RE: PH Carpool: Hawk Stratos
Discussion
ChrisJ. said:
Ftumpch said:
But have you looked into getting a Dino engine? I would have thought the Alfa unit would be a little too refined for a car like this...
Getting hold of a Dino engine with the required gearbox would cost a small fortune.You could easily have £15k just in the engine and box alone.
A 308/Mondial engine and box would be more affordable, but still way more expensive than an Alfa V6.
You can now buy a Stratos kit that uses most of the running gear from a Mondial.
One or two replicas have been built with Dino engines, but two of those cars have been converted back to run a cheaper engine.
One of those two cars has already been mentioned here - the one with the Thema V8 (red Hawk with gold wheels)
And on that note, is there any such thing a a replica of a Ferrari Dino? I've seen some terrible ones on VW beetle chassis, but surely with values climbing some might appear - and an Alfa v6 in one of those would be just the ticket!
Ftumpch said:
I guess so... but then I'm wondering how much it would add to the value of a replica to put a "genuine" engine in it.
And on that note, is there any such thing a a replica of a Ferrari Dino? I've seen some terrible ones on VW beetle chassis, but surely with values climbing some might appear - and an Alfa v6 in one of those would be just the ticket!
It would add a lot to the value.And on that note, is there any such thing a a replica of a Ferrari Dino? I've seen some terrible ones on VW beetle chassis, but surely with values climbing some might appear - and an Alfa v6 in one of those would be just the ticket!
In the case of the second Hawk with Dino engine and box that I mentioned, the car ended up having to be sold without the engine, because it was worth almost as much as the rest of the car. The car (in Pirelli colours) now has a 12v 3.0 Alfa 164 engine. It's £12k v £1500, but the same 190bhp power.
The Deon 246 Dino replica bodies must have been moulded from a crash damaged and repaired original car, because the front and rear sections droop. Some of the shape has been lost too. I know where you can get an accurate Ferrari Dino body, albeit in GRP.
Here's a Deon compared to an original:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/32/deonauthen...
ADM06 said:
A car as good looking as a stratos deserves a v8. No matter how much I think about it a v6 just isn't a proper engine.
I own a Hawk Stratos with a 3 Litre, Alfa V6 engine. I also own a Maserati 4200CC with a 4.2 V8.I disagree with your opinion. The Alfa V6 is much more urgent on acceleration. More in keeping with the original Dino V6 engines. A V8 is far too languid for a Stratos, even a replica one such as a Hawk.
Edited by Blib on Saturday 21st July 21:40
Blib said:
I own a Hawk Stratos with a 3 Litre, Alfa V6 engine. I also own a Maserati 4200CC with a 4.2 V8.
I disagree with your opinion. The Alfa V6 is much more urgent on acceleration. More in keeping with the original Dino V6 engines. A V8 is far too languid for a Stratos, even a replica one such as a Hawk.
I cannot for the life of me think of a v6 that makes decent power for its size. They are just by nature unbalanced and wobbly.I disagree with your opinion. The Alfa V6 is much more urgent on acceleration. More in keeping with the original Dino V6 engines. A V8 is far too languid for a Stratos, even a replica one such as a Hawk.
Edited by Blib on Saturday 21st July 21:40
ADM06 said:
I cannot for the life of me think of a v6 that makes decent power for its size. They are just by nature unbalanced and wobbly.
Ask Renault's F1 engine bods. Perhaps the guys who did the 6R4 engine which went on to power the XJ220 with some help from a couple of turbos. What configuration is the Nissan GTR's engine? I think the GTR's a straight six isn't it? Half the appeal of the Stratos for me is the noise the Dino v6 makes, it just wouldn't sound right with a v8 behind you no matter what it's out of. The other half is how gorgeous it is and how they perform. They don't need huge horse power, they're not a big heavy car. They're designed to change direction in a hurry, not reach top speed in no time.
To me they're the perfect car.
To me they're the perfect car.
Blib said:
ADM06 said:
I cannot for the life of me think of a v6 that makes decent power for its size. They are just by nature unbalanced and wobbly.
Well, there's opinion and then there's experience.
ADM06 said:
I cannot for the life of me think of a v6 that makes decent power for its size. They are just by nature unbalanced and wobbly.
Maserati Ghibli Cup - 330bhp from 2.0 litres - highest specific output (165bhp/litre) of any production engine at the time (mid nineties), held that until (I think) the FQ-400 was released.Challenge accepted.
Edited to add - the VAG VR6 / V6 FSI / V6 TFSI aren't exactly slackers either, and nor is the Ford Cyclone V6 - all anywhere from 250bhp to 300-plus.
Edited by masermartin on Sunday 22 July 11:20
ADM06 said:
I cannot for the life of me think of a v6 that makes decent power for its size. They are just by nature unbalanced and wobbly.
You are aware that a V6 engine has the best primary balance characteistics of any production engine when configured between 75 and 90 degrees in the V? Hardly a wobbly old knocker then.
Most Automotive applications of the V6 power plant have been chosen for their inherrant smothness and are generally fitted to models to which this characteristic is suited. Think Honda Legend
You may also wish to note that some of the most powerful engines ever used in Motorsport were the V6 turbo F1 engines and they are on their way back to that configuration for 2014.
Hope that clears up and missinformation you may have absorbed over the years
JSquaredJim said:
You are aware that a V6 engine has the best primary balance characteistics of any production engine when configured between 75 and 90 degrees in
the V? Hardly a wobbly old knocker then.
Most Automotive applications of the V6 power plant have been chosen for their inherrant smothness and are generally fitted to models to which this characteristic is suited. Think Honda Legend
You may also wish to note that some of the most powerful engines ever used in Motorsport were the V6 turbo F1 engines and they are on their way back to that configuration for 2014.
Hope that clears up and missinformation you may have absorbed over the years
So a v6 is better when designed to be one in the first place? Aren't most just v8's with two cylinders lopped off?the V? Hardly a wobbly old knocker then.
Most Automotive applications of the V6 power plant have been chosen for their inherrant smothness and are generally fitted to models to which this characteristic is suited. Think Honda Legend
You may also wish to note that some of the most powerful engines ever used in Motorsport were the V6 turbo F1 engines and they are on their way back to that configuration for 2014.
Hope that clears up and missinformation you may have absorbed over the years
Nobody will argue over which they'd prefer, if just for the sound alone.
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