RE: Driven: Audi RS4

[Dave Hedgehog]

Contigo said:

Even the brochure is dull compared to the B7.

http://www.audi.co.uk/content/dam/audi/production/...

Nice to see it getting a decent standard spec though including MMS, Sat Nav and BT.

standard audi brochure, much of it used on the RS3

[Mr Whippy]

Dave Hedgehog said:

Mr Whippy said:

DSG is a retarded choice though. If you are dulling down the driving involvement that much you may as well run a big slow FI or a diesel or something.

Dave

Its the perfect choice, if your want purist driving dont buy a 1600kg+ barge, plus the RS5 comes with a manual option

In the real world of families, shopping trips and traffic jams duel clutch is a god send, plus you dont have to lift to change gear

leave the manual for the GT3 RS

By that logic though, then why have a fast spinning NA petrol? Why have a petrol? Why even have 450bhp?

In the real world of families they won't appreciate 450bhp being used within the UK speed limits.

In the real world of shopping trips 450bhp and NA 8500rpm engine isn't really needed.

In a traffic jam then an auto is nice.


I'm just confused by the logic.

The only reason they are in vogue is they are a 'cool' automatic and by stupid logic of the test cycles they achieve lower CO2 ratings.

It's probably deserving of the automatic gearbox because it's just a fast road barge. I just don't get why Audi bother with a proper sports car type engine when they have lumbered the car with a gearbox for people who don't care any more. They could have put in a big 400bhp diesel and sold even more

Dave

[Contigo]

Dave Hedgehog said:

standard audi brochure, much of it used on the RS3

I rest my case.

[djdestiny]

Scuffers said:

exactly, so you take a £50K+ car, then spend yet ore money on it, and it's still way slower and scarily more money to run (in consumables) than a £15K Caterham or £20K Elise.

if you want to do trackdays, buy a car that's suited to doing trackdays.

RS4 is a road car, a very nice/fast road car, but still a road car.

It is a perfectly capable occasional track car.
Obviously if you were doing them regularly then yes, go for the ones mentioned

[djdestiny]

Dave Hedgehog said:

djdestiny said:

Blown2CV said:

are sterile and uninvolving not audi brand-values?

No, they're mostly sterotypical tags that have been attached to the Audi name, usually by people that have never owned one

but at least it will understeer off at the first corner

ARB's and decent suspension make a huge difference

[Contigo]

djdestiny said:

It is a perfectly capable occasional track car.
Obviously if you were doing them regularly then yes, go for the ones mentioned

I don't see why it can't be both. It's nice to be able to take a car that I can run the family down to the south of France in comfort onto Castle Combe and drive it to the limit where most cars would not even be capable. Track cars are fine if you the luxury of storing them and maintaining them etc but I'd rather have a decent car for occasional track use than a track car which is used occasionally and is run on the road. I hated the Elise as a road car.

[djdestiny]

I agree, you only have to look at the Unit 20 one on the track

[Contigo]

djdestiny said:

I agree, you only have to look at the Unit 20 one on the track

I know Grizz is fine at fettling motors.

[Scuffers]

Contigo said:

djdestiny said:

It is a perfectly capable occasional track car.
Obviously if you were doing them regularly then yes, go for the ones mentioned

I don't see why it can't be both. It's nice to be able to take a car that I can run the family down to the south of France in comfort onto Castle Combe and drive it to the limit where most cars would not even be capable. Track cars are fine if you the luxury of storing them and maintaining them etc but I'd rather have a decent car for occasional track use than a track car which is used occasionally and is run on the road. I hated the Elise as a road car.

I just don't get that, a 1700+kg family bus on track is laughable.

[Contigo]

Scuffers said:

I just don't get that, a 1700+kg family bus on track is laughable.

Laughable? How is it any different to a M3 CSL on track (circa 1375kg)? A car that I have driven many times on track. If we are comparing it to a Caterham or Westie, Atom or Radical then both are heavyweights but believe me the RS4 is no slouch on the track.

Go down to Castle Combe second weekend in July and I'll get you a passenger ride in both cars. See what's laughable about them then shall we?

[Contigo]

According to your garage you have an S5 and S4 (quite sure why you feel you need both if you see them as barges I dunno) but you telling me you've never had the urge to take them on track?

[Scuffers]

Contigo said:

According to your garage you have an S5 and S4 (quite sure why you feel you need both if you see them as barges I dunno) but you telling me you've never had the urge to take them on track?

nope.

that's what I have an Elise for, the Audi's are road cars, and very nice ones at that.

this is what you call a trackday car:

https://vimeo.com/43840940

[Contigo]

Scuffers said:

nope.

that's what I have an Elise for, the Audi's are road cars, and very nice ones at that.

this is what you call a trackday car:

https://vimeo.com/43840940

I'm not arguing what a trackday car is and I think we both know what they are but I just don't buy it that the RS4 or S4 cannot be used an occasional track day car. The testing of the RS/S cars is done at the usual Nordschleiffe and most of their brochures focus on their track ability. For me I can have as much fun in the RS's as I can in the CSL and an Elise. Each to their own I guess.

[Scuffers]

I'm not arguing what a trackday car is and I think we both know what they are but I just don't buy it that the RS4 or S4 cannot be used an occasional track day car. The testing of the RS/S cars is done at the usual Nordschleiffe and most of their brochures focus on their track ability.
[/quote]
if you really believe that then I am sorry to have to burst your bubble, that's called marketing!

[quote=Contigo] For me I can have as much fun in the RS's as I can in the CSL and an Elise. Each to their own I guess.
[/quote]

Look, I am not arguing a CSL is any better as a track car, it has similar issues, about the only car like that that actually kind of work on track is the old 911 GT3, and they make ste road cars (IMHO)

I am not tying to suggest you can't drive one round a track, but I am sure if I did, I could destroy the both the tyres & brakes in less than half a days 'fun', along with risking the engine (due to oil starvation), and the potential to have the 'big one' and wipe the car out (and yes, I have seen more than a few that have gone this way)

Years ago, just for fun I took an Audi A4 2.8 Quattro round Thruxton, in 3 laps the brakes were finished, the tyres were not happy, and I was the slowest thing out there, please explain the 'fun' in that?



to be honest, if an Elise or Caterham is not your thing, something like an old 205GTi or 106 rallye make much better trackday toys, they will (almost) run forever, cost peanuts in running costs, and if you do have the 'big one' are not exactly going to bankrupt you.

Edited by Scuffers on Tuesday 26th June 18:49

[Contigo]

Scuffers said:

Years ago, just for fun I took an Audi A4 2.8 Quattro round Thruxton, in 3 laps the brakes were finished, the tyres were not happy, and I was the slowest thing out there, please explain the 'fun' in that?

No fun at all but there is a BIG difference between the brake setup on a RS4 compared to a 2.8 Quattro, I've done lots of laps of Coombe and had no brake fade after umpteen laps on standard RS4 brakes which were not the best.

As for the trackcar I'm really not fussed about having a trackday car I'd much rather have something I can use on the road and have fun on the occasional day out. Horse for courses and all that jazz.

[Scuffers]

would you like me to demonstrate the limitations of the brakes for you?

[Contigo]

Scuffers said:

would you like me to demonstrate the limitations of the brakes for you?

Of what? the RS4? they won't stop you like a light trackcar and will suffer fade well before a trackcar. I must admit I hated my Elise brakes maybe there was a problem but they locked up so easily and the only way to control the braking was to pump them.

[Scuffers]

Contigo said:

Of what? the RS4? they won't stop you like a light trackcar and will suffer fade well before a trackcar. I must admit I hated my Elise brakes maybe there was a problem but they locked up so easily and the only way to control the braking was to pump them.

that's not a characteristic I recognise, either it had issues or your driving style needs help....

Elise has probably the best braking capabilities of just about any road based car out there by some margin

[Dave Hedgehog]

Scuffers said:

Contigo said:

According to your garage you have an S5 and S4 (quite sure why you feel you need both if you see them as barges I dunno) but you telling me you've never had the urge to take them on track?

nope.

that's what I have an Elise for, the Audi's are road cars, and very nice ones at that.

this is what you call a trackday car:

https://vimeo.com/43840940

v nice, looks proper quick

[Scuffers]

Dave Hedgehog said:

v nice, looks proper quick

Yea, it's a fun little car, 400+hp and just over 700kg's