GT86 Full Autocar Road Test

[MC Bodge]

Gompo said:

MC Bodge said:

I thought I'd seen one approaching me the other day, but it turned out to be a Hyundai.

Really or are you trolling? From front on I think they're quite distinctive, in part due to their low bonnet line (for a new car), they also seem quite wide although that could be an optical illusion. Can't think of a Hyundai they look similar to from the front.

Genuinely. In the corner of my eye I saw a car approaching as I rode round a roundabout.

I've not seen one in the flesh and I thought it might have been a GT86. I'm interested in seeing one. When it got closer I realised my mistake.

I didn't have comparison photos with me, but they're hardly entirely different. The US market Genesis looks very similar..

[TameRacingDriver]

Someone in my estate has one. Does look very Hyundai-ish IMO. It does look quite nice though, but I'm starting to be of the opinion that it just doesn't have enough power to complement its looks.

I am starting to think this car just isn't good enough, £5K could buy you a tidy S2000 which will be much faster and has a much better engine, and for me, is also better looking. What did an S2K cost new?

[Gompo]

Fair enough. I'd have still been more expectant of seeing a GT86 rather than a Genesis though! Hyundai have been saying they're bringing it here for the last 3 years but bottled it, I don't imagine we will see them here officially.. possibly something they regret now.

[Dave Hedgehog]

TameRacingDriver said:

Someone in my estate has one. Does look very Hyundai-ish IMO. It does look quite nice though, but I'm starting to be of the opinion that it just doesn't have enough power to complement its looks.

I am starting to think this car just isn't good enough, £5K could buy you a tidy S2000 which will be much faster and has a much better engine, and for me, is also better looking. What did an S2K cost new?

30k if i remember correctly

[s m]

TameRacingDriver said:

I am starting to think this car just isn't good enough, £5K could buy you a tidy S2000 which will be much faster and has a much better engine, and for me, is also better looking. What did an S2K cost new?

Around about 27.5k new at the end( extra £500 for a GT ) - price increased new about 1k from 2001

[stargazer30]

MC Bodge said:

Gompo said:

MC Bodge said:

I thought I'd seen one approaching me the other day, but it turned out to be a Hyundai.

Really or are you trolling? From front on I think they're quite distinctive, in part due to their low bonnet line (for a new car), they also seem quite wide although that could be an optical illusion. Can't think of a Hyundai they look similar to from the front.

Genuinely. In the corner of my eye I saw a car approaching as I rode round a roundabout.

I've not seen one in the flesh and I thought it might have been a GT86. I'm interested in seeing one. When it got closer I realised my mistake.

I didn't have comparison photos with me, but they're hardly entirely different. The US market Genesis looks very similar..

+1 I did exactly the same and it was a hyundai, no idea what model though. I've seen the GT86 close up too. As soon as it got close I released it wasn't one but at a distance it fooled me.

[MarkRSi]

hornetrider said:

the-photographer said:

Maybe not fashionable for PH, but September What Car says:

1. Megane 265 Cup
2. Audi TT 2.0T
3. Subaru BRZ (plenty of flaws you'll love it on a twisty road)
4. GT86 (Not as agile as the BRZ, so has to settle for forth)

Given that the BRZ is supposedly more understeery than the GT86, and the TT is just a Golf in a dress, I'd say it's more of an insult to the Megane

Thing is the whole GT86 bashing/hating/mouth-foaming seems to be very fashionable on PH nowadays. I remember the Focus RS getting the same treatment in 2008/2009.

[StormLoaded]

the-photographer said:

Maybe not fashionable for PH, but September What Car says:

1. Megane 265 Cup
2. Audi TT 2.0T
3. Subaru BRZ (plenty of flaws you'll love it on a twisty road)
4. GT86 (Not as agile as the BRZ, so has to settle for forth)

hmmm.
i was watching this Toy v Sub vid the other day, two guys had different opinions!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uf-6rLVeR2o

Guy 1; was 1.3 sec quicker in the Toyota, and named it as his fave of the two (suited his driving style more)
Guy 2; was 1.1 sec quicker in the auto Subaru, and named it as his fave of the two (suited his driving style more)

[TameRacingDriver]

MarkRSi said:

Given that the BRZ is supposedly more understeery than the GT86, and the TT is just a Golf in a dress, I'd say it's more of an insult to the Megane

Thing is the whole GT86 bashing/hating/mouth-foaming seems to be very fashionable on PH nowadays. I remember the Focus RS getting the same treatment in 2008/2009.

To be honest, I wasn't one of the people who bashed it, but the more I read about it, the more underwhelming it actually seems to be, particularly if road tests are rating Clio 200s over it. I know the Clios are great hot hatches (I have one) but this was supposed to be a no holds barred sports car experience, which it may well be, but I don't know about anyone else, but fun is what I look for in a car.

I would love a go in one though just to make my own mind up, but some of the reviews are not overly enthusiastic (but others are).

Overwhelmingly the main complaint seems to be the performance of the engine. I have a feeling that it could be clinical in the way a lot of Jap cars can be.

[the-photographer]

TameRacingDriver said:

MarkRSi said:

Given that the BRZ is supposedly more understeery than the GT86, and the TT is just a Golf in a dress, I'd say it's more of an insult to the Megane

Thing is the whole GT86 bashing/hating/mouth-foaming seems to be very fashionable on PH nowadays. I remember the Focus RS getting the same treatment in 2008/2009.

To be honest, I wasn't one of the people who bashed it, but the more I read about it, the more underwhelming it actually seems to be, particularly if road tests are rating Clio 200s over it. I know the Clios are great hot hatches (I have one) but this was supposed to be a no holds barred sports car experience, which it may well be, but I don't know about anyone else, but fun is what I look for in a car.

I would love a go in one though just to make my own mind up, but some of the reviews are not overly enthusiastic (but others are).

Overwhelmingly the main complaint seems to be the performance of the engine. I have a feeling that it could be clinical in the way a lot of Jap cars can be.

I was just posting the What Car table...

Both the TT and Megane are faster in the What car acceleration tests, a second or more in sprint and all gears.

I'll quote from the "Riding and Handling" section;

"Put all four cars on the same twisty road and the BRZ/GT86 will be left for dead. The TT and Megane grip so much harder.... In terms of pure ability, then the BRZ/GT86 are outclassed.

"The problem for the BRZ/GT86 is that their more capable rivals arent exactly dull to drive"

Please complain to [e-mail]

[TameRacingDriver]

We're pretty much in agreement, are we not?

[MarkRSi]

TameRacingDriver said:

To be honest, I wasn't one of the people who bashed it, but the more I read about it, the more underwhelming it actually seems to be, particularly if road tests are rating Clio 200s over it. I know the Clios are great hot hatches (I have one) but this was supposed to be a no holds barred sports car experience, which it may well be, but I don't know about anyone else, but fun is what I look for in a car.

I would love a go in one though just to make my own mind up, but some of the reviews are not overly enthusiastic (but others are).

Overwhelmingly the main complaint seems to be the performance of the engine. I have a feeling that it could be clinical in the way a lot of Jap cars can be.

No worries, I wasn't aiming at anyone in particular. Thing is I've test driven both the GT86 and 265 Cup and have to admit I found the Megane more impressive and can see myself getting either a 250 or 265 cup as my next car. I've never driven a powerful petrol turbo car before though.

Don't get me wrong though they're both great cars, and in all honesty compared to my MR2 Roadster (a 5-star Evo car) the GT86 felt nearly as agile (impressive as it's got it's engine in the front) and was a bit quicker in a straight line, although felt the gear ratios were too long. Perhaps I couldn't see myself spending 25k on something that's similar to the MR2 just a little more practical?

Although after a few years no doubt I'll be bored of the FWD and effortless turbo power and want something RWD with a responsive and revvy N/A engine. Probably japanese too. I just wonder what sort of car I could get...

[SonicHedgeHog]

I think the perceived performance shortfall is due to the torquey turbo charged engines fitted to virtually every affordable, practical performance car. They make the performance so accessible. You have to work this engine to get the performace and I love that.

Interestingly, has anyone ever read a road test where a turbo charged engine is described as 'thrilling' or 'exciting'?. I don't think I have and I read a lot of car mags. Road testers frequently compliment turbo charged cars on their power, torque and fuel economy, but they're not in the same league as a Type R Honda or an M BMW. I'm not sure how good this boxer engine is, but for me 200 NA horsepower beats 300 turbocharged horsepower every time.

[0000]

I saw one in Cheltenham yesterday. It was in traffic so didn't get much of an impression beyond the looks.

[MarkRSi]

SonicHedgeHog said:

I think the perceived performance shortfall is due to the torquey turbo charged engines fitted to virtually every affordable, practical performance car. They make the performance so accessible. You have to work this engine to get the performace and I love that.

Interestingly, has anyone ever read a road test where a turbo charged engine is described as 'thrilling' or 'exciting'?. I don't think I have and I read a lot of car mags. Road testers frequently compliment turbo charged cars on their power, torque and fuel economy, but they're not in the same league as a Type R Honda or an M BMW. I'm not sure how good this boxer engine is, but for me 200 NA horsepower beats 300 turbocharged horsepower every time.

I'd actually say it's an accurate description of the 265's motor, I found it quite brutal in it's delivery. All I can say is try one yourself.

And it's not easily accessible either. The GT86 (and VTEC motors) will pull steadily below 3000rpm, while the Megane felt gutless as only above 3000 does the turbo wake up. I like it since it gives it a jekyll and hyde character

In the other hand I've had a couple rides in cars with VAG's 2.0T (mk5 Golf GTi, Scirocco). Smooth, but utterly devoid of any sort of character.

Edited by MarkRSi on Saturday 11th August 19:12

[otolith]

MarkRSi said:

Although after a few years no doubt I'll be bored of the FWD and effortless turbo power and want something RWD with a responsive and revvy N/A engine. Probably japanese too. I just wonder what sort of car I could get...

If Evo and their ilk succeed in killing off the resurgence in the genre, probably fk all.

[SonicHedgeHog]

MarkRSi said:

I'd actually say it's an accurate description of the 265's motor, I found it quite brutal in it's delivery. All I can say is try one yourself.

And it's not easily accessible either. The GT86 (and VTEC motors) will pull steadily below 3000rpm, while the Megane felt gutless as only above 3000 does the turbo wake up. I like it since it gives it a jekyll and hyde character

In the other hand I've had a couple rides in cars with VAG's 2.0T (mk5 Golf GTi, Scirocco). Smooth, but utterly devoid of any sort of character.

Edited by MarkRSi on Saturday 11th August 19:12

Mmm, "brutal" isn't what I'm after. I'm looking for precision. The sense that the engineers were told to find power without cheating and whacking on a turbo. My CTR used to sing at 8000rpm and I really miss that. I'm hoping this Toyota has a bit of that magic or I'm going to have to think about buying quite an old car in the knowledge that nothing else will ever be built like it again.

[stargazer30]

MarkRSi said:

Don't get me wrong though they're both great cars, and in all honesty compared to my MR2 Roadster (a 5-star Evo car) the GT86 felt nearly as agile (impressive as it's got it's engine in the front) and was a bit quicker in a straight line, although felt the gear ratios were too long. Perhaps I couldn't see myself spending 25k on something that's similar to the MR2 just a little more practical?

No what you want to do wack a turbo on the MR2 and spent a little bit on better bracing then you'll have fun, cheap, good handling and faster than the french front tyre shredder or halfords WD40 toyota

[MarkRSi]

SonicHedgeHog said:

Mmm, "brutal" isn't what I'm after. I'm looking for precision. The sense that the engineers were told to find power without cheating and whacking on a turbo. My CTR used to sing at 8000rpm and I really miss that. I'm hoping this Toyota has a bit of that magic or I'm going to have to think about buying quite an old car in the knowledge that nothing else will ever be built like it again.

I did find it very difficult to modulate the 265s turbo output in the "Sport" mode, not so much for traction (in the dry at least, still credit due to how effective the LSD is) but for making smooth progress. Supposedly you can get a 'RenaultSport Monitor' to make the throttle mapping less extreme, although I can't expect it be as precise as the previous N/A cars I've driven. Then again the in-your-face turbo response does have it's appeal

I'm sure if you approach the GT86 expecting a lightweight RWD coupe with just enough power from it's revvy engine to be fun you won't be disappointed

stargazer30 said:

MarkRSi said:

Don't get me wrong though they're both great cars, and in all honesty compared to my MR2 Roadster (a 5-star Evo car) the GT86 felt nearly as agile (impressive as it's got it's engine in the front) and was a bit quicker in a straight line, although felt the gear ratios were too long. Perhaps I couldn't see myself spending 25k on something that's similar to the MR2 just a little more practical?

No what you want to do wack a turbo on the MR2 and spent a little bit on better bracing then you'll have fun, cheap, good handling and faster than the french front tyre shredder or halfords WD40 toyota

Don't tempt me!

[s m]

otolith said:

MarkRSi said:

Although after a few years no doubt I'll be bored of the FWD and effortless turbo power and want something RWD with a responsive and revvy N/A engine. Probably japanese too. I just wonder what sort of car I could get...

If Evo and their ilk succeed in killing off the resurgence in the genre, probably fk all.

I guess EVO have to speak as they find, plus ultimately it's just their opinion. You'd have to say they're not against the 'ethos' after the group test in the latest mag, just maybe the new car is more restricted by current climate constraints than the older cars it was compared to. Plus they were legends in their own right so tough competition. Seems as close as we get with a new car anyway according to EVO, Top Gear and Car tests. I wonder if they will fine tune it with evolutions over the lifespan......