RE: PH Fleet: Jaguar XF Diesel S
Discussion
Was told by the guys in the factory wookshop that the common electronics across JLR are not the best !
When they did the last RROVER ad in the docks they had to change most of the engine electrics and the ecu's every night to get them to run the next day!
If you change any electronic piece under the bonnet you have to marry it to the ecu and re-prog !
Five-ten years down the line will be fun
When they did the last RROVER ad in the docks they had to change most of the engine electrics and the ecu's every night to get them to run the next day!
If you change any electronic piece under the bonnet you have to marry it to the ecu and re-prog !
Five-ten years down the line will be fun
Was told by the guys in the factory wookshop that the common electronics across JLR are not the best !
When they did the last RROVER ad in the docks they had to change most of the engine electrics and the ecu's every night to get them to run the next day!
If you change any electronic piece under the bonnet you have to marry it to the ecu and re-prog !
Five-ten years down the line will be fun
When they did the last RROVER ad in the docks they had to change most of the engine electrics and the ecu's every night to get them to run the next day!
If you change any electronic piece under the bonnet you have to marry it to the ecu and re-prog !
Five-ten years down the line will be fun
Not buying a type of car based on the perception of their drivers is surely ludicrous no?
I'd love to be in a world where sensible PH Jaguar drivers switched to German cars. Imagine a world of S4s and 530s with cushions and a box of Kleenex on the rear parcel shelf all driving considerately?
Ok, maybe not! :-)
I'd love to be in a world where sensible PH Jaguar drivers switched to German cars. Imagine a world of S4s and 530s with cushions and a box of Kleenex on the rear parcel shelf all driving considerately?
Ok, maybe not! :-)
jamespink said:
Blown2CV said:
StoatInACoat said:
He's not brilliant with things that don't work properly.
but who is?Jimbo. said:
Blown2CV said:
i love mine, but i have to agree with everything said. However if you think the current system is bad then you should try the pre-facelift!
If you're the kind of person who struggles with a Casio pocket calculator, maybe. Can't say it's ever bothered me...
t. 
StoatInACoat said:
rtz62 said:
Sorry, but why would I buy one over a competitor from Audi or BMW?
Er, I wouldn't.
Because for some the main appeal is that it isn't a BMW or Audi. It's a Jag.Er, I wouldn't.
Is the touchscreen issue going to be the same in a 2004ish XJR? I ask as my Dad is looking at these to replace his X300 (with a little help from me!) and I worry that something like that will drive him insane. He's not brilliant with things that don't work properly.
Edited by StoatInACoat on Wednesday 27th June 16:24
B10 said:
Oddball RS said:
I largely agree with everything you have just written, if blue and me works fine in a £10k Fiat there are NO excuses at all at £50k.
A colleague of mine tried a 2.2 for a few days and the electronics / contols drove him mad and he picked a specced up 320 (the new one)instead.
A little sad really.
I had a Fiat 500 for 3 years and the Blue and Me was not very good. Unreliable and temperamental. The car was was great. My current 2012 VW Golf with top of the range sat nav/DAB/ICE is OK but sometimes crashes and the iPOD interface stops working. Also some of the ergonomics are poor and longwinded. A similar system is used in A4s.A colleague of mine tried a 2.2 for a few days and the electronics / contols drove him mad and he picked a specced up 320 (the new one)instead.
A little sad really.
For me personally, Electronic Feature Content (hence forth referred to as simply EFC!) ruins many a potential great car.
EFC enables manufacturers to lure buys in with "must have" options, which frankly are little use to any one, and this means they can skimp on the rest of the car (and often they HAVE too, becuase they have blown the dev budget on the EFC!)
Ok, a simple Ipod interface, simply, easy to use Sat Nav, and Phone link are sensible and useful, but all this stuff like:
1) Electronic handbrakes - FFS, if you're too pathetic to be able to pull a small lever when you stop, or too incompetent to do a hill start then should you be driving at all?
2) Keyless entry - pointless, easy to loose, fraught with danger (remember to give the "key to the new driver etc), and really, how hard is it to push a small button as you walk up to a car, then put a key in a slot and twist it to drive off??)
3) Internet connectivity / remote telematics: Does anyone actually use any of this crap? really? Or just have a play around for 5mins after you have bought the car to never use it again?
4) Auto lights - again, if you want idiots to be able to drive, i suggest we start using monkeys.
5) Multiple chassis settings / dynamics modes: Ohh god, where to start! The reason you buy say a BMW is because they have a team of highly paid chassis engineers, with enough qualifications and experience between them to set up any car ever made, and here we are where normal everyday drivers (who we have already established are unable to even decide if they should switch their headlamps on!) are now having to set the car up themselves! Pointless. All that choice means that you will NEVER be in the right mode for any given situation. Rather than allowing the drivers to OPTIMISE the car, it actually results in pretty much un-optimum settings most of the time. And things like varriable throttle response? WTF? if i want to go faster i will just push my toe down a bit more, i don't need 15 modes each with a slightly different response to any given input. All that results in is confusion and non linearity, which the average driver is terrible at adapting for.
The problem is that EFC is easy to do, and crucially it is seen as a model and attribute designator, so OEM's that share platforms can use it to differentiate their various models from each other without causing any serious cost (the car just gets programmed with a different "end of line" setting, the hardware in the car is now practically identical between the base model and the top of the line model (because it actually costs more money to vary specs across a platform), and the additional EFC is just "enabled" when the owner coughs up the "options cash" !
SO, OEM's stop it! Just make good cars, thats all we want really!
EFC enables manufacturers to lure buys in with "must have" options, which frankly are little use to any one, and this means they can skimp on the rest of the car (and often they HAVE too, becuase they have blown the dev budget on the EFC!)
Ok, a simple Ipod interface, simply, easy to use Sat Nav, and Phone link are sensible and useful, but all this stuff like:
1) Electronic handbrakes - FFS, if you're too pathetic to be able to pull a small lever when you stop, or too incompetent to do a hill start then should you be driving at all?
2) Keyless entry - pointless, easy to loose, fraught with danger (remember to give the "key to the new driver etc), and really, how hard is it to push a small button as you walk up to a car, then put a key in a slot and twist it to drive off??)
3) Internet connectivity / remote telematics: Does anyone actually use any of this crap? really? Or just have a play around for 5mins after you have bought the car to never use it again?
4) Auto lights - again, if you want idiots to be able to drive, i suggest we start using monkeys.
5) Multiple chassis settings / dynamics modes: Ohh god, where to start! The reason you buy say a BMW is because they have a team of highly paid chassis engineers, with enough qualifications and experience between them to set up any car ever made, and here we are where normal everyday drivers (who we have already established are unable to even decide if they should switch their headlamps on!) are now having to set the car up themselves! Pointless. All that choice means that you will NEVER be in the right mode for any given situation. Rather than allowing the drivers to OPTIMISE the car, it actually results in pretty much un-optimum settings most of the time. And things like varriable throttle response? WTF? if i want to go faster i will just push my toe down a bit more, i don't need 15 modes each with a slightly different response to any given input. All that results in is confusion and non linearity, which the average driver is terrible at adapting for.
The problem is that EFC is easy to do, and crucially it is seen as a model and attribute designator, so OEM's that share platforms can use it to differentiate their various models from each other without causing any serious cost (the car just gets programmed with a different "end of line" setting, the hardware in the car is now practically identical between the base model and the top of the line model (because it actually costs more money to vary specs across a platform), and the additional EFC is just "enabled" when the owner coughs up the "options cash" !
SO, OEM's stop it! Just make good cars, thats all we want really!
Max_Torque said:
For me personally, Electronic Feature Content (hence forth referred to as simply EFC!) ruins many a potential great car.
EFC enables manufacturers to lure buys in with "must have" options, which frankly are little use to any one, and this means they can skimp on the rest of the car (and often they HAVE too, becuase they have blown the dev budget on the EFC!)
Ok, a simple Ipod interface, simply, easy to use Sat Nav, and Phone link are sensible and useful, but all this stuff like:
1) Electronic handbrakes - FFS, if you're too pathetic to be able to pull a small lever when you stop, or too incompetent to do a hill start then should you be driving at all?
2) Keyless entry - pointless, easy to loose, fraught with danger (remember to give the "key to the new driver etc), and really, how hard is it to push a small button as you walk up to a car, then put a key in a slot and twist it to drive off??)
3) Internet connectivity / remote telematics: Does anyone actually use any of this crap? really? Or just have a play around for 5mins after you have bought the car to never use it again?
4) Auto lights - again, if you want idiots to be able to drive, i suggest we start using monkeys.
5) Multiple chassis settings / dynamics modes: Ohh god, where to start! The reason you buy say a BMW is because they have a team of highly paid chassis engineers, with enough qualifications and experience between them to set up any car ever made, and here we are where normal everyday drivers (who we have already established are unable to even decide if they should switch their headlamps on!) are now having to set the car up themselves! Pointless. All that choice means that you will NEVER be in the right mode for any given situation. Rather than allowing the drivers to OPTIMISE the car, it actually results in pretty much un-optimum settings most of the time. And things like varriable throttle response? WTF? if i want to go faster i will just push my toe down a bit more, i don't need 15 modes each with a slightly different response to any given input. All that results in is confusion and non linearity, which the average driver is terrible at adapting for.
The problem is that EFC is easy to do, and crucially it is seen as a model and attribute designator, so OEM's that share platforms can use it to differentiate their various models from each other without causing any serious cost (the car just gets programmed with a different "end of line" setting, the hardware in the car is now practically identical between the base model and the top of the line model (because it actually costs more money to vary specs across a platform), and the additional EFC is just "enabled" when the owner coughs up the "options cash" !
SO, OEM's stop it! Just make good cars, thats all we want really!
You should try a Volvo. They have not ruined their cars with this stupid nonsense. EFC enables manufacturers to lure buys in with "must have" options, which frankly are little use to any one, and this means they can skimp on the rest of the car (and often they HAVE too, becuase they have blown the dev budget on the EFC!)
Ok, a simple Ipod interface, simply, easy to use Sat Nav, and Phone link are sensible and useful, but all this stuff like:
1) Electronic handbrakes - FFS, if you're too pathetic to be able to pull a small lever when you stop, or too incompetent to do a hill start then should you be driving at all?
2) Keyless entry - pointless, easy to loose, fraught with danger (remember to give the "key to the new driver etc), and really, how hard is it to push a small button as you walk up to a car, then put a key in a slot and twist it to drive off??)
3) Internet connectivity / remote telematics: Does anyone actually use any of this crap? really? Or just have a play around for 5mins after you have bought the car to never use it again?
4) Auto lights - again, if you want idiots to be able to drive, i suggest we start using monkeys.
5) Multiple chassis settings / dynamics modes: Ohh god, where to start! The reason you buy say a BMW is because they have a team of highly paid chassis engineers, with enough qualifications and experience between them to set up any car ever made, and here we are where normal everyday drivers (who we have already established are unable to even decide if they should switch their headlamps on!) are now having to set the car up themselves! Pointless. All that choice means that you will NEVER be in the right mode for any given situation. Rather than allowing the drivers to OPTIMISE the car, it actually results in pretty much un-optimum settings most of the time. And things like varriable throttle response? WTF? if i want to go faster i will just push my toe down a bit more, i don't need 15 modes each with a slightly different response to any given input. All that results in is confusion and non linearity, which the average driver is terrible at adapting for.
The problem is that EFC is easy to do, and crucially it is seen as a model and attribute designator, so OEM's that share platforms can use it to differentiate their various models from each other without causing any serious cost (the car just gets programmed with a different "end of line" setting, the hardware in the car is now practically identical between the base model and the top of the line model (because it actually costs more money to vary specs across a platform), and the additional EFC is just "enabled" when the owner coughs up the "options cash" !
SO, OEM's stop it! Just make good cars, thats all we want really!
The work thing I can think of in my V70 is the clock. You have to turn a little knob and hold for a few seconds before the time will change. It is a little tricky, but you only have to do it twice a year.
Seat heaters? One button each.
Headlight switch? Why turn them off!
Balance/fader/bass/treble? One little turny knob for each.
Perfect. And the most comfortable seats you can imagine.
The new XF is a very good looking car, and I have on many occasion mistaken it's front end for the new shape XJ.
However, when it comes to Jags, only XJs really do it for me.
So, in this class of car, I would definitely go for a 530d M Sport or E350 CDI Sport - a little more logical and intuitive inside!
OR, buy a used new model XJ diesel.
However, when it comes to Jags, only XJs really do it for me.
So, in this class of car, I would definitely go for a 530d M Sport or E350 CDI Sport - a little more logical and intuitive inside!
OR, buy a used new model XJ diesel.
Edited by pSyCoSiS on Wednesday 27th June 22:47
No end of electrical issues with our 59 plate XF - in fact it's in the dealer right now for about the 6th time this year. Sat nav not working, glovebox wouldn't stay closed, battery symbol kept coming on but battery fine, speakers stopped working, rear door wouldn't open, boot wouldn't open, headlight bulbs last about 3-4 months, park brake fault light regularly appears. Now that have ordered 640d we are attempting to hand it back and terminate lease early as by far the worst car we've ever owned. Shame as was reliable for first 12 months and is a joy when everything is working (rare these days).
cslwannabe said:
No end of electrical issues with our 59 plate XF - in fact it's in the dealer right now for about the 6th time this year. Sat nav not working, glovebox wouldn't stay closed, battery symbol kept coming on but battery fine, speakers stopped working, rear door wouldn't open, boot wouldn't open, headlight bulbs last about 3-4 months, park brake fault light regularly appears. Now that have ordered 640d we are attempting to hand it back and terminate lease early as by far the worst car we've ever owned. Shame as was reliable for first 12 months and is a joy when everything is working (rare these days).
st box, buy German and be done with it.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff