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456lbft

289 posts

96 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
KDIcarmad said:


Above is the VW GX3 concept that Lotus help to make work, this is not the only three wheeler they also made the electric Zap Alias electric car go round corners..(not sold in the UK sorry...)



Morgan has shown there is a demand for three wheelers. Now a Lotus three wheeler, to fit below the Elise sound a bit crazy. The above shows Lotus could do it. Would you buy one?
Yes, yes, yes, but I'm mad for a torque vector steered fwd electric 3 wheeler that wouldn't even have a steering wheel, I could just steer it with a joystick, or even an iphone app!! Oh dear I think I've been out in the rain too long...I'll get back in my box...

Tuna

4,512 posts

153 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
Hellbound said:
Lethargy has overcome me this evening so this is going to be somewhat brief; You've outlined exactly what's been nagging me about these Lotus semi hit-jobs. Sadly most PHer responses are just as linear.
That makes at least three of us thinking this.

The reason we get the same old rubbish spouted in these forums is that the people who're in the know and who could actually help form opinion about Lotus come out with empty headed articles like the one here. Why is it so hard to do some decent analysis of Lotus, when the facts have been gone over time and time again?

The crap about build quality (did anyone come out with 'Loads of Trouble..' yet?), building an MX-5 competitor, prices when compared against other cars and so on, comes out in every thread - doesn't that reflect a complete failure of this site in actually talking about the state of Lotus?

footsoldier

481 posts

61 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
nckr55 said:
Ex White Evora owner, right ? Did you not have that for a short time, then go Quattroporte?

Either way, look forward to seeing a new Exige around Edin !
Yes - QP is about to go up for sale. Not a direct swap for the Exige though!

Not sure what to replace it (QP) with yet, but the Edinburgh roadworks finally got the better of me in a car that size...


pycraft

54 posts

53 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
There is a word that no-one's used around here. The absence of this word is unsurprising in the atmosphere around here, which is often vaguely reminiscent of beards and real ale. That word is glamour.

Where I work (large company), the overwhelming number of owners of 2-seater sports cars are women in their 40s. TTs and MX5s mostly, but more than a few Boxsters. As someone (Goodwin?) in one of the car mags pointed out recently, Lotus make cars which appear to be of no interest to women.

Lotus has had a few periods when it caught the public imagination; in the 60s when it was Emma Peel's car in The Avengers, in the 70s with James Bond and Giugiaro Esprits, and in the 80s when Stevens Esprits appeared in Pretty Woman and Basic Instinct. People here may not like this; apparently Esprit sales tripled in the year Pretty Woman came out. And this has an impact on related models; I remember parking an Excel a few years ago and overhearing a father and son. "What's that car, dad?" "That's James Bond's car, son". I felt a mile high.

THIS is what Lotus needs; I know everyone like to kick Dany B (you could never imagine him appealing to the Real Ale crowd), but I think he understood this. Most people who buy sportscars want glamour, not performance and handling; if sellign to these people means you can build the cars you want then that's what you have to do. Kim Kardashian drives a 458; like her or not, that's a sale to Maranello. The Evora really needs some serious product placement in the US, and Lotus needs to build a car designed to be easy to get into and out of elegantly, has an easy-to-assemble hood, looks great. Then that can bankroll the striped-out models people around here want to drive.

falconhoof

144 posts

13 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
The Crack Fox said:
Hybrid Evora ? Oh FFS, what a way to burn money they don't have.

I'm a tad concerned that the impending range is merging into 1, they have roughly the same tub and comparable driving dynamics repackaged too many times (Elise/Exige/Evora, all hard top, all cabrio), that's 6 cars when demand is probably only for 2 (Hot Elise, well specced Evora). How much money could they save if they made just 2 cars and built the business model around that ? Have a 'skunkworks' (turnipworks ? - part of their engineering arm) to do customisation for wealthy clients who want 1 off special stuff, encourage owners to use the lovely new track there more often, drop dreams of selling thousands, focus on what they're good at !

I wish them every success, I really do. smile
Indeed crackfox, they should make an esprit,make it something very special with a completely new look without holding back,spy style!, get it in a bond film, turbo engine, lightness, handling, stealth! reckon it helped aston a bit, no brainer, but they don't have the readies!
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VxDuncan

2,746 posts

103 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
Here's an idea - Use the lotus bonded chassis technology to build a smart roadster alternative. With a small (70-100hp) three pot or twin-air type engine and manual box. It could be one (if not the) most fuel efficient car on the market. Aim it at the rich teenage market - you know the ones with wealthy parents and want alternative to a corsa. If you could do it for say £15k if think it would sell well. Lotus had toyed with polycarbonate shells before, this plus a lightweight engine and smaller chassis might just get you into B1 vehicle class (under 550kg), where I believe further cost savings could be made. May be a way round the new EU regulations coming in for ESC, TPMS etc.

NickGibbs

410 posts

100 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
cathalm said:
On the article itself. I really am becoming disappointed in the quality of PH journalism, particularly as regards Lotus. PH writers, you are professionals, it is your job to inform. Lotus does not only sell cars in the UK, quoting UK only figures is a nonsensical approach which I must assume you take deliberately to suit a narrative. Even worse, the reason for these figures is well known and in the public domain. You choose not to inform readers though.

After the DRB takeover Lotus suspended manufacturing totally for many months to comply with the Malaysian law on acquisitions. If you knew this and chose not mention it then that is clearly misinforming to paint a deliberately negative picture. If you didn't know then frankly you should think about standards. This following PH very prominently pushing the Joe Saward story on Bahar awhile back with a narrative of "Lotus is in trouble", rather than "employee of Tony Fernandes puts out fake news story intended to damage rival". That would have been more enlightening.

I don't suggest bias, but I do suggest that the impending demise of Lotus has become the latest ongoing soap opera story of the motoring press (stoked by Bahars behaviour) and PH is pushing this story for all its worth. It used to be the case that drivers could read PH for informed stories on sports cars, now it is becoming very obviously ill informed or provocative journalism intended to start the kind of "my brand is better than yours" playground fights that now dominate the forums.

I whinge because actually I've enjoyed PH for a long time. I don't really enjoy the motoring version of The Sun quite so much. You have the budget to pay Chris Harris to compare the latest Renault Twizy and then a Massey Ferguson tractor to a 911 week in week out, why not reach out to someone like Dicky Meaden or even Cathpole to contribute? If not I assume the next step will be Richard Porter belching spite like a schoolboy on these pages and PH becoming Top Gear online.
At the risk of wading in here, your accusations are a little unfair. Lotus has not stopped production. Any law that demanded that post takeover would be an ass.

I asked Lotus what global sales were. They declined to comment. Fair enough, but any manufacturer who sees their home market plummet by two thirds is by definition in trouble, especially when similarly niche brands like Bentley are doing fine here.

Talking of two-thirds, that's the proportion of the article that was positive about Lotus. Your favourite writers aren't going to help you out with the final third. Only Lotus itself can do that and that means answering questions, even the difficult ones.

falconhoof

144 posts

13 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
A stealthy edgy re-bodied evora in carbon fibre with a turbo four pot,and dare I say it room for big people to drive it, I am 6"6"!, a budget aston sort of style ken!

falconhoof

144 posts

13 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
Put engine from new astra VXR into said Esprit, make it 300bhp, and 1 tonne in mass, and to france with compromise! Stealth, bond, james bond!

falconhoof

144 posts

13 months

[news] 
Friday 6th July 2012 quote quote all
VxDuncan said:
Here's an idea - Use the lotus bonded chassis technology to build a smart roadster alternative. With a small (70-100hp) three pot or twin-air type engine and manual box. It could be one (if not the) most fuel efficient car on the market. Aim it at the rich teenage market - you know the ones with wealthy parents and want alternative to a corsa. If you could do it for say £15k if think it would sell well. Lotus had toyed with polycarbonate shells before, this plus a lightweight engine and smaller chassis might just get you into B1 vehicle class (under 550kg), where I believe further cost savings could be made. May be a way round the new EU regulations coming in for ESC, TPMS etc.
Esprit, and this^ , keep platforms, change image, spy style!!!

harryowl

977 posts

50 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
NickGibbs said:
At the risk of wading in here, your accusations are a little unfair. Lotus has not stopped production. Any law that demanded that post takeover would be an ass.

I asked Lotus what global sales were. They declined to comment. Fair enough, but any manufacturer who sees their home market plummet by two thirds is by definition in trouble, especially when similarly niche brands like Bentley are doing fine here.

Talking of two-thirds, that's the proportion of the article that was positive about Lotus. Your favourite writers aren't going to help you out with the final third. Only Lotus itself can do that and that means answering questions, even the difficult ones.
Lotus DID stop production and it WAS due to Malasyian legislation- You (Pistonheads) even did an article covering it.
http://www.pistonheads.com/lotus/default.asp?story...


peter450

1,324 posts

102 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
falconhoof said:
Put engine from new astra VXR into said Esprit, make it 300bhp, and 1 tonne in mass, and to france with compromise! Stealth, bond, james bond!
Nobody wants a 4 pot supercar

otolith

19,408 posts

73 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
peter450 said:
Nobody wants a 4 pot supercar
That may well be true, I don't, but shouldn't someone tell Jaguar?

peter450

1,324 posts

102 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
otolith said:
peter450 said:
Nobody wants a 4 pot supercar
That may well be true, I don't, but shouldn't someone tell Jaguar?
Going on past supercar form, i doubt they'd listen

cathalm

567 posts

113 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
NickGibbs said:
At the risk of wading in here, your accusations are a little unfair. Lotus has not stopped production. Any law that demanded that post takeover would be an ass.

I asked Lotus what global sales were. They declined to comment. Fair enough, but any manufacturer who sees their home market plummet by two thirds is by definition in trouble, especially when similarly niche brands like Bentley are doing fine here.

Talking of two-thirds, that's the proportion of the article that was positive about Lotus. Your favourite writers aren't going to help you out with the final third. Only Lotus itself can do that and that means answering questions, even the difficult ones.
Hold on Mr Gibbs, the fact is that Lotus stopped production for several months. During an acquisition Malaysian law states that investment funds must be frozen while due diligence takes place. During this period Lotus were unable to draw down committed funds necessary to continue production. This is a widely publicised fact. Pretty much every rival publication has reported this already (google is your friend).This is also the reason for the sudden drop off in sales. I find it extraordinary that you don't know this and then when you are called on it, you still don't bother to do your research.

When the mandated period was over, Lotus were able to draw down funds, pay suppliers and resume production which is where we are now.

I don't ask as a reader that you "help me out" by being unduly positive, I expect that if you are reporting on a subject that you do a modicum of research first. It's not about being positive or negative, it's about being accurate and professional. They don't give you international sales figures? Well the size of the overall order book and it's break down by model has already been revealed. Where is this in the story? It might have helped paint a more accurate picture.

I'm sorry but this is very poor and you open yourself up to criticism if you get the facts wrong so publicly.

Kolbenkopp

428 posts

20 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
VxDuncan said:
Here's an idea - Use the lotus bonded chassis technology to build a smart roadster alternative. With a small (70-100hp) three pot or twin-air type engine and manual box. It could be one (if not the) most fuel efficient car on the market. Aim it at the rich teenage market - you know the ones with wealthy parents and want alternative to a corsa. If you could do it for say £15k if think it would sell well. Lotus had toyed with polycarbonate shells before, this plus a lightweight engine and smaller chassis might just get you into B1 vehicle class (under 550kg), where I believe further cost savings could be made. May be a way round the new EU regulations coming in for ESC, TPMS etc.
Really like the idea, not sure if a price of £15k and sub 550kg is realistic though. And 550kg seems difficult with current EU regulations... The PC shell woul help a lot, the GRP clams are fragile. I think you can't really sell an Elise to someone who has to parallel park on the street a lot. Most younger drivers living in a city have to...

The Elise and the Lotus brand have a good image with the Playstation generation I think (they know the cars from in game). That audience can't afford a 3rd car though. Needs to be a bit more practical and cheaper.

The Elise costs around €38k here. For that money you can e.g. buy two new 2.0 MX-5s or one z4 sdrive28i. No wonder Lotus only sold 84 cars in 2011 in Germany.

Edited by Kolbenkopp on Saturday 7th July 02:40

Big Six

37 posts

16 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
It is not a mystery why Lotus sells no cars. I have said it before & I will say it again. No one in there write mind is going to pay 60k for a car with an engine that you can pick up from your local scrap yard for £50!

Look at Morgan. They are doing it correctly. In the bigger cars they use BMW engines. Morgan has waiting list measured in years!

Lotus is dead.

falconhoof

144 posts

13 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
peter450 said:
falconhoof said:
Put engine from new astra VXR into said Esprit, make it 300bhp, and 1 tonne in mass, and to france with compromise! Stealth, bond, james bond!
Nobody wants a 4 pot supercar
Says who?

peter450

1,324 posts

102 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
Says the market, how many 4 pot supercars have been truely sucessful??

0a

8,452 posts

63 months

[news] 
Saturday 7th July 2012 quote quote all
Here's how Lotus can get back in the black and have a big pot of funds for developing sports cars:

1. Do deal with range rover
2. Buy loads of white range rovers and rebadge as lotus
3. Put lotus bits and bobs on it eg wheels and turbo script (who cares if it's supercharged).
4. Book tour of middle east
5. Play James Bond films in the background

They would sell loads. Rather far away from the whole "lightness" thing though...
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