RE: PH Fleet: Porsche Panamera Diesel

RE: PH Fleet: Porsche Panamera Diesel

Author
Discussion

RenesisEvo

3,602 posts

218 months

Thursday 23rd August 2012
quotequote all
fluffnik said:
RenesisEvo said:
Its the torque that accelerates the car, not the horsepower (the power being simply the rate at which the torque is made). Torque = inertia x angular acceleration (then resolve at the contact patch using Newton's 2nd law). But I really think this is starting to circle and I don't see value in continuing.
It's the torque at the wheel, as resolved, that counts, not at the flywheel...
That's what I said, I don't know if you are clarifying my point or 'correcting' me. However one of your posts superbly surmises the whole thing far better than I ever could manage.

E38Ross said:
What you've just explained, about gearing etc, proves my point, not yours. You seemingly were getting confused with torque at the flywheel not at the wheels.
I think I was getting confused generally (it was quite late after all). Basically there are several different ways to look at the same thing. But you rightly state that gearing and area under curve are largely ignored yet make quite a difference.

All this changes nothing about my desire to have a go in a Panamera.

Edited by RenesisEvo on Thursday 23 August 12:37

heebeegeetee

28,591 posts

247 months

Thursday 23rd August 2012
quotequote all
[redacted]

E38Ross

34,944 posts

211 months

Thursday 23rd August 2012
quotequote all
[redacted]

heebeegeetee

28,591 posts

247 months

Thursday 23rd August 2012
quotequote all
E38Ross said:
I always need to take a piss before the car needs a drink. The range in my car can be up to 700 miles of driven gingerly, but give me a shorter range V12 any day.
I guess diesels are really a young man's car. Old bds ain't got the range. smile

toppstuff

13,698 posts

246 months

Thursday 23rd August 2012
quotequote all
heebeegeetee said:
I guess diesels are really a young man's car. Old bds ain't got the range. smile
As one gets older, a small empty gin bottle is useful for such occasions.

My butler used his hip flask for years so as not to interrupt the journey.

E38Ross

34,944 posts

211 months

Thursday 23rd August 2012
quotequote all
heebeegeetee said:
E38Ross said:
I always need to take a piss before the car needs a drink. The range in my car can be up to 700 miles of driven gingerly, but give me a shorter range V12 any day.
I guess diesels are really a young man's car. Old bds ain't got the range. smile
rofl i'm not even 25!

heebeegeetee

28,591 posts

247 months

Thursday 23rd August 2012
quotequote all
E38Ross said:
rofl i'm not even 25!
Well, trust me, the range only gets smaller. smile

E38Ross

34,944 posts

211 months

Thursday 23rd August 2012
quotequote all
heebeegeetee said:
E38Ross said:
rofl i'm not even 25!
Well, trust me, the range only gets smaller. smile
hehe i do drink plenty of water though!

DonkeyApple

54,923 posts

168 months

Thursday 23rd August 2012
quotequote all
E38Ross said:
heebeegeetee said:
E38Ross said:
rofl i'm not even 25!
Well, trust me, the range only gets smaller. smile
hehe i do drink plenty of water though!
Well, there's the solution to your dilemma. Recycling. biggrin

splitpin

2,740 posts

197 months

Saturday 25th August 2012
quotequote all
So, in summary, the Plain Jane 'Absolute Angel In The Kitchen and Utter Tart In The Bedroom' that no man sets out to want, but that every man eventually comes to realise is pretty well spot-on.

That'll Do Nicely Then wink

ChrisRC

43 posts

193 months

Saturday 15th September 2012
quotequote all
GuyS. said:
Let me throw my 2 bob into the 'is the diesel Panamera slow' debate; I'm now in my 3rd year of owning a Panamera Turbo and I'm still very happy with the car, thanks for asking. Back in January when my car was in for its first 2yr/20k service I was lent a Panamera diesel as a courtesy car for the two days it took the OPC to change the oil in mine. Sure, the diesel lacks the frankly silly acceleration the turbo has, but at no point did I think it felt 'slow', the mid range punch was impressive. Whether that is down to torque or power you'll have to excuse my ignorance here, during my O level physics classes I used to sit next to a girl with wonderful charlies and generally my mind was on other things.

One more thing I will add, I actually preferred the ride of the diesel which was on 19" rims and standard springs compared with my turbo which has 20" wheels and clever self levelling air suspension etc.
Interesting...with the diesel, was it still funnier in the front?

MGJohn

10,203 posts

182 months

Saturday 15th September 2012
quotequote all
ChrisRC said:
GuyS. said:
Let me throw my 2 bob into the 'is the diesel Panamera slow' debate; I'm now in my 3rd year of owning a Panamera Turbo and I'm still very happy with the car, thanks for asking. Back in January when my car was in for its first 2yr/20k service I was lent a Panamera diesel as a courtesy car for the two days it took the OPC to change the oil in mine. Sure, the diesel lacks the frankly silly acceleration the turbo has, but at no point did I think it felt 'slow', the mid range punch was impressive. Whether that is down to torque or power you'll have to excuse my ignorance here, during my O level physics classes I used to sit next to a girl with wonderful charlies and generally my mind was on other things.

One more thing I will add, I actually preferred the ride of the diesel which was on 19" rims and standard springs compared with my turbo which has 20" wheels and clever self levelling air suspension etc.
Interesting...with the diesel, was it still funnier in the front?
I doubt it. Even funnier in the back though ... like all the others..
..
... wink



PGM

2,168 posts

248 months

Wednesday 26th September 2012
quotequote all
I'm going to add a bit of fuel to this debate and the way it's going I think I might be in for some flaming soon!

As you can see from my posts above, I was from a basic theoretical standpoint, a fan of this car.

I thought I'd back this up with a dose of reality and so left my 997.2 C2S with Porsche Reading this morning to have some things sorted out and took a 12 plate Panamera Diesel.

The car is well specced and I've done about 250 miles mixed driving today and I'm so far very impressed. However, I'll reserve final judgement until I hand it back tomorrow evening and let you all know.

I don't know the technicalities of it all but by 997 weighs around 1.5T and the Panamera around 2, 385bhp vs 250bhp but the car feels quick and handles very well. It doesn't feel a big car when you're driving it as opposed to looking at it!

More detail tomorrow!

PGM

2,168 posts

248 months

Friday 28th September 2012
quotequote all
As you may know, I like big driving holidays and will always take the car rather than fly if it’s remotely possible. For this reason I’ve always liked the idea of the Panamera, a true trans-continental sports saloon.

With the intrigue in my mind, I put my 997 in for some warranty work after our last Euro trip and took out a Panamera Diesel for a couple of days. I really enjoyed the change actually!

I’m afraid I didn’t take any photos of the actual car but I’m sure you all know what one looks like and if you don’t, here’s a similar one:





Interior Front:


The Panamera is a fantastic place to sit. For such a big car it cossets you with the high centre console and low driving position, very sports car like. It’s extremely comfortable and well appointed, you want for nothing.

Interior Rear:


Two individual seats, this obviously divides opinion and the potential usage of the car. For us it’s great with only two kids, the option of a middle seat probably wouldn’t have killed anyone! For me though, it makes the car that bit more special than your BMW, Mercedes etc and adds to the appeal. If I had another child though (God forbid!), I wouldn’t be as enthusiastic!

Rear passengers have fully independent and 3 way adjustable climate control each side just like the front together with heated seats and plenty of storage options. I believe you can even specify adjustable seats in the rear!
I can sit very comfortably in the rear with the front seat placed to my liking and I’m 6ft and on the larger side (powerfully built company director biggrin ) and enjoyed travelling in the back. The front seats are very narrow in the back which gives an exceptional view out of the front of the car also.

My 11 year old son however did point out that the piano black trim and all the buttons and flip out storage areas would be broken in no time between him and his 8 year old brother! Great!

The boot is a decent size and would just about fit our mad springer spaniel in it I reckon and some luggage but would be more than ample for just the family and touring luggage. The floor however is a little high and the threshold also a bit high leaving not much height in it to be honest. Perfectly useable though.

The powerplant is a 3.0 V6 turbo diesel which even at 250bhp is [and I can’t quite believe I’m saying this] is more than up to the job of hauling this beast around. Plenty of torque gives lots of shove and overtaking possibility. Make no mistake, this is not slow, I’d describe it as a quick car.

The gearbox, although perfectly matched to the car (8 speed tiptronic with paddle shift) is not my preference but works very well with the package. I would prefer a manual but suspect it would actually spoil the diesel version of the car.

Overall I did around 300 miles in the couple of days I had the car, half on the motorway, half on very narrow B roads. On the motorway, as expected it’s brilliant and my passengers also were impressed with it. I could also hustle it down bumpy, narrow b roads with ease, the car just shrinks around you.

Giving the car a good workout most of the time, we averaged over 36mpg which I think is awesome.
The big thing is this though. Would I replace my 911 with it?

I thought long and hard about this given my family situation. Both my boys want me to change from the 911 due to rear seat accommodation. My wife and I both prefer the 911 as a drive. Therefore we stick with the 911! The only rational reasoning I can apply to this is asking myself the question “Would I get up early at the weekend just to go for a drive?” 911 yes, Panamera I don’t think so.

If I’d tested this before I looked at the 997 after having had the 996 I would probably have bought it. Now the 997 is here, it’s a definite step up from the 996 and I’m glad I went that way now. It’s unbelievable to say it but it really is that close (with the caveat of my situation). Obviously as outright cars without any external factors it’s 911 every time!

Taking the example of a European tour, this Panamera makes a lot of sense. Getting on for 700 miles range, diesel being cheaper in Europe are difficult factors to ignore. However, for me it comes down to the fact that I need a pee every 150 miles and the rest of the mileage in this country, diesel is more expensive.

Therefore, impressive as the diesel is, it would be a manual V8 for me!

The answer to the whole conundrum though turned out to be obvious after two days thinking. When the Panamera reaches £25k in a couple of years, we get one to compliment the 997. Easy biggrin

edo

16,699 posts

264 months

Friday 28th September 2012
quotequote all
PGM said:
As you may know, I like big driving holidays and will always take the car rather than fly if it’s remotely possible. For this reason I’ve always liked the idea of the Panamera, a true trans-continental sports saloon.

With the intrigue in my mind, I put my 997 in for some warranty work after our last Euro trip and took out a Panamera Diesel for a couple of days. I really enjoyed the change actually!

I’m afraid I didn’t take any photos of the actual car but I’m sure you all know what one looks like and if you don’t, here’s a similar one:





Interior Front:


The Panamera is a fantastic place to sit. For such a big car it cossets you with the high centre console and low driving position, very sports car like. It’s extremely comfortable and well appointed, you want for nothing.

Interior Rear:


Two individual seats, this obviously divides opinion and the potential usage of the car. For us it’s great with only two kids, the option of a middle seat probably wouldn’t have killed anyone! For me though, it makes the car that bit more special than your BMW, Mercedes etc and adds to the appeal. If I had another child though (God forbid!), I wouldn’t be as enthusiastic!

Rear passengers have fully independent and 3 way adjustable climate control each side just like the front together with heated seats and plenty of storage options. I believe you can even specify adjustable seats in the rear!
I can sit very comfortably in the rear with the front seat placed to my liking and I’m 6ft and on the larger side (powerfully built company director biggrin ) and enjoyed travelling in the back. The front seats are very narrow in the back which gives an exceptional view out of the front of the car also.

My 11 year old son however did point out that the piano black trim and all the buttons and flip out storage areas would be broken in no time between him and his 8 year old brother! Great!

The boot is a decent size and would just about fit our mad springer spaniel in it I reckon and some luggage but would be more than ample for just the family and touring luggage. The floor however is a little high and the threshold also a bit high leaving not much height in it to be honest. Perfectly useable though.

The powerplant is a 3.0 V6 turbo diesel which even at 250bhp is [and I can’t quite believe I’m saying this] is more than up to the job of hauling this beast around. Plenty of torque gives lots of shove and overtaking possibility. Make no mistake, this is not slow, I’d describe it as a quick car.

The gearbox, although perfectly matched to the car (8 speed tiptronic with paddle shift) is not my preference but works very well with the package. I would prefer a manual but suspect it would actually spoil the diesel version of the car.

Overall I did around 300 miles in the couple of days I had the car, half on the motorway, half on very narrow B roads. On the motorway, as expected it’s brilliant and my passengers also were impressed with it. I could also hustle it down bumpy, narrow b roads with ease, the car just shrinks around you.

Giving the car a good workout most of the time, we averaged over 36mpg which I think is awesome.
The big thing is this though. Would I replace my 911 with it?

I thought long and hard about this given my family situation. Both my boys want me to change from the 911 due to rear seat accommodation. My wife and I both prefer the 911 as a drive. Therefore we stick with the 911! The only rational reasoning I can apply to this is asking myself the question “Would I get up early at the weekend just to go for a drive?” 911 yes, Panamera I don’t think so.

If I’d tested this before I looked at the 997 after having had the 996 I would probably have bought it. Now the 997 is here, it’s a definite step up from the 996 and I’m glad I went that way now. It’s unbelievable to say it but it really is that close (with the caveat of my situation). Obviously as outright cars without any external factors it’s 911 every time!

Taking the example of a European tour, this Panamera makes a lot of sense. Getting on for 700 miles range, diesel being cheaper in Europe are difficult factors to ignore. However, for me it comes down to the fact that I need a pee every 150 miles and the rest of the mileage in this country, diesel is more expensive.

Therefore, impressive as the diesel is, it would be a manual V8 for me!

The answer to the whole conundrum though turned out to be obvious after two days thinking. When the Panamera reaches £25k in a couple of years, we get one to compliment the 997. Easy biggrin
Good review, thanks.