RE: PH Blog: Why modern cars are too confusing
Discussion
Canningmister said:
I don't personally see why people buy any MPV which doesn't have 7 seats...what was wrong with a nice estate?
Ease of ingress/egress. Private new car buyers are likely to be pretty geriatric these days. Just look at how many MPVs you see driven by empty nesters with a bicycle rack on the towbar, outside rush hour traffic. 900T-R said:
Canningmister said:
I don't personally see why people buy any MPV which doesn't have 7 seats...what was wrong with a nice estate?
Ease of ingress/egress. Private new car buyers are likely to be pretty geriatric these days. Just look at how many MPVs you see driven by empty nesters with a bicycle rack on the towbar, outside rush hour traffic. 900T-R said:
Ease of ingress/egress. Private new car buyers are likely to be pretty geriatric these days. Just look at how many MPVs you see driven by empty nesters with a bicycle rack on the towbar, outside rush hour traffic.
Yeah I know where your coming from, but I just wonder what people were thinking in the dealership when they handed over their money for a something like a beige Citroen Picasso C3...Not confusing at all for one of the MINI range.
When you see a MINI with a red roof you know in an instant it's probably going to go flying past you - because 'only' the factory John Cooper Works has this option and can have a red roof (& mirror caps).
How do I know? I've just got one of the last ones built (new engine going in later models this year which has keener mpg and better emissions, but I don't give a jot for emissions and mpg!)
When you see a MINI with a red roof you know in an instant it's probably going to go flying past you - because 'only' the factory John Cooper Works has this option and can have a red roof (& mirror caps).
How do I know? I've just got one of the last ones built (new engine going in later models this year which has keener mpg and better emissions, but I don't give a jot for emissions and mpg!)
Edited by dandarez on Friday 13th July 10:40
LuS1fer said:
MPVs tend to be shorter than an estate, they have a higher seat position, they are more suited to 3 rows of seats with a higher roofline, often more versatile with features like sliding doors. I've had am MPV, I've never wanted an estate.
Thats perfectly justified for an MPV which has all of them features, and of course everyone is entitled to their own choice. But what about MPV's or the chunkier hatchbacks that fail to have any of these features, or a choice of 7 seats. Like a Mercedes B Class or an Skoda Yeti.. 
Just try ordering a Porsche, go on, go to the configurator at their website. Apparently if I want a dark grey strip to the top the of the windscreen on my Cayman (its on the options but I have no choice but to have it apparently) then I MUST order floor mats. I mean what the F**K do tinted screens and floor mats have in common ! Anyone Anyone ?
More means worse.
Anyway, it is less and less possible to tailor a car to one's own tastes. Take Mercedes-Benz. The colour palette is much more limited than it was 20 years ago, even including the designo finishes. Way back when, there were about 12 standard colours, 12 special colours and 10 metallic colours and only one of them was grey. Now you can have light metallic grey, dark metallic grey or bluish metallic grey. You cannot order any solid colour other than black, white or sometimes red. Gone are the lovely natural greens and browns. Likewise the interior. 20years ago you could have cloth, sport check cloth, velours, tex, leather, soft leather or sporty leather in one of eight hues (black, grey, blue, mushroom, tan, brown, green or medium red) with interior plastics and headlining to match. Now you can have black. Or maybe grey. You cannot order an E-Class with coloured trim. You can have coloured seats, but everything else must be coal hole black. If you want your E-Class with six cylinders in its engine, you cannot order a comfortable, sensible, modest specification: you have to have Avantgarde or Sport trim with a host of crap you neither need nor want. If you want child seats, you have to have black seats. And so on. And the quality is s
t.
Anyway, it is less and less possible to tailor a car to one's own tastes. Take Mercedes-Benz. The colour palette is much more limited than it was 20 years ago, even including the designo finishes. Way back when, there were about 12 standard colours, 12 special colours and 10 metallic colours and only one of them was grey. Now you can have light metallic grey, dark metallic grey or bluish metallic grey. You cannot order any solid colour other than black, white or sometimes red. Gone are the lovely natural greens and browns. Likewise the interior. 20years ago you could have cloth, sport check cloth, velours, tex, leather, soft leather or sporty leather in one of eight hues (black, grey, blue, mushroom, tan, brown, green or medium red) with interior plastics and headlining to match. Now you can have black. Or maybe grey. You cannot order an E-Class with coloured trim. You can have coloured seats, but everything else must be coal hole black. If you want your E-Class with six cylinders in its engine, you cannot order a comfortable, sensible, modest specification: you have to have Avantgarde or Sport trim with a host of crap you neither need nor want. If you want child seats, you have to have black seats. And so on. And the quality is s
t.OK, so the list of options on new cars that I have absolutely no interest in is now huge - satnav, heated steering wheels, etc. But there are also a few that have died away over the years that I really miss when spotting newer cars, so I suppose I am contradicting myself slightly by saying I have very little interest in gadgetry. It's just the old school stuff that still appeals maybe:
- Headlight wipers, which to me make any car look infinitely cooler
- Branded hifi. Now I know the new integrated ones are produced by the big players, but I miss the days of Alpine, Blaupunkt, Nakamichi and Becker logos in the dash
- The sunroof, especially the tilt & slide. Who needs aircon when you can be motoring down the road catching wasps?
- Proper 80s LCD or LED on-board computer. Especially the ones in the Mk2 Golf GTis. Because everyone wanted to know their average speed
- Central locking. OK so this is a staple now, but I still remember when this was an option on many cars. If you had to check whether your mate's locked the door, or remembered to keep the handle up in various Fords and Toyotas, then it's just not cool enough! Although maybe that changed when the 968 CS came out, and it became cooler not to have it?
- The bee-sting aerial. How else do you tell a 16v from an 8v? Who needs an integrated one in the rear window!
- Headlight wipers, which to me make any car look infinitely cooler
- Branded hifi. Now I know the new integrated ones are produced by the big players, but I miss the days of Alpine, Blaupunkt, Nakamichi and Becker logos in the dash
- The sunroof, especially the tilt & slide. Who needs aircon when you can be motoring down the road catching wasps?
- Proper 80s LCD or LED on-board computer. Especially the ones in the Mk2 Golf GTis. Because everyone wanted to know their average speed
- Central locking. OK so this is a staple now, but I still remember when this was an option on many cars. If you had to check whether your mate's locked the door, or remembered to keep the handle up in various Fords and Toyotas, then it's just not cool enough! Although maybe that changed when the 968 CS came out, and it became cooler not to have it?
- The bee-sting aerial. How else do you tell a 16v from an 8v? Who needs an integrated one in the rear window!
Paint - is down to recycling regs/laws - you can use a higher quantity of recycled material in grey/silver/black paint than you can in bright colours, hence why so many choices are dull now.
(add in the 'silver is best for resale' lie that's been peddled for years)
Interior trim - assume to 'protect the brand' and stop people speccing eye-watering combinations.
'Packages' - are to try and manage the ever-multiplying list of possible combinations that are a production schedulers nightmare. But yes, I've seen some odd ones too.
A good point above - why can't you buy a big engine in a wafty, comfortable car anymore (think Omega V6, 406 V6, etc.) - mfrs seem to have decided that if you want a lot of power you must want 'sporty' (=stiff) suspension and stupidly-big alloys which further destroy the ride quality.
(Maybe there's a lone 550i SE knocking around on 16"s somewhere, but I doubt it...)
(add in the 'silver is best for resale' lie that's been peddled for years)
Interior trim - assume to 'protect the brand' and stop people speccing eye-watering combinations.
'Packages' - are to try and manage the ever-multiplying list of possible combinations that are a production schedulers nightmare. But yes, I've seen some odd ones too.
A good point above - why can't you buy a big engine in a wafty, comfortable car anymore (think Omega V6, 406 V6, etc.) - mfrs seem to have decided that if you want a lot of power you must want 'sporty' (=stiff) suspension and stupidly-big alloys which further destroy the ride quality.
(Maybe there's a lone 550i SE knocking around on 16"s somewhere, but I doubt it...)
V8Triumph said:
I *hate* new cars and personally don't see the point in any of the gadgets. Who needs built in sat nav or climate control? Buy a map (or a tomtom) and put your bloody (wind up) window down instead.
Can tell you don't live in a country where it's 34 degrees and humidity of 90 percent. Wind the window down (and I do have them in my crappy little car) at this time of the year over here and you instantly get bathed in luxurious turkish steam bath style sweaty hot air, great for your skin, bad for your shirts on the way to work....
Other than that, totally agree with you! Traction Control, pah, that's what your right foot is for......
Do Wiesmann still do their cars with windy windows? "Less to go wrong" I seem to remember Clarkson saying on Top Gear....
DE15 CAT said:
Dave Hedgehog said:
you think this is bad, try and buy toothpaste
theres 13 trillion types now !!
What about coffee, I just say ''I want what used to be called coffee with some milk in it'' the look I get from those snooty drink servers.theres 13 trillion types now !!
Whos fault is this though? Partly the car companys offering lots of choice (is this a bad thing?), partly the customer for wanting things like the smallest engine, but it must have the sports trim so everyone thinks you can afford the expensive car but without paying for it, and finaly jurnos, for the whole "you must have satnav and leather and this paint or you'll never sell it!" even though unless its a company car people don't need them.
XJ40 said:
Oh yes, love an eighties cheese digi-dash I have to say. Unreliable and kitsch but a fun period feature.
I think you need to fasten your seatbelt there 
Yeah, they're pretty cool too. Also love the ones in the Quattro 20v, although scary biscuits when they go wrong I'd say
Nowhere near on the same scale as that, but my lowly 6-button OBC went on the blink, as they leak if you actually use them and new ones are NLA from the manufacturers! Got a replacement one sourced from some lad in California recently for $40, popped it on and off we go again. Result! Gotta love eBay for older cars
Edited by Leins on Friday 13th July 12:17
I totally agree with this topic.
Whilst choice is brilliant, it also devalues status. For example - in 1988 you could visually tell a VW Golf GL from a GTi because of some simple things:
Alloy wheels
Chin spoiler
Red pinstripe grille
Lowered suspension
Roof level boot spoiler
Twin exhausts
And that was about it.
Nowadays - all of those things that are special have become open to all.
On top of this you could fix older cars so much more easily. I drove to work today with an OBD2 scanner linked into my 10 year old BMW 325Ci to examine why it had 4 error codes recorded.
Whilst choice is brilliant, it also devalues status. For example - in 1988 you could visually tell a VW Golf GL from a GTi because of some simple things:
Alloy wheels
Chin spoiler
Red pinstripe grille
Lowered suspension
Roof level boot spoiler
Twin exhausts
And that was about it.
Nowadays - all of those things that are special have become open to all.
On top of this you could fix older cars so much more easily. I drove to work today with an OBD2 scanner linked into my 10 year old BMW 325Ci to examine why it had 4 error codes recorded.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff