RE: Spotted: Peugeot 309 GTI
Discussion
Marc H said:
I had one 20 yrs ago for 3 years as a company car at Mercury (those were fun days!). It was a white series 2, they had a much better dash and the more normal body-coloured spoiler. It was the best steer of any car I've ever had, mainly due to its lightness I guess....
Such fun to drive, comfortable ride as well. Downsides were noisiness (including squeaks and rattles), not the best brakes ...and relative thirst. But the only thing that went wrong was an early battery failure. The giant sliding sunroof was locked in place by vacuum, driven from the inlet manifold I think. Bizarre but worked, made an amazing noise when you pulled the lever.
I then got out of the company car scheme (for a while) and got a Citroen CX 22TRS, that was a good money pit.
Interesting reading all the reminiscing about the 205s ugly sister. I certainly remember the sunroof hiss when you closed it down as Marc H mentions Such fun to drive, comfortable ride as well. Downsides were noisiness (including squeaks and rattles), not the best brakes ...and relative thirst. But the only thing that went wrong was an early battery failure. The giant sliding sunroof was locked in place by vacuum, driven from the inlet manifold I think. Bizarre but worked, made an amazing noise when you pulled the lever.
I then got out of the company car scheme (for a while) and got a Citroen CX 22TRS, that was a good money pit.
My time with a 309Gti probably came about because of the little 205Gti below in the mid 80s
One of my friends got a B-reg 1.6gti only a couple of years old to start with - it was the early 105bhp engine but we could all recognize it was a proper little driver's car. Very different to rwd Escorts and Sunbeams but nicely trimmable on the throttle all the same
As the months progressed we all got wind of the forthcoming 1.9 version - One hundred and thirty brake horse power!
Might seem a little lame now but when you're 20 years old this seemed tremendous in a small 205 sized/weight car. One of my friends got his order in and got the first one available from the local Telford dealer. We all went down to help him take delivery - the half-leather seats, the lovely 15" alloys, the SMELL of a new car..............
Plus after it was run in that distinctive smell from the hot engine bay and the lovely 'guzzling' noise from the exhaust at low revs as you pull off.
It was soon apparent that it was a particularly capable little car cross country especially in those trips to the Welsh Coast in the early hours of a summer Sunday morning. It had that extra bite that the 105bhp 1.6 didn't have, plus it seemed to have an even more lively rear end in extremis which you could 'play' with.
Soon another friend was hooked and, like the afore-mentioned buyer, earning good money as a mechanic with Mazda Rally Team, his order for a new 1.9 205 went in as well. I think it was a smidge under 10k for a new one back then. The demand for them was such that he had to wait a few months and didn't get it till the 'E' plates were out
I think soon about four of my friends had new or nearly new 1.9s. Having got a house they were out of my price-range but I did get to drive them quite often in exchange for a return drive in my old rwd car
I was quite tempted to get one myself.....................but one day my friend got a courtesy 309Gti whilst his 205 was in for a service. Bearing in mind how many cars he'd sold to us all the local Peugeot dealer told me to have a go in it as well. I did mention to him that with other outgoings I wasn't really in a position to afford a new car......but he insisted. To me, it seemed even better handling. Maybe not so twitchy over bumps but still the same keen engine and lovely steering ( only with power assistance ) and certainly the dealer demo seemed no slower than at least one of my friends' 205s
It wasn't long before a nice condition second-hand one came up ........and having had the Manta for a fair few years and really enjoyed it I decided it was time for a change
It was a good condition one with about 35000 miles and had just passed its first MOT - it was a great car on the Welsh B-roads and had a fair few good drives in tandem with the 205s, often heading up to the coast and running down Wales.
Here it is up by the Menai bridge looking fairly 'road-worn'
At the same time the mags were pouring praise on the car and I think at least one of my 205GTi owning friends would have gone for one if they could have got over the looks - a fact registered by old 'Performance Car' mag with the tagline to the article below
They also labelled it Peugeot's 'Best Handling Car' in their Knowledge section, which later got upgraded to the 'Best Handling Hot Hatch'
'Autocar' also did an article praising the handling compared to its brethren - certainly never felt short-changed following the 205s and although it carried an extra 80 kilos of weight over the 205, never noticed a shortfall in performance either.
'Performance Car' ran one as long-termer and it was the test mule for their 1991 Tyre Test
That certainly came in handy for selecting tyres and I ran mine on the Yokohamas they recommended, firstly in the proper 185/55 fitment and also in 195/50 size when I had trouble getting the 55 profiles.
'Autocar' also included it in their 1990 Annual Handling Day selection amongst the bigger, faster stuff. It won a fair amount of praise too.
They also included it in a fair few group tests against the faster hatches of its time where it did well on account of its handling
As mentioned in one of the earlier posts, 'CAR' pitted it against both variants of the GTi at the time
I liked the fact that Peugeot gave you a full set of instruments, oil temp and pressure and water temp. I never had any big problems with mine in 45000 miles and just over 3 years use. Just the usual stuff like tyres, oil and filter changes and brakes. Plus the battery just gave up without warning one cold winter's day. The rear remote opening quarter vents used to rattle slightly over broken tarmac but it was well worth opening them as the exhaust note was quite nice to listen when you were out for a bit of a drive. Had to buy a new engine undertray as the fittings bent when it came off one. Mine didn't really y ever suffer from the erratic idle either although I must admit I never did much town driving and it generally had a good run out most drives. One of us even bought the the special Peugeot sump plug key so oil changes weren't a hassle looking for the special adapter for your socket set.
One of my friends with a 1.9 205 moved onto a Williams partway through me owning the 309. Although it had a bit more straight line go I have to say I still preferred the 309 for handling - even he conceded that it was 'swings and roundabouts' after we had a swap and run up the Berwyns. The Peugeot had a lovely flow through fast bends and you could even bring the tail into play with it if you had a little lift and then got back on the power. Never quite as severe as in the 205s I drove though
Good as it was, I still enjoyed a rwd fun car and thanks to the Peugeot not costing me much through my ownership stint I was able to buy a rumbly V6 for an alternative driving experience. I can remember one of the mechanics at Peugeot Talbot Sport telliing us 80K miles was a good point to swap the Gtis in at, as although they would soldier on provided you spent money on them, this figure was often the point when they miight need several more expensive jobs doing.....especially if they'd been driven quite hard.....and I knew we were all guilty of that.
I ran both cars for a fair few months as I enjoyed them both but in the end after 3 years of good fun I sold the 309 on. It's rare to see them anymore ( although I do see a Goodwood quite regularly ) and it looks like mine came to an end in the early part of the new millenium. I often wonder if the subsequent owners enjoyed their time with it as much as I did.
Hope the new owner of Woody's car enjoys their new purchase
Edited by s m on Saturday 8th September 19:12
Edited by s m on Saturday 8th September 20:03
TheDoggingFather said:
Chris944_S2 said:
Such a shame the 309 GTI16 was LHD only. 160 horses and less than a ton, even by todays standards it not slow.
Yeah, a real shame. I'd love an Mi powered 309.I'd love a 309 GTI. I'm sure the values will go up once nice 205s go from a bit steep to stupidly expensive, as will no doubt happen.
Great write up, btw.
Chris71 said:
TheDoggingFather said:
Chris944_S2 said:
Such a shame the 309 GTI16 was LHD only. 160 horses and less than a ton, even by todays standards it not slow.
Yeah, a real shame. I'd love an Mi powered 309.I'd love a 309 GTI. I'm sure the values will go up once nice 205s go from a bit steep to stupidly expensive, as will no doubt happen.
Great write up, btw.
Great post, i still have some of scanned magazines. Regarding 205, 309, 405, all models, including most mundane models had similar handling and ride combo. For example 405 1.6 with its lighter engine in the front and slightly softer setup, had even more sudden lift off oversteer than 205 Gti. Great to drive at normal driving, but at the limit responding 100 percent(unlike todays squashy, anodyne cars). Even later 106 and 306, despite having great feel, have been indirect by comparison to that generation. And one should have taken good care about not having significant difference between front and rear tyres.
hotmelt said:
Regarding 205, 309, 405, all models, including most mundane models had similar handling and ride combo. For example 405 1.6 with its lighter engine in the front and slightly softer setup, had even more sudden lift off oversteer than 205 Gti.
Yes a friend owned an early C-reg 1.3 309. It had the same sort of 'feel' when taking it through some bends as the bigger engined cars.Here we are just getting it up to standard after purchase
bob1179 said:
I'm sure I can do that. It won't be for a few weeks though as the car is about 600 miles from me and is being collected and stored by a friend of mine until I can fly down and collect it.
I think the drive back will be a good story to start with! I'll have to take a few cassettes with me so have something to listen to on the way up.
The last time a drove a 309 GTi was way back in 1998, it was a three door, 'F' registered car with 75,000 miles on the clock and funnily enough the dealer wanted £1700 for it. I couldn't afford it back then but compared to my own 1.1 GE it was a real experience. It'll be interesting to see how rose tinted my spectacles are!
Enjoy it, you've done well there. Just be sure to keep pouring money into it whenever it asks and you'll probably get it all back when you sell. In the meantime you'll get to drive one of the finest handling road cars pretty much ever. Seems a great trade!I think the drive back will be a good story to start with! I'll have to take a few cassettes with me so have something to listen to on the way up.
The last time a drove a 309 GTi was way back in 1998, it was a three door, 'F' registered car with 75,000 miles on the clock and funnily enough the dealer wanted £1700 for it. I couldn't afford it back then but compared to my own 1.1 GE it was a real experience. It'll be interesting to see how rose tinted my spectacles are!
I had an F-reg 1.3 GLX five door in the same charcoal colour as the one in the autocar test, with the same red striped bumpers (but not the door trims). I loved that car, it was the first car I had that wasn't a British Leyland banger.
A distant and dodgy relative was selling a red three door 309 GTi from his garage premises. Against my better judgement, I bought it - I didn't really trust him, but I really wanted that car. I drove it from Manchester to where I lived in the lake district, via some great driving roads. Loved it. Got it home, and as I pulled into the courtyard of the place I was living, it caught fire!
Got my car and my money back, but have always fancied owning another. I ended up trading my 309 GLX in for an N-reg 306 XSi when I got a proper job.
A distant and dodgy relative was selling a red three door 309 GTi from his garage premises. Against my better judgement, I bought it - I didn't really trust him, but I really wanted that car. I drove it from Manchester to where I lived in the lake district, via some great driving roads. Loved it. Got it home, and as I pulled into the courtyard of the place I was living, it caught fire!
Got my car and my money back, but have always fancied owning another. I ended up trading my 309 GLX in for an N-reg 306 XSi when I got a proper job.
I didn't know that the early ones had tailgates without window frames. I've learnt something. I've only been in a heavily modified Mi16 engined one. There was a red lower spec. Mk2 in the family that looked to be in great condition body wise, though an overweight passenger may have led to the early demise of a rear shock.
s m said:
Yes a friend owned an early C-reg 1.3 309. It had the same sort of 'feel' when taking it through some bends as the bigger engined cars.
Here we are just getting it up to standard after purchase
Fantastic write up above s m. I really enjoyed it.Here we are just getting it up to standard after purchase
That view above brings back memories! I had the 1.1 with the same (but smaller capacity) OHV Talbot-Simca engine. If memory serves me correct the 1.1 was an E1A engine whilst the 1.3 was G1A. They were absolutely bullet proof, even if they sounded like a shaking metal tin full of bolts. I think I did about 45,000 miles in my little 1.1 with no issues whatsoever.
CampDavid said:
Enjoy it, you've done well there. Just be sure to keep pouring money into it whenever it asks and you'll probably get it all back when you sell. In the meantime you'll get to drive one of the finest handling road cars pretty much ever. Seems a great trade!
Cheers.I already have plans to sort any issues on the car as soon as I get it. Full suspension refresh, once over on the engine. I'll stick it in the 'shop and whip the front and rear ends off to touch up any corrosion under the plastic bits.
Can't beat a bit of proper Pug goodness.
bob1179 said:
s m said:
Yes a friend owned an early C-reg 1.3 309. It had the same sort of 'feel' when taking it through some bends as the bigger engined cars.
Here we are just getting it up to standard after purchase
Fantastic write up above s m. I really enjoyed it.Here we are just getting it up to standard after purchase
That view above brings back memories! I had the 1.1 with the same (but smaller capacity) OHV Talbot-Simca engine. If memory serves me correct the 1.1 was an E1A engine whilst the 1.3 was G1A. They were absolutely bullet proof, even if they sounded like a shaking metal tin full of bolts. I think I did about 45,000 miles in my little 1.1 with no issues whatsoever.
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