimes, I do think my bum looks big in my RS4. Is this mumsnet?!
BTW - you could option the refrigerated glove box for the RS4, which I'm relaiably told keeps your Ginsters nice and fresh when travelling.... ;-)
E38Ross said:
Kong said:
Got to love pistonheads. When the latest M5 came out with it's grunty twin turbo V8 everyone bemoans the passing of the old revvy N/A engine. So Audi provides a revvy N/A engine in the RS4 and everyone complains it needs to be revved! It's no worder the manufacturers never listen to 'us' 
it's pathetic, ain't it.what is harris's continual obsession with drifting? He may live in the world of "power tests" international travel and wraparound oakley shades, but the only people trying to drive an Audi RSx like that on UK public roads are those smelling of council estate buying Cat-C second-hand in 7 years time. Surely this is more the thinking man's express. I have never had one of these fly up behind me in lane 3 of the mway - it's always the diesel Audi driver who wishes he could afford an RS.
CJP80 said:
E38Ross said:
Kong said:
Got to love pistonheads. When the latest M5 came out with it's grunty twin turbo V8 everyone bemoans the passing of the old revvy N/A engine. So Audi provides a revvy N/A engine in the RS4 and everyone complains it needs to be revved! It's no worder the manufacturers never listen to 'us'
it's pathetic, ain't it.The RS4 with it's high revving n/a V8 was designed to be more involving, and offer something different from the turbo diesels.
As Chris says, some will like this some won't.
Looking at Chris' garage it's easy to see why he wants more effortless grunt from an estate as he has a few more specialised cars to choose from if he fancies a strop (e.g. GT3 RS).
For those of us without a GT3 in the garage the RS4 will cover both daily duties and the weekend hoon. Think of it as an alternative to his diesel Passat and 911 all rolled into one.
Guffy said:
B.J.W said:
flatline84 said:
B.J.W said:
The B7 RS4 Point to point, I still maintain that it was more than a match for all but the best pedalled GTR
Im sure it felt that way, but by the first corner you would not have seen where the GTR went. Not only leagues, but continents apart in terms of outright pace. B7 RS4 is still a lovely car though.I am not doubting the fact that the GTR is a quicker car and better handling package than the RS4 - what I am saying is that in most 'normal' road based situations the difference point to point wouldn't be that great - this has been proved time and time again on runs out we have had with a wide variety of cars with differing performance levels. On paper performance in artificial circumstances is a lot different to real world scenarios. I've had a run out with a GTR over the twisties in my RS4 - other than a modest straight line advantage, there was little to choose between the two.
Blown2CV said:
what is harris's continual obsession with drifting? He may live in the world of "power tests" international travel and wraparound oakley shades, but the only people trying to drive an Audi RSx like that on UK public roads are those smelling of council estate buying Cat-C second-hand in 7 years time. Surely this is more the thinking man's express. I have never had one of these fly up behind me in lane 3 of the mway - it's always the diesel Audi driver who wishes he could afford an RS.
Agreed, seems to be epidemic in jurnos these days....If you want to spend all day going sideways, buy a caterham.
Big heavy road cars do not make great trackday cars, no amount of tyre shredding videos is going to change that.
I have an S4 and S5 as road cars, if I want to go flying round a track, I use an Elise.
Eg. http://vimeo.com/43840940
Edited by Scuffers on Friday 15th June 13:03
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