RE: Chris Harris video: GT86 vs 370Z vs Cayman
Discussion
Cayman for me, but then I've always been a fan.
The new Toyota sounds great and I'd love to drive one, but I don't have any desire to own one. I feel exactly the same about the Nissan GTR.
Also I don't like the suggestion that because the Porsche has done a few miles you will absolutely need to spend big money on major engine and gearbox work. Just because a few have required these kind of repairs, and their owners have bleated about it everywhere on the internet the vast majority have not and will not need this kind of work doing.
With any older car, yes you do have to consider higher running costs. However this is mainly tyres brakes, suspension components, bushes, and bearings That kind of thing, an extra few hundred ££ here and there, nothing that will break the bank.
The new Toyota sounds great and I'd love to drive one, but I don't have any desire to own one. I feel exactly the same about the Nissan GTR.
Also I don't like the suggestion that because the Porsche has done a few miles you will absolutely need to spend big money on major engine and gearbox work. Just because a few have required these kind of repairs, and their owners have bleated about it everywhere on the internet the vast majority have not and will not need this kind of work doing.
With any older car, yes you do have to consider higher running costs. However this is mainly tyres brakes, suspension components, bushes, and bearings That kind of thing, an extra few hundred ££ here and there, nothing that will break the bank.
y2blade said:
Tough call between the two Japs imho.
Great Vid Chris
Great Vid Chris
Have you actually watched the video?
kentmotorcompany said:
Cayman for me, but then I've always been a fan.
The new Toyota sounds great and I'd love to drive one, but I don't have any desire to own one. I feel exactly the same about the Nissan GTR.
Also I don't like the suggestion that because the Porsche has done a few miles you will absolutely need to spend big money on major engine and gearbox work. Just because a few have required these kind of repairs, and their owners have bleated about it everywhere on the internet the vast majority have not and will not need this kind of work doing.
With any older car, yes you do have to consider higher running costs. However this is mainly tyres brakes, suspension components, bushes, and bearings That kind of thing, an extra few hundred ££ here and there, nothing that will break the bank.
The thing is you can pick up an 09 plate Cayman S with minimal mileage for the same £25-28k as the Gt86 anyway, so the fact that he used an older higher mileage car as the comparison is meaningless.The new Toyota sounds great and I'd love to drive one, but I don't have any desire to own one. I feel exactly the same about the Nissan GTR.
Also I don't like the suggestion that because the Porsche has done a few miles you will absolutely need to spend big money on major engine and gearbox work. Just because a few have required these kind of repairs, and their owners have bleated about it everywhere on the internet the vast majority have not and will not need this kind of work doing.
With any older car, yes you do have to consider higher running costs. However this is mainly tyres brakes, suspension components, bushes, and bearings That kind of thing, an extra few hundred ££ here and there, nothing that will break the bank.
Edited by SWoll on Wednesday 15th August 20:52
In the 'What would you buy as your only car for £20k?' on Sunday...
MSTRBKR said:
Love them. Would have a Cayman all day long.Dave Hedgehog said:
err i think you find he avoided the obvious magazine group test (ie GT86 v renault cup whatever) and put 2 cars that we on the forum keep referring to
Are you seriously defending the use of used cars in a group test? In this group test?Do you honestly believe people going to the Toyota forecourt are debating a used Cayman? You obviously have no idea who this car is aimed at.
Another excellent video Chris 
I agree the GT86 should be celebrated, it certainly looks alive on the those roads, maybe the tyres are skinnier which is why it moves about a little? If so that can only be a good thing.
I struggle though with the price tag, especially when put next to a Cayman. As said, maybe it's slightly unfair, but hey, so is life, so it's the Cayman for me every time. 9/10 for the GT86, 10/10 for the Cayman.
I agree the GT86 should be celebrated, it certainly looks alive on the those roads, maybe the tyres are skinnier which is why it moves about a little? If so that can only be a good thing.
I struggle though with the price tag, especially when put next to a Cayman. As said, maybe it's slightly unfair, but hey, so is life, so it's the Cayman for me every time. 9/10 for the GT86, 10/10 for the Cayman.
Hi there
The GT86 is a great car, I've driven one, but it is way too slow, a standard Cayman or Boxster would muller it on a B-road or circuit let alone the S version.
Also a 55-56 plate Cayman can be had sub 20k with ease and Chris mentions the Toyota has a 5yr warranty, well you could buy 2yr warranty from Porsche at 2k which covers everything, its a Porsche warranty, so 4-5yr of Porsche warranty your looking at 25k in total. So same spend as GT86 and I bet in 4-5yrs time a GT86 is worth no more than a 10yr old Cayman S for around 12k.
GT86 is a great car, but is massively out matched by anything from Porsche in terms of ability and in driver feedback. Yes the GT86 might be more fun at lower speeds but if thats the case then just buy the none-S Cayman and you've still got a far superior package.
The GT86 is a great car, I've driven one, but it is way too slow, a standard Cayman or Boxster would muller it on a B-road or circuit let alone the S version.
Also a 55-56 plate Cayman can be had sub 20k with ease and Chris mentions the Toyota has a 5yr warranty, well you could buy 2yr warranty from Porsche at 2k which covers everything, its a Porsche warranty, so 4-5yr of Porsche warranty your looking at 25k in total. So same spend as GT86 and I bet in 4-5yrs time a GT86 is worth no more than a 10yr old Cayman S for around 12k.
GT86 is a great car, but is massively out matched by anything from Porsche in terms of ability and in driver feedback. Yes the GT86 might be more fun at lower speeds but if thats the case then just buy the none-S Cayman and you've still got a far superior package.
Dagnut said:
Dave Hedgehog said:
err i think you find he avoided the obvious magazine group test (ie GT86 v renault cup whatever) and put 2 cars that we on the forum keep referring to
Are you seriously defending the use of used cars in a group test? In this group test?Do you honestly believe people going to the Toyota forecourt are debating a used Cayman? You obviously have no idea who this car is aimed at.
Dagnut said:
Dave Hedgehog said:
err i think you find he avoided the obvious magazine group test (ie GT86 v renault cup whatever) and put 2 cars that we on the forum keep referring to
Are you seriously defending the use of used cars in a group test? In this group test?Do you honestly believe people going to the Toyota forecourt are debating a used Cayman? You obviously have no idea who this car is aimed at.
way to slow for me ofc
Why Don't you try taking an objective view of the product, which is what a decent journalist should do, try and rub 2 brain cells together and figure out who the car is aimed at?
NO the majority of us wouldn't buy a GT86 over a Cayman but you are not the market.
The rear seat in the GT86 , which he doesn't even mention, make a huge difference to the desirability and usability of the Toyota...low emissions....good mpg and most importantly;y lower insurance
NO the majority of us wouldn't buy a GT86 over a Cayman but you are not the market.
The rear seat in the GT86 , which he doesn't even mention, make a huge difference to the desirability and usability of the Toyota...low emissions....good mpg and most importantly;y lower insurance
If the GT86 had a sub 6 second 60 time I'd be in one now. It has everything I loved about my 968CS, but the reason for letting that go was the lack of outright oomph and the Toyota is slower. I just can't bring myself to do it. Yes it'd be nice while I got to know the car and I'm sure it would be supreme fun on the many B-roads around these parts, but I know that in 6 months time I'd be wishing it had another 100bhp and I'd end up full of remorse.
As soon as they release the inevitable turbo/supercharged version then temptation might get the better of me.
As soon as they release the inevitable turbo/supercharged version then temptation might get the better of me.
Dagnut said:
Why Don't you try taking an objective view of the product, which is what a decent journalist should do, try and rub 2 brain cells together and figure out who the car is aimed at?
NO the majority of use wouldn't buy the a GT86 over a Cayman but you are not the market.
The rear seat in the GT86 , which he doesn't even mention, make a huge difference to the desirability and usability of the Toyota...low emissions....good mpg and most importantly;y lower insurance
Practicality, low emisions, MPG, and the desirability of rear seats. For me the very cornerstones of any performance car purchase.NO the majority of use wouldn't buy the a GT86 over a Cayman but you are not the market.
The rear seat in the GT86 , which he doesn't even mention, make a huge difference to the desirability and usability of the Toyota...low emissions....good mpg and most importantly;y lower insurance
You should do your own video review, sounds like it would be riveting...
Pointless putting used cars against new ones as unless you deliberately pick duff ones the used cars will win every time as you are buying a car that cost far more a few years ago.
How does a GT86 or indeed a Cayman fare against my £5k 340bhp 1250kg RX7 - it's thirstier and rattles more but it's faster and (IMO) more fun and better looking.
and even the cheapest Cayman is 3x the price.
So you could have my RX7 and £10k spare for say a Boxster S and a Range Rover.
How does a GT86 or indeed a Cayman fare against my £5k 340bhp 1250kg RX7 - it's thirstier and rattles more but it's faster and (IMO) more fun and better looking.
and even the cheapest Cayman is 3x the price.
So you could have my RX7 and £10k spare for say a Boxster S and a Range Rover.
Out of these 3, the used Cayman S all the way for me please. Excellent video. If the GT86 had just a more poke then it would be less hard work when you're not wanting to ring it's neck to get anywhere quickly, somewhere around the 240hp NA, for the same price but another 100KG lighter.
Shame the M3 CSL only came with that hideous paddle shift transmission, for £20K a manual CSL would be near the top of the list for the money.
Shame the M3 CSL only came with that hideous paddle shift transmission, for £20K a manual CSL would be near the top of the list for the money.
I remember driving my wifes car, a low powered japanes car that was heralded as the saviour of fun driving. Loads of people bought them because they were great, but I wouldnt buy one for my own car as they were too slow, no matter how much rear end fun you had on roundabouts. The wife loved it.
Of course that was an MX5 - very similar in many ways, particularly the hype !
I need 4 seats in my weekend toy, but I also need that grinning feeling when i open the taps, so its not for me. I cant see many PH'ers buying them, except maybe for the wife.
Of course that was an MX5 - very similar in many ways, particularly the hype !
I need 4 seats in my weekend toy, but I also need that grinning feeling when i open the taps, so its not for me. I cant see many PH'ers buying them, except maybe for the wife.
Edited by LancerG on Wednesday 15th August 21:16
I do love the Drive videos, and yet this is the first I've watched where I've disagreed with the outcome. For me, the Cayman is a much better fun car than the 86, which always feels like it's trying too hard to be the cool kid. It's fun at first, and I giggled as much as anyone when I nailed the throttle to swing the car in a wide arc while the piped-in noise from the engine cried out in the cabin, and yet once that had subsided it felt more like a cheap trick than a serious attempt to break the mould.
I love feeling a car move around as much as anyone, and I too love the challenge of doing it in my 911, but the 86 left me wanting so much more. Not really more power, but a nicer cabin and an engine note that sounded less fake would be a good start. Some decent tyres would probably really make me like the car, but then it would grip more than designed and ruin the point of the car.
Even though I disagree with the outcome, it was still a really great video to watch. Thanks Chris & team.
I love feeling a car move around as much as anyone, and I too love the challenge of doing it in my 911, but the 86 left me wanting so much more. Not really more power, but a nicer cabin and an engine note that sounded less fake would be a good start. Some decent tyres would probably really make me like the car, but then it would grip more than designed and ruin the point of the car.
Even though I disagree with the outcome, it was still a really great video to watch. Thanks Chris & team.
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